Non competion games

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paul319
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Non competion games

Post by paul319 » Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:30 pm

Hi

I have been playing these rules for sometime now and they are my favourite for English Civil War games (currently the only period I play that are covered by the rules). I have never been a competition player (but I do enjoy the AAR's particularly those from Madaxman) and was wondering what people think about how they work for scenario driven games or refighting historical battles?

On the same subject I know it says in the rulebook that an army will typically consist of 10-15 battle groups but again I was wondering if in peoples experience there was an upper limit to the number of battle groups that when reached the rules simply 'break' or do not work (hope that makes sense)?

Grateful for your thoughts.

Cheers Paul

kevinj
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Re: Non competion games

Post by kevinj » Sun Nov 09, 2014 7:58 pm

The rules work best for games between historical opponents so scenario/historical games work well.

Regarding size, if you get over 1000 points a side you'll need a bigger table than 6x4 and once you get over 18-20 BGs a side you will have trouble with command if you only have 4 generals.

ravenflight
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Re: Non competion games

Post by ravenflight » Sun Nov 09, 2014 8:34 pm

Added to what Kevin said, you MAY also run into difficulty of the 'impossible to break army', especially if you have one side with a cast of thousands and the other side not.

For example, one of my regular opponents runs an army with 16 or 18 BG's. You can demolish a large portion of his army and be so exhausted that he actually wins the game :)

It's great for comp games, but you may wish to play around with some 'scenario rules' to avoid this situation.

If you wanted to get really big, you could play it as 2 or 3 smaller battles. So, let's say you have an 1800ap historical battle, have 3 'Commanders' each in charge of 600AP which can have sub commanders. You then can break 1/3 of the army by getting one section above their break point. The remaining 2/3 would then have to fight on... hopefully breaking the other part of the army before the victorious 'wing' arrives.

So, you may play Marston Moor with 2 'mounted wings' and 1 P&S 'wing' each about 600 AP. The Parliament foot get destroyed by 1/2 of their number going rout/frag etc... can the Ironsides destroy the Cavaliers before the Royalist foot swing around on their flank?

In the above you would conceivably have up to 12 commanders on the field. Be great for multi-player (and would look GREAT)

gibby
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Re: Non competion games

Post by gibby » Sun Nov 09, 2014 11:48 pm

I second that , the rules really work well in period and are fine for scenario/multi-player games.
I actually prefer not loading extra generals unless the armies are really huge so actually 4 generals makes for a good game right up to circa 1200 points.

I don't know if the below still works when pasted but we had a pretty good multi-player game at MK a couple of years ago and all done in 4 hours normal club night.
cheers
Jim

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPCeslNuo64

grahambriggs
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Re: Non competion games

Post by grahambriggs » Mon Nov 10, 2014 12:09 pm

I would expect the rules to work very well for historical battles. Generally, the design seems based on the need to get the important historical interactions correct. In terms of getting more troops on the table that's generally a good thing. Both from the look of the battle and also the more units you have on the table the less benefit there is in redeploying troops to gain an advantage.

Generally, competition games often have too many generals for the number of battle groups; as generals are good value. In a normal competition game with a 6 foot by 4 foot table, a great commander's influence can cover a lot of the table, which seems a bit rich to me - probably why they are quite common in competition armies. A larger table with more troops will clip his wings a bit.

Of course, games will take longer with more battle groups on the table; set up time is longer for a start. But in terms of reaching a conclusion you should be fine as long as you don't put in too many units of skirmishers or dragoons

Vespasian28
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Re: Non competion games

Post by Vespasian28 » Mon Nov 10, 2014 11:06 pm

We just re-fought Nordinglen at the club on Saturday with 2-2500 points per side. The Swedes had 29 BG's and we were worried that 4 commanders may not have been enough but it worked out fine. No idea how many BG's the Spanish/Imperialists had but they kept coming on the table at various times like a plague of locusts.
We did better than the Swedes did historically, taking all three redoubts on the Allbuch, but as the day wore you could see they were in trouble due to the waves of re-enforcements.
Having done Lutzen as well as Flodden FOGR defintely works for historical scenarios. Next up Edgehill in February.

pyruse
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Re: Non competion games

Post by pyruse » Tue Nov 11, 2014 11:41 am

We've used FoG for quite a few ECW refights - it works well.

paul319
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Re: Non competion games

Post by paul319 » Wed Nov 12, 2014 8:18 am

Hi

Many thanks for the interesting replies. It would also interesting to know how you scaled the number of BG's against the actual number of troops involved and the size of table used.

Thanks Again, Paul

ravenflight
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Re: Non competion games

Post by ravenflight » Thu Nov 13, 2014 5:44 am

paul319 wrote:Hi

Many thanks for the interesting replies. It would also interesting to know how you scaled the number of BG's against the actual number of troops involved and the size of table used.

Thanks Again, Paul
Nothing better than 1:1.

You said you wanted big right? :)

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