First go at Italian Wars

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Erik08
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First go at Italian Wars

Post by Erik08 » Fri Nov 02, 2018 6:25 pm

Hello all
This is my first post on this forum. Last night we had our first go at Italian Wars using Field of Glory. We played 600 points French against Maximillian Imperials. The Germans had two large Landsknecht groups and two MAA groups The French had a large Swiss pike group and three superior gendarms. Plus some firepower for both armies of course. Not surprisingly the French quickly controlled the flanks and the pike units locked in combat. The French had pretty much destroyed all the Germans except for the Landsknecht groups. However, this was not enough to break them. They tried charging a gerdarm group unit the side of one of the Landsknecht but they were broken right away. When the Swiss ran it was all over for the French who had looked to be on the winning side most of the game.

I gather from this first game that you can't win without breaking at least one of your opponent's big pike groups. This is fine with me and I liked the long slugfest the pike boys had in the middle of the battlefield before the Swiss finally broke, but it does kind of make the flank combat a bit indifferent! Have I got it totally wrong or is this pretty much how it goes?

I look very much forward to my next game. I am just trying to get my head around the basic tactics.

Cheers
Erik

madaxeman
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Re: First go at Italian Wars

Post by madaxeman » Fri Nov 02, 2018 11:53 pm

The Kiels count as 4 break points each, the normal sized units count as 2 - so you should usually be able to break an army without breaking its (only) Kiel. At 600 AP your Kiels will be a bigger chunk of the army, but it still should be possible to break the rest and win.

Here's a game from only a couple of weeks ago where a French Italian Wars army at 700 points goes down because most of its support units are taken down even though 2 Swiss Kiels are still intact at the end (spoiler alert!) https://www.madaxeman.com/reports/Oxford_2018_3.php

If the Kiel is engaged to the front, hitting it in the side does have some negative impacts on its fighting ability, but not all that much - that's kinda what Kiels are good at TBH.
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Erik08
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Re: First go at Italian Wars

Post by Erik08 » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:55 am

Hello Madaxeman
Thank you for your answer. Interresting AAR. I have never tried this sort of game, but it look like in interesting game where the oldre French army had an actual chance of winning. I have set up a new game where the French have fewer gendarm and two keil instead. The germans are pretty much the same. Lets see how that goes.

I have one question. Can commanders with a group rally it while its in combat? From the rule text it sounds like it but I am not totally sure and in most other games you cant rally while fighting.

cheers
Erik

madaxeman
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Re: First go at Italian Wars

Post by madaxeman » Tue Nov 06, 2018 9:13 am

In FoGR you can attempt to rally once per turn. This happens in the end phase of each players turn (JAP?) so you can in effecty have 2 attempts at rallying each time you move (end of your move/turn and end of your opponents move/turn).

The only caveat is that you can't rally in the same (player) turn in which you drop a level of cohesion.

Being in melee is no restriction, you just need to have a general with the unit (which does limit your ability to rally everyone somewhat anyway).
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Erik08
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More Italian Wars;CANNONS

Post by Erik08 » Sat Nov 10, 2018 6:58 pm

I am trying out various army compositions for my self to see what workes. Recently I fielded a German army with six fieldguns in two battlegroups behind fortification. Each battlegroup was supported by a unit landsknechts and flanked by handgunners also behind fortifications. The French fielded their usual Swiss pikekeils and gendarms. The Swiss got completely smashed up before they reached the artillery line and the German cavalry was able to hold on to one flank while the other was filled with difficult terrain. The French simply couldn't get to grips with enough of the German army to break it while at all time it was under a deadly fire

I know the French could just do the same, but it doesn't seem their style and would be a waste of good Swiss. Besides they can't field fortifications.

My question here is what to do in this situation. The range of the guns means the French can't avoid them. They have to assault. Does anyone have experience with this situation?

Cheers
Erik

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Re: First go at Italian Wars

Post by madaxeman » Fri Nov 16, 2018 4:05 am

Why would you choose to frontally assault a fortified line of guns supported by the enemy's best infantry? That's not clever historically, nor in game terms :-)

6 Guns is an enormous amount of points locked into one spot. You can avoid them if you try hard enough. Avoid them, move your Kiels to outside their arc of fire. Attack the cavalry on the open flank, or just attack the rest of the army.

Also, buy some good generals and skirmishers to win initiative and have better control over terrain to make the battle more open...
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Re: First go at Italian Wars

Post by Erik08 » Sat Dec 01, 2018 4:20 pm

Thanks for the advice. My brief experience tells me that deployment in this game is extremely important. Because movent is slow and heavy I often end up charging something I don't want because of poor deployment.

I am still struggling with the terrain. I always seem to find that the pieces I placed myself end up getting in my way.

I still find the French rather hard to master. The Germans usually only field poorly equipped MMA and use them to hunt light infantry and artillery so their gendarms often end up with no one to fight. Elite Swiss are die hard, but can still lose to superior landsknechts. As the French historically relied on gendarms this is also my main plan. I know they more often than not ended up losing with this tactic, but someone must have thought it was a good idea at some point. I will at least give it a few more tries.


Cheers
Erik

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