Italian campaign

A forum to discuss custom scenarios, campaigns and modding in general.

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ruskicanuk
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Great Campaign

Post by ruskicanuk » Mon Oct 10, 2011 12:19 am

Great job making this. It is very well balanced, interesting and lots of fun. Kudos!

nikivdd
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Post by nikivdd » Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:57 am

update v0.6 (29/10/11)
have fun :)
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nikivdd
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Post by nikivdd » Tue Nov 01, 2011 11:11 am

update v0.61 (01/11/11)

have fun :)
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nikivdd
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Post by nikivdd » Tue Nov 01, 2011 9:31 pm

Update v.062 for v1.04!

All info -> first window ;)
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VPaulus
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Post by VPaulus » Wed Nov 02, 2011 2:48 pm

Is it with me only, or your custom units have not a sound when moving?
it's like if it's not loading the efx file.However if I enable Real Sound Mod with Generic Mod Enabler, I hear all the sounds of the mod. It seems a bug in the new campaign mod system.
I'm expecting that with this new campaign mod system, that the combination of mods is killed or at least if people who would want to use those cosmetics mods would have to copy the files to each campaign mod folder.

nikivdd
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Post by nikivdd » Wed Nov 02, 2011 3:18 pm

VPaulus wrote:Is it with me only, or your custom units have not a sound when moving?
it's like if it's not loading the efx file.However if I enable Real Sound Mod with Generic Mod Enabler, I hear all the sounds of the mod. It seems a bug in the new campaign mod system.
I'm expecting that with this new campaign mod system, that the combination of mods is killed or at least if people who would want to use those cosmetics mods would have to copy the files to each campaign mod folder.
It appears that the new mod system is not up to par with everything yet.
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Uhu
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Post by Uhu » Fri Nov 04, 2011 10:05 pm

First of all: thank you nikivdd this wonderful campaign and the lot of work, you did with it!
(And excuse also my not fully correct english, because I'm also not a native english speaker :oops: )

I'm playing your campaign since several days and the overall experience is really good!
- Theme: unique (not germans but italians) and therefore great
- Regions of operations: same as above
- Units: nice to play with weaker units - gameplay is much harder
- Maps: I played to Mareth (just began) - see later...

I must say first, I play it with Rommel mode, so the campaign is really hard (what is good! :D )! I most times have to use all units, take care also on not-core units, bgecause their help are well needed, if I want to make a decisive victory. Allthrough, as I experimenced (also in the main german campaing), in Rommel mode, there is not prestige-difference between decisive and minor victory :( .
It is really great - but hard - that I need to think, what I will upgrade, refill or buy or sell to earn a few prestige. Even one buy of a given unit can be decisive of the outcome of a battle.
I also experimenced, that my units are very vulnerable and therefore I have to take extra care of them - even then can happen, that I lost one of them. I think, it is because the AI is much more agressive, than in the original german campaign. Here even it lefts save positions (well entrenched in a city) to attack my units.

Now, before the deeper analysis of the scenarios, let's say also, what I don't like in the campaign:
the unhistorical aspect. It's clear, that it has big fun to play "what if" scenarios. But for me, encountering so many german units - also as SE units - in the first period of italian war activity, is too much. Fighting Poland with italians takes the feeling. Using units, which should be still not on the battlefield (for example: M14/41 at the Mareth scenario) is also fun-lowering. Of cause, it is your right to make the campaign, as you want, but I like more the concept to stay mostly on historical tracks, where you can make different historical outcomes through good strategy and decisive victories - at the late stage of the campaign. Of cause decisice victories can also be promoted with more prestige, bonus scenarios or better cicumstances (like more non-core units) at a given scenario.

Now the deeper analysis of the yet played scenarios:
- Elba: nice, little, beginning scn. Only negative, that you cannot make a decisive victory without having big losses. The enemy is really agressive and you have not the room to manouver him out. Maybe not on Rommel mode, it is no problem to replace the losses easily, but at Rommel, you have to always save. :)

- Malaga: nice map, good theme, good gameplay. Made it secondly decisive - first I also made it, but the losses were to big. It is also nice, that you have to be smart with your small navy to successfully aid your land units. Unsuspected enemy counterattack makes the scenario harder and even more enjoyable.

- Albania: a real hard one!! :) Having bulgarian and romanian allies gives to the scenario much more fun. Navy fight is the same interesting and good as at Malaga, but here is it even more critical to keep intact your ships. A tried it many times. The solution was, that I sold some weak (it inf) and depleted units and bought a level bomber, which massacred the navy of the enemy and bought even more 149mm gun. Even that way I could make a decisive win with core loss and big point losses in my units. After that, I tried again - losses were than not so big, but could only made a minor victory. The unsuspected enemy counterattack is also fun, and makes this scenario also even harder.

- Warsaw: not liked to fight so unhistorically against the polish army, but the scenario is a masterpice. It is extreme hard. Even, that I played it so many times and takes extreme care of my units, I lost a core unit, but I still was happy to make it decisive. 8) Also very nice, that it happens not always the same, so you have to also change your tactics rapidly ingame.
Aftermarch briefing: it is strange to read that Italy will need Germany's help later badly - how can the speaker know that? It would be better: It can happen, that Italy will need Germany's help later also.

- Nice: a little easier, as the earlier ones, but after so hard battles, I was thankful for that! :) Maybe I also had luck and had more rutine, but I could make it at the first try and even could harvest some extra experience and prestige for my troops. But this scenario is also good, nothing has to be changed - anyway, it is good, that there are sometimes easier, "relax-scenarios", where the player can rest. Like Norway or Kiev in the original campgain, for example.

- Mareth (not yet finished): not likes the german and spanish help - scenario could also go with only italian (core and non-core) units. The size of the scenario is also a little bit too big for me: to big map, to much units, to many turns. Strategy goes a little background, while logistics comes in foreground.


So far I must say (not because I want to be kind, but because I think it is the fact), you are a very talented map and scenario maker. The italian campaing is almost as fun (sometimes even better :oops: ) as the original german campaign. When it could be more historical - not fully, as I earlier wrote -, thant I would be fully happy.

Uhu
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Post by Uhu » Fri Nov 04, 2011 10:35 pm

Oh yes, I forgot to write about the experimences with patch 1.04:
- when I copy the 0.62 italian campaing there, where it should, than I can choose it from customs campaings, but the saved games will be not be loaded.
- After I intalled it again with jsgme, it worked well.

nikivdd
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Post by nikivdd » Sat Nov 05, 2011 7:56 pm

First of all: thank you nikivdd this wonderful campaign and the lot of work, you did with it!
Thank you. You don't want to know how many hours i put in this project :)
'm playing your campaign since several days and the overall experience is really good!
- Theme: unique (not germans but italians) and therefore great
- Regions of operations: same as above
- Units: nice to play with weaker units - gameplay is much harder
- Maps: I played to Mareth (just began) - see later...
I always liked playing with the Italians or axis minors in general.

I must say first, I play it with Rommel mode, so the campaign is really hard (what is good! Very Happy )! I most times have to use all units, take care also on not-core units, bgecause their help are well needed, if I want to make a decisive victory. Allthrough, as I experimenced (also in the main german campaing), in Rommel mode, there is not prestige-difference between decisive and minor victory Sad .
It is really great - but hard - that I need to think, what I will upgrade, refill or buy or sell to earn a few prestige. Even one buy of a given unit can be decisive of the outcome of a battle.
I also experimenced, that my units are very vulnerable and therefore I have to take extra care of them - even then can happen, that I lost one of them. I think, it is because the AI is much more agressive, than in the original german campaign. Here even it lefts save positions (well entrenched in a city) to attack my units.
Some players were asking to make it harder, althou when i first started, i wanted to make it a campaign for beginners (now you gave me an idea!)
Prestige got tighter for sure.
The enemy who is entrenched in a city is allowed to leave and attack if they see an attack possibility (like unprotected weak units). (hold position (active) setting)
Now, before the deeper analysis of the scenarios, let's say also, what I don't like in the campaign:
the unhistorical aspect. It's clear, that it has big fun to play "what if" scenarios. But for me, encountering so many german units - also as SE units - in the first period of italian war activity, is too much. Fighting Poland with italians takes the feeling. Using units, which should be still not on the battlefield (for example: M14/41 at the Mareth scenario) is also fun-lowering. Of cause, it is your right to make the campaign, as you want, but I like more the concept to stay mostly on historical tracks, where you can make different historical outcomes through good strategy and decisive victories - at the late stage of the campaign. Of cause decisice victories can also be promoted with more prestige, bonus scenarios or better cicumstances (like more non-core units) at a given scenario.
I had lots of remarks of the unhistorical aspect. I never pretended it is historical and it will never be. I lack the time for that. But nonetheless i released the campaign, it is open to every player on this board and i wasn't looking for excuses not to share it or looking for excuses to postpone release dates.

The German SE units (only 3 by the way) are a small compensation for the lack of good italian tanks. (also by player demand)

The M14/41 is from the vanilla part of the equipment file, i didn't alter it (or i must have forgotten it lol).

I'm still learning to present something "playable" and i have not been thinking of different paths in a campaign tree. I prefer to walk first instead of running. Even if i would consider to create a more complicated campaign tree, i will not to do it alone anymore.

Personally, prestige allocation is one of the most difficult things in the aspect of making a campaign. But there is something, like you did, called feedback.

Now the deeper analysis of the yet played scenarios:
- Elba: nice, little, beginning scn. Only negative, that you cannot make a decisive victory without having big losses. The enemy is really agressive and you have not the room to manouver him out. Maybe not on Rommel mode, it is no problem to replace the losses easily, but at Rommel, you have to always save. Smile
Elba was my first attempt to create a scenario and for nostalgia reasons, i haven't removed it while i'm continuing developing this campaign.
- Malaga: nice map, good theme, good gameplay. Made it secondly decisive - first I also made it, but the losses were to big. It is also nice, that you have to be smart with your small navy to successfully aid your land units. Unsuspected enemy counterattack makes the scenario harder and even more enjoyable.
Malaga wasn't so terrific in the beginning. But i changed a thing or two and i think it is much better now.
- Albania: a real hard one!! Smile Having bulgarian and romanian allies gives to the scenario much more fun. Navy fight is the same interesting and good as at Malaga, but here is it even more critical to keep intact your ships. A tried it many times. The solution was, that I sold some weak (it inf) and depleted units and bought a level bomber, which massacred the navy of the enemy and bought even more 149mm gun. Even that way I could make a decisive win with core loss and big point losses in my units. After that, I tried again - losses were than not so big, but could only made a minor victory. The unsuspected enemy counterattack is also fun, and makes this scenario also even harder.
The original Albania map was much smaller but some players convinced me to do a make-over, including axis minor units. I took it to heart and now you played the result.
- Warsaw: not liked to fight so unhistorically against the polish army, but the scenario is a masterpice. It is extreme hard. Even, that I played it so many times and takes extreme care of my units, I lost a core unit, but I still was happy to make it decisive. Cool Also very nice, that it happens not always the same, so you have to also change your tactics rapidly ingame.
Aftermarch briefing: it is strange to read that Italy will need Germany's help later badly - how can the speaker know that? It would be better: It can happen, that Italy will need Germany's help later also.
Warsaw was an idea overnight, to use this map from the german campaign. Perhaps shocking for some (lol) but i think it turned out pretty well.
- Nice: a little easier, as the earlier ones, but after so hard battles, I was thankful for that! Smile Maybe I also had luck and had more rutine, but I could make it at the first try and even could harvest some extra experience and prestige for my troops. But this scenario is also good, nothing has to be changed - anyway, it is good, that there are sometimes easier, "relax-scenarios", where the player can rest. Like Norway or Kiev in the original campgain, for example.
First version of Nice was even easier until somebody pointed it that it was too easy to cross the border into France. I then even made that little vermin counter attack there.
- Mareth (not yet finished): not likes the german and spanish help - scenario could also go with only italian (core and non-core) units. The size of the scenario is also a little bit too big for me: to big map, to much units, to many turns. Strategy goes a little background, while logistics comes in foreground.
Here i also took into consideration player's feedback. Axis minors and some help from the germans. Here you get a foretaste of what to expect in Russia (tanks...).
So far I must say (not because I want to be kind, but because I think it is the fact), you are a very talented map and scenario maker. The italian campaing is almost as fun (sometimes even better Embarassed ) as the original german campaign. When it could be more historical - not fully, as I earlier wrote -, thant I would be fully happy.
It is fun and as long it is fun and people give feedback on what i designed, it keeps me going :) 8)
https://www.facebook.com/NikivddPanzerCorps/
https://www.youtube.com/user/Nikivdd1/videos?shelf_id=0&view=0&sort=dd

Uhu
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Post by Uhu » Mon Nov 07, 2011 9:58 am

Hmm, when it makes you no problem, than I would try to make a modified, more 'hellenic', and more historical version of the campaign.
- I would remove Warsaw scenario, and put it later in, maybe in Russia (because the scn is far to be good to be missed!)
- italian SE units: 1 or 2 tanks, 1 or 2 AT guns (later upgradeable on semovente 47/32, 90/53 vehicles)

About the "italian tanks are to weaks" issue: let's fight, what you have! :twisted:
I fight, for example (in Rommel mode, where you have mostly not much prestige...) with a lot of 149mm guns!
- Later the Semovente 75's (75/18, 75/34) comes in picture. It should be modified to switch to AT mode
- Semovente 105 will be also avaible later...
- If the player did fight well, there will be no armistice in 1943 and therefore many more modern italian AVFs shows up: M15/42, P40
- some units could be given a little earlier, as prototype
- captured units as already in the campaign
- Maybe a modern german AVFs (PzIVs, Tigers or Panthers) could be given by the germans for honor/support of their allies - as they gave to the hugarians a few Tiger I's and Panthers. That would happen also at the late stage of the war and if the player does well on the battlefield.

I already tried to change to german, spanish units in Mareth scn to italian. :oops:
But it not worked. :? Changed the units in the scenario editor, but after that, when I restarted the scenario in the campaign, an empty window showed up an the scn was not loaded (before 1.04 an with jgsme).
- As I mentioned, I can also play the "before 1.04" campaign with jgsme, because with the new installation method, I can begin a new italian campaing, but the old saves will not be loaded.
Do you have any clues about that?

- If somebody could provide me a full availability list of the italian war vehicles? (Not the production date, I found that in wikipedia, but when the vehicles were actually showed up in the warfields.)

bebro
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Post by bebro » Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:35 pm

I just started playing this campaign, have to agree with the others - It's very nice, and a lot of fun to play. Thanks for putting all those efforts into it.

I played the first two scns so far and don't really have much criticism. Overall I'd also like more historical campaigns, but you already explained your reasons, and in the end it's really the fun that counts, which is definately present here :)

Uhu
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Post by Uhu » Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:49 pm

There is good news: I already working on a historical and semi-historical (a few "what if" scenarios, similar to the original german campaign) italian campaign! 8)

I hope, it will be enjoyable - what is sure, that it will be more difficult, because the player will have no german über-tanks. :twisted: I plan to integrate part of the DMP's Afrika Korps campaign (from 1942.jan).
into it. There will be also Kursk, Moscow 43 and Sealion 44 scenarios with italian support. :wink:

I don't want to say a release date, but I hope in one week, it will be ready.


bebro wrote:I just started playing this campaign, have to agree with the others - It's very nice, and a lot of fun to play. Thanks for putting all those efforts into it.

I played the first two scns so far and don't really have much criticism. Overall I'd also like more historical campaigns, but you already explained your reasons, and in the end it's really the fun that counts, which is definately present here :)

Uhu
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Post by Uhu » Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:56 pm

The scenarios will be mostly the same, as the original italian campaign + AK + Kursk + Moscow + Sealion.

nikivdd
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Post by nikivdd » Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:57 pm

bebro wrote:I just started playing this campaign, have to agree with the others - It's very nice, and a lot of fun to play. Thanks for putting all those efforts into it.

I played the first two scns so far and don't really have much criticism. Overall I'd also like more historical campaigns, but you already explained your reasons, and in the end it's really the fun that counts, which is definately present here :)
It has always been fun :)
I had to start somewhere in campaign making. The two scenario's you just played are actually the very first ones i every made, they got a revision twice since.
Like so many others i started from scratch and seeking out for hours why one or two things didn't want to work lol.
Only unit making is not compatible with me and i am not even going to try.

I leave historical to the historians or to everybody who wants it as historical correct as possible and is a red wire throughout such a campaign. If everybody would develop the same, there would not be much diversity, wouldn't it?

As a last note, the countless hours i have put in such a project as the italian campaign is of no importance in comparison with the great feedback i have been receiving.

Thanks for giving it a try. :)

drjeff21
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Post by drjeff21 » Tue Dec 06, 2011 5:27 pm

Very nice. Thank you for your hard work.

nikivdd
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Post by nikivdd » Tue Dec 06, 2011 5:52 pm

drjeff21 wrote:Very nice. Thank you for your hard work.
Thanks a lot :)

bebro
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Post by bebro » Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:04 pm

Played two more scns - more fun :)

One question though: did you consider setting up upgrade paths for cheaper upgrades quasi "within the family"?

For example, I thought it would be nice for L33 > L35 tankette series, or the M11 > M13 medium tanks since two were closely related. Didn't check more units...but those upgrades seem to cost full money. Or is it intentional to make everything a tad more difficult?

nikivdd
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Post by nikivdd » Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:16 pm

bebro wrote:Played two more scns - more fun :)

One question though: did you consider setting up upgrade paths for cheaper upgrades quasi "within the family"?

For example, I thought it would be nice for L33 > L35 tankette series, or the M11 > M13 medium tanks since two were closely related. Didn't check more units...but those upgrades seem to cost full money. Or is it intentional to make everything a tad more difficult?
Actually never crossed my mind but it is a good idea.

I'm "desperately" waiting for v1.05 to continu GTPG.

I have been experimenting with something :?: :shock:

Image

Uhu
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Post by Uhu » Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:17 pm

In the semi-historic version, there will be an upgrade path for L3/33 (-L3/35-L3/35/Flame), for the M40/13-M41/14, for the Semovente assault gun series (75/18-75/34-...), and...maybe...for the late war italian inf units. :)
bebro wrote:Played two more scns - more fun :)

One question though: did you consider setting up upgrade paths for cheaper upgrades quasi "within the family"?

For example, I thought it would be nice for L33 > L35 tankette series, or the M11 > M13 medium tanks since two were closely related. Didn't check more units...but those upgrades seem to cost full money. Or is it intentional to make everything a tad more difficult?

nikivdd
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Post by nikivdd » Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:20 pm

Uhu wrote:In the semi-historic version, there will be an upgrade path for L3/33 (-L3/35-L3/35/Flame), for the M40/13-M41/14, for the Semovente assault gun series (75/18-75/34-...), and...maybe...for the late war italian inf units. :)
bebro wrote:Played two more scns - more fun :)

One question though: did you consider setting up upgrade paths for cheaper upgrades quasi "within the family"?

For example, I thought it would be nice for L33 > L35 tankette series, or the M11 > M13 medium tanks since two were closely related. Didn't check more units...but those upgrades seem to cost full money. Or is it intentional to make everything a tad more difficult?
Wonderful. Gives me less job to adjust the original equipment file, thanks :)
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