Units availability - forced change?

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Uhu
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Units availability - forced change?

Post by Uhu » Sat Nov 05, 2011 11:33 am

I would ask, if it is possible to force the player to change from a unit type to another?
For example, the Royal Hungarian Army had PzIVF2's and Marder II's in jan, 1943, but after the 1st Army had the way back to home from the eastern front, these units had to be given back to the germans. Therefore, when the hungarian armoured units came in fight again in apr, 1944 they got Turan I, II and Zrínyi II's.
So, the goal should be, that, if tha campaign goes in that direction, that the player don't get involved in fights after let say march, 1943 and only begins again fighting in apr, 1944, he should not have PzIVF2's, Marder II's and other armoured units, because historically they hadn't.
(I know, that the 2nd armoured division got in jun, 1944 Tiger I's, StugIIIG's, PzIIIM's and PzIVH's but that's another story - I want to make the hungarian campaign in many aspects as historical, as it could be.)

So, is there any solution or workaround to achive this goal?

Thanks,

Uhu

(I would like to make a hungarian campaign, because the Royal Hungarian Army had many unique units (licensed, imported, self created) and many modern german war machines during the war, therefore it is ideal to make a campaign, which is many times real hard, because you have only weaker units, but if you do well, you get later "rewarded" with modern equipment, like Tiger I, Panther, and - maybe also with some hungarian prototype units, which came not in production because of allied bombing and the course of the war.)

El_Condoro
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Post by El_Condoro » Sat Nov 05, 2011 12:03 pm

Not exactly. Forcing players to adopt particular equipment goes against the way the game is played but, having said that, you could modify the equipment availability dates and upgrade paths so that it restricts *new* purchases. It would not force the player to get rid of the PzIVF2 he has, though. If it gets killed in combat, though, he could only replace it with a Turan after Jan 43, for example.

Uhu
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Post by Uhu » Sat Nov 05, 2011 12:17 pm

Thank you for the quick answer!

Hmm, I see...than I have to think and find a workaround. Let say, if the player fights not well enough (no decisive) and therefore he would not take part in what if scenarios in later of 1943, than he not get even the opportunity to have PzIVF2 in jan, 1943, therefore, he will not have it in 1944. :)
However, then comes the question, if it is possible to make several upgrade trees for the several path of the campaign?

El_Condoro wrote:Not exactly. Forcing players to adopt particular equipment goes against the way the game is played but, having said that, you could modify the equipment availability dates and upgrade paths so that it restricts *new* purchases. It would not force the player to get rid of the PzIVF2 he has, though. If it gets killed in combat, though, he could only replace it with a Turan after Jan 43, for example.

El_Condoro
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Post by El_Condoro » Sat Nov 05, 2011 2:17 pm

You would need to test that out - I haven't done any modding of the equipment file. I would say you should be able to get pretty close to what you're after with some tweaking, testing and more testing.

rezaf
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Post by rezaf » Sat Nov 05, 2011 3:13 pm

Some flexibility in this part of the game is needed, that much is for sure.
You should be able to "script" equipment changes, for example automatically upgrading all Wehrmacht 39 to Wehrmacht 43, if so you desire. Also, free replacements before any given missions should be possible.
However, when not even bugs like the railroad mount/unmount (without moving) issue have been resolved in 1.04, I'm beginning to lose hope, quite honestly.

That said, I guess there IS a workaround to achieve this now - albeit a very dirty one.
Use the new feature and split your Hungarian campaign into pieces.
In the early campaign, make a Hungarian PzIVF with, say ID 2000.
Then, in the newer campaign, use this ID for a different unit, one you deem would have replaced the PzIVF's.
I'm pretty sure the conversion only looks at the unit IDs, so your PzIVs would turn into whatever you gave this ID in the later campaign when you import the core.
Pretty sure this should work.
_____
rezaf

Razz1
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Post by Razz1 » Sat Nov 05, 2011 4:04 pm

I don't think you can do that as it would entail two different equipment files.

Better alternative is to make those units auxilary. Then when they proceed to the next map of the campaign they are gone.

Only Core units move on from one map to the next.

Uhu
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Post by Uhu » Sat Nov 05, 2011 4:17 pm

Sadly, that would be not a good option to set the best type of tank of that time to be auxilary. And almost all types of armoured units was given back to the germans, when the 2nd Hungarian Army left the Don-theater (Marder II, PzIVF, PzIVF2) - what was not given back, was already destroyed in the fights from jan. to march. 1943.
Razz1 wrote:I don't think you can do that as it would entail two different equipment files.

Better alternative is to make those units auxilary. Then when they proceed to the next map of the campaign they are gone.

Only Core units move on from one map to the next.

rezaf
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Post by rezaf » Sat Nov 05, 2011 4:42 pm

Razz1 wrote:I don't think you can do that as it would entail two different equipment files.
Well, the sticky post says you SHOULD use the same equipment files to avoid those problems - if you used ID 2000 for a tank in one campaign and for a battleship in the next, your tanks would get converted to battleships...
I still have to test this out, but I'm pretty sure it's going to work.
It's a dirty hack, yes, but until the game offers us something better...
_____
rezaf

Razz1
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Post by Razz1 » Sat Nov 05, 2011 9:13 pm

Auxillary is the perfect solution as the tanks go away for the next map. That's exactly what you want to happen.

On the second map just give the Turin's more experience to compensate for crews that were in combat.

Then on the next map you can add the Tigers or what ever.

Uhu
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Post by Uhu » Sun Nov 06, 2011 7:35 pm

If it is really avaible, than I would rather choose the equipment-change, as a workaround for this problem.
As I wrote, making all tank types of that region, time is not a solution.
Imagine the situation, how angry would be the palyer, if there were the Kursk scenario, and the player could only use PzIII's for his core force and no PzIVs, Panthers or Tigers. :)

Anyway, I'm far for this problem: about 8-10 scenarios + unit making + campaign making, so there is still time to think about another solution. 8)


Razz1 wrote:Auxillary is the perfect solution as the tanks go away for the next map. That's exactly what you want to happen.

On the second map just give the Turin's more experience to compensate for crews that were in combat.

Then on the next map you can add the Tigers or what ever.

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