Zhouyejung caught reloading

PSP/DS/PC/MAC : WWII turn based grand strategy game

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sgtsteiner1939
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
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Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by sgtsteiner1939 » Thu May 28, 2015 10:37 am

I caught Zhouyejung reloading on turn 5 of our game - him axis, me allied.

2 of his subs in mud weather located and destroyed my northern convoy 6 hexes south of the tip of greenland. The other (there can only be three by turn 4) attacked my southern convoy off Portugal. I could not see how he could possibly have located both without a spotting sub to find at least the northern one. Using a hotseat game I discovered at top speed his two northern subs would on turn 4 be 5 hexes away from the convoy. The weather on turn 4 and 5 was mud, Spotting range was 3. So there were only two possible explanations: he slowed after 4 turns at top speed to a move of 5 hexes and coincidentally found himself adjacent to my convoy in the vast expanses of the atlantic (which is absurd) or he searched, reloaded, searched, reloaded till he found both the convoys. Obviously the latter is the only real possibility as the former is absurdly unlikely. I sent him (and have) screenshots of the last 4 turns and said that's fine if he wants to reload in this fashion then so would I to level the playing field. he replied "English not good. too busy to play."

So if you played this fellow it is a near certainty he was reloading during your game, probably a lot. He apparently doesn't want his opponents to share this practice. Draw your own conclusions, but I would say no victory ever obtained with one sided reloading is legitimate.

I included a screenshot of turn 5 to demonstrate.
Attachments
zhouturn5.jpg
Turn 5 zhou
zhouturn5.jpg (141.82 KiB) Viewed 3551 times

Peter Stauffenberg
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by Peter Stauffenberg » Thu May 28, 2015 4:23 pm

I think I would have needed more evidence before accusing anyone of cheating. I've sometimes moved a sub and ended up adjacent to a convoy I didn't know was there. It doesn't happen often, but it can.

With some experience you can actually look at the arrows and guess pretty well where the convoy is supposed to be. You know the 5 hexes random movement and then 14 hexes in the direction towards the destination port. So then you look at the bend in the arrows and count 14 hexes towards the port. If you only see part of the arrows you have to guess a bit more.

Typical evidence of cheating is when your opponent always succeeds in killing your units, especially the critical ones. E. g. you're entrenched in a fortress or capital and then it's captured. When you look at the number of attacks you see that he had to score above average on all attacks. Paris is a typical example. Taking Paris with 2 airstrikes and 2 land attacks is quite difficult.

If your convoys are always found by subs then I would suspect cheating. If some get past subs unnoticed the the cheating is less likely. You need 10+ turns before you can with enough reason suspect cheating. Then you need to monitor the situation some turns.

The problem for a cheater is that he often becomes addicted to cheating and will fall for the temptation to cheat a bit more every turn. Until the cheating is so obvious his opponent will just stop playing and everything is lost.

fangotango
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by fangotango » Thu May 28, 2015 5:45 pm

Convoys move 12 hexes in 3.1. Can I assume that will be upped to 14 hexes and the random dodge will be increased from 4 to 5 hexes in 3.2?

I use the counting method to find convoys all the time. If you get to see their opening "dodge" move, or can tell where the random portion ends, it is difficult not to find them with the first SUB. You also have to remember that even if your guess is a bit off, any of seven hexes still place you next to the convoy or right under it. That gives a player a pretty good chance if their guess is within a couple of hexes of the actual position.

One thing I wonder about is that sometimes my SUB ends up adjacent to an unseen convoy, but is not eligible to attack. Could this be because it actually landed on the same hex as the convoy?

sgtsteiner1939
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by sgtsteiner1939 » Thu May 28, 2015 7:36 pm

No way. This is turn 5. With random movement over 3 turns and no point of reference to start with, counting is not going to work. Not even close. There are no arrows because the closest the uboats get are 5 hexes EAST of the convoy of turn 4. I havent checked his southern convoy find yet, but Im gonna hot seat that since I know where he was on turn 2 - attacking a mech in Brest harbor - and see if he could have spotted that convoy. If the odds of randomly finding one convoy are astronomical, imagine finding two on the same turn, add that is the earliest turn you could possibly find a convoy.

sgtsteiner1939
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by sgtsteiner1939 » Thu May 28, 2015 9:26 pm

Ok the southern convoy is the same story. My mech arrives in breast turn 2, is attacked turn 3 by sub 3, turn 4 puts sub 5 hexes north of the southern convoy in mud so 3 hex spotting. So you tell me that you believe that he could coincidentall land two subs adjacent to two convoys unspotted, no arrows no starting point, on the same turn that is the first turn that the convoys could be hit. Are you f***ing joking?

fangotango
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by fangotango » Fri May 29, 2015 12:29 pm

Out of curiosity, which sub was at Brest? Sub 1, 2, or 3?

sgtsteiner1939
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by sgtsteiner1939 » Fri May 29, 2015 1:39 pm

The sub at brest was the one that starts the game at sea in the atlantic, the other two started the game in port.

GeneralVarus
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by GeneralVarus » Sat Jun 06, 2015 5:30 pm

Wow, I hot-seated it myself and you are totally right! There is no way you could randomly find two escorts blind during a mud turn and the first possibel turn you could find them. This guy must be a horrendous cheater. Thanks for the warning.

esde
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by esde » Tue Jun 16, 2015 6:16 am

Whilst unqualified to comment on this specific case, as a generalization: it is a terrible shame (in all aspects) that anyone feels the need to cheat at any PC (or board) game, in order to entertain themselves or improve what little self-esteem they still have. Alas such unfortunates do exist in our hobby. :cry:

Perhaps rather than focussing on the negative, we need to promote the positive and create a listing of PBEM opponents whom we have had a good experience playing against? This would also enable us to (hopefully) encourage members who are a tad prone to becoming grumpy (or worse) when they start sliding towards defeat, to adopt a more generous disposition. :)

rkr1958
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by rkr1958 » Sat Jun 20, 2015 5:27 pm

I just don't get the desire to reload in order to get a better result. For me, it's very gratifying to know that when I have a good turn and luck is with me that that is an honest result. On the flip side, on those turns where things don't go well for me it's always a fun, and often times a frustrating, challenge to adapt and either overcome or mitigate the bad turn. I must admit that my "bad" turns are sometimes due to bad luck, but more often due to poor decisions or execution. :(

In my view folks that reload are just immature and are missing out on the richness this gaming experience has to offer through the ebbs and flows of ones fortunes during the course of a game.

duncanr
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by duncanr » Sat Jun 20, 2015 9:09 pm

the game still has lots of variety at a micro level through the ebb and flow of 'luck'- its fun, of sorts, to look back at some of those 'unfortunate' turns

I am still matching my current form of reasonable ASW results against a turn where I think the combined allied airforces ran 11 ASW flights for 1 step of Axis SUB's lost

rkr1958
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by rkr1958 » Sun Jun 21, 2015 12:39 am

duncanr wrote:the game still has lots of variety at a micro level through the ebb and flow of 'luck'- its fun, of sorts, to look back at some of those 'unfortunate' turns

I am still matching my current form of reasonable ASW results against a turn where I think the combined allied airforces ran 11 ASW flights for 1 step of Axis SUB's lost
Ouch. Did the allied aircrews on those ASW flights turn their radar sets on? I seriously might consider replacing the radar operators. :lol:

duncanr
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by duncanr » Sun Jun 21, 2015 1:02 am

they were quickly re assigned to strategic bombing - bigger targets

rkr1958
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Re: Zhouyejung caught reloading

Post by rkr1958 » Sun Jun 21, 2015 2:23 am

:lol:
duncanr wrote:they were quickly re assigned to strategic bombing - bigger targets

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