Large counters in 4.0 harder to read

PSP/DS/PC/MAC : WWII turn based grand strategy game

Moderators: firepowerjohan, rkr1958, Happycat, Slitherine Core

Post Reply
chrisfso
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Posts: 41
Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2014 10:53 pm

Large counters in 4.0 harder to read

Post by chrisfso » Mon Jan 30, 2017 12:59 am

Hi all. I like to use the large counter format. In 4.0 the counters appear to be squished and the information numerals overlay the underlying terrain rather than the counter, making them much harder to read. Is this something that can be adjusted in the next release?

Peter Stauffenberg
General - Carrier
General - Carrier
Posts: 4710
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2007 4:13 pm
Location: Oslo, Norway

Re: Large counters in 4.0 harder to read

Post by Peter Stauffenberg » Mon Jan 30, 2017 10:44 am

This is done on purpose because the older large Counters covered the entire terrain below. Now you can actually see enough of the terrain below so you can actually know what you're attacking. Before you had to turn units off to see the river, terrain type and resource.

OxfordGuy3
Staff Sergeant - Kavallerie
Staff Sergeant - Kavallerie
Posts: 332
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:32 pm
Location: Oxford, UK

Re: Large counters in 4.0 harder to read

Post by OxfordGuy3 » Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:11 pm

Stauffenberg wrote:This is done on purpose because the older large Counters covered the entire terrain below. Now you can actually see enough of the terrain below so you can actually know what you're attacking. Before you had to turn units off to see the river, terrain type and resource.
I actually prefered the older large counters too, even though they did obscure the underyling terrain :-(

Peter Stauffenberg
General - Carrier
General - Carrier
Posts: 4710
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2007 4:13 pm
Location: Oslo, Norway

Re: Large counters in 4.0 harder to read

Post by Peter Stauffenberg » Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:11 pm

I liked the large counters too, but ended up not using them since it was hard planning any offensives. So I used the small counters instead. Now I use the new large counters and after some time to get used to I prefer them too since they don't interfere with my planning.

Vokt is the master of the large counters and he's the one who can change these. So if you tell your preferences then maybe he will listen.

Vokt
Lieutenant Colonel - Panther D
Lieutenant Colonel - Panther D
Posts: 1222
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2013 3:11 pm

Re: Large counters in 4.0 harder to read

Post by Vokt » Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:29 pm

I don't know how values in new large counters values could be harder to read when the font sizes are the same as in older ones.

Maybe old counters were "nicer" but they definitely had less functionality than new ones since they covered the entire hex. IMO, in a wargame which is about planning and strategy, it should be given priority to functionality over other considerations.

Just for comparison I attached 2 shots of the same scenario (Battle for France) from my AAR's, using both types of counters:

Old large counters:
Image

New large counters:
Image

It's plain to see from the shots comparison that new counters allow for a general cleaner view of the whole scenario. New counters allow for seeing rivers, fortresses, resources, cities, capitals, etc all of which were covered with old large counters. As a sample, see how that forest hex 2xSE of Lille is possible to be identified as a forest hex with new counters but it was very hard to distinguish as that in old counters.

Stauffenberg is right that when you get used to the new large counters with all the functionality and info they provide, you don't want others. I have to admit that I missed old counters at first, but I soon discarded them.

So only thing that occurs to me to change in order to further improve the counters is to change the font size of the strength of the unit number. Since combat values are always in white colour, there's no problem in distinguishing them but strength number colour changes with efficiency level. Maybe a larger strength number won't hurt.

captkiwi
Administrative Corporal - SdKfz 251/1
Administrative Corporal - SdKfz  251/1
Posts: 133
Joined: Sun Apr 26, 2009 3:05 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: Large counters in 4.0 harder to read

Post by captkiwi » Thu Feb 02, 2017 10:32 pm

I prefer using icons...no issues with seeing the terrain...

chrisfso
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Posts: 41
Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2014 10:53 pm

Re: Large counters in 4.0 harder to read

Post by chrisfso » Thu Feb 09, 2017 12:47 am

Thanks for explaining all the thought that went into it. It is nice to know you both missed them also. I will give the new large counters a chance. Since strength changes with efficiency level, I agree that a larger strength number may be helpful.

Post Reply

Return to “MILITARY HISTORY™ Commander - Europe at War : General Discussion”