LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

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Blathergut
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LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by Blathergut » Sat Apr 07, 2018 7:20 pm

Dead.'s been running peninsular Brits. I've found it impossible to ever close against them; I simply end up shot up.

So I tried:

Two extended Guard LCv units side by side with 4 veteran inf units (two w arty attachments) behind them.

1. Move LCv 10mu so they are just out of 6mu to the Brit line.
2. Double move the 4 infantry units up behind the cavalry.

LCv take minimal arty fire and probably no cohesion losses.

3. Move LCv up against the Brit line.
4. Move the 4 inf units up behind the LCv, now the inf is within 2mu of the Brit line.

LCv gets blown away by Brit firepower but only drop 1 cohesion each.

5. 4 inf units unleash on Brit line and can repeat in the next French turn if necessary.


It proved very effective when it finally happened. Dead. did manage to delay it one turn by stepping the entire Brit line back 2mu in his first turn.

The LCv are at worst disordered; the inf, all being veteran, probably survive the cohesion tests (esp. w 2 charismatic commanders on hand), and the cavalry is still effective and usable.


Has anyone else tried this?

richafricanus
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Re: LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by richafricanus » Sun Apr 08, 2018 2:50 am

I'm not sure I understand how you're getting both the LC and the infantry within 2MU and yet only the CAV get shot and still your infantry get to shoot? Maybe a diagram will help?

It does sound like a lot of concentration of force in one area. What is the rest of the British army doing while you're ganging up here?

Veteran British on a hill are very tough frontally. I suppose I'd be looking to go round them. Or charge them frontally with your cav as they need 6's to pass the CT if they're in line.

BrettPT
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Re: LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by BrettPT » Sun Apr 08, 2018 10:53 am

I used to occaisionally do something similar with LI in skirmish formation in v1.

Because extended line is only 30mm deep (15mm scale)
and 2mu is about 50mm, you can ram the extended line up to 5mm from the enemy and push your own infantry hard up to their rear.

Next turn is your opponent's. He shoots first at close range and hopefully does 4 hits.
Your extended line retires wavered through your infantry 2nd line, who hopefully pass their test for being burst through.
Then it's your turn to shoot back. Hit him at close range with the now uncovered 2nd rank, hopefully with attached artillery.

He'll get a chance to rally at the end of the turn. Then it's your turn. You can either assault or shoot before he replies.

Quite hard to engineer, can be countered, and carries the risk that the blocking cavalry don't take 4 hits, and so instead of retiring they sit there disordered, blocking your infantry and maybe getting routed next turn.

But a nice trick if/when it works!

Blathergut
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Re: LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by Blathergut » Sun Apr 08, 2018 11:32 am

richafricanus wrote:I'm not sure I understand how you're getting both the LC and the infantry within 2MU and yet only the CAV get shot and still your infantry get to shoot? Maybe a diagram will help?

It does sound like a lot of concentration of force in one area. What is the rest of the British army doing while you're ganging up here?

Veteran British on a hill are very tough frontally. I suppose I'd be looking to go round them. Or charge them frontally with your cav as they need 6's to pass the CT if they're in line.

The LCv is in line in front of the inf units. At just out of 6mu, only the LCv is exposed to long range arty fire (needing 6s to be hit). Next turn, move right onto enemy line. The prob with trying this with light inf up front in line is that they only move 4, so have to take a full round of shooting from any inf they are approaching. The LCv can do it in one move. And, being Gd, will only drop one level of cohesion. :) But should take 4 hits since two enemy units will be forced to fire at them.

richafricanus
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Re: LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by richafricanus » Sun Apr 08, 2018 8:04 pm

Ah okay got it. Somewhat cheesy methinks. And risky as Brett says. With 8-10 dice you’re far from assured of getting 4 hits needing 5s.

deadtorius
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Re: LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by deadtorius » Tue Apr 10, 2018 11:15 pm

I agree it was a cheese move and probably not historical. It did however work well for the empowers boys. The rest of the British army, only 3 divisions 1 which was cavalry was busy taking out the French left hoping the centre could hold. It didn't in the end and was destroyed. Wellington even found himself in a melee after using his charisma for an emergency rally that got charged by the French and broke.
Mind you I did manage to waver all 3 Dragoons who flanked on my left and tried to force the issue by joining in with the horse screening infantry attack.
In the end we had both lost our left flanks but mine had routed and his were all wavering but still on table. We declared a draw.

deadtorius
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Re: LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by deadtorius » Tue Apr 10, 2018 11:16 pm

Blathergut admits it was a cheese move and he won't use the cave like that again.
I'd like to see how it works with light infantry in line up front.

BrettPT
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Re: LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by BrettPT » Thu Apr 12, 2018 12:35 am

Well, skirmish formation is effectively gone in v2, so the tactic is far trickier.
There is the danger that the enemy will multi-unit assault the extended line. Skirmishers used to simply evade and uncover the fresh tooled up units behind.
But in v2 the extended line would have to take the assault and risk being broken, with 2 tests for the supporting units (broken friends and burst through) and possibly facing pursuits from the victorious enemy.
So as far as I can see, the tactic is a now a no-go for regular LI.

However using gd cav is sneeky. You only drop 1 level from shooting and cannot be assaulted by the enemy infantry.

hazelbark
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Re: LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by hazelbark » Wed May 23, 2018 3:44 pm

There is no requirement to shoot correct? So the defender could just limit his fire on the cavalry.

But yes very ahistorical.

Blathergut
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Re: LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by Blathergut » Thu May 24, 2018 2:26 am

close range is mandatory, is it not?

I haven't used it since trying it...how would you write a restriction like that into the rules tho???

Daemionhunter
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Re: LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by Daemionhunter » Sun May 27, 2018 9:53 am

I'd be happy for this tactic to used against me.

Two drilled guard light cavalry units with four veteran infantry with attachments behind is getting close to 400 points on a narrow frontage.

Lots of exposed flanks and other troops of lower value to pick on.

hazelbark
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Re: LCv Ext Line Inf Cover

Post by hazelbark » Sat Jun 09, 2018 6:38 pm

Blathergut wrote: I haven't used it since trying it...how would you write a restriction like that into the rules tho???
Napoleonic cavalry did not table sit within charge range. I won't say ever. Because at Waterloo the spent cuirassier units were asked to stand near the english squares that were almost out of ammunition. The squares wouldn't fire for fear of beeing without ammo if a charge did occur. The cuirasss no longer had it in them to test the squares, their officers did not want them to retire for fear the army woudl cosnider it a general retreat.

That was clearly an exceptional moment.

I cannot think of anywhere the cavarly even partially fresh stood when it could charge.

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