Campaign Battles Ending early?

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lancerunolfsson_slith
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Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by lancerunolfsson_slith » Fri Dec 12, 2014 7:37 am

I have noticed some battles ending early and not because I have killed all the Orks. Particularly egregious Defending Minos crossing in first act says you have 18 turns and ends on it looked like 9. Lost because I was leaving an objective open to lure Orks in planned on occupying near end of battle then sudden death!!Others end in victory before all conditions met let the one where I'm supposed to move 8 Legion through jungle to edge of board had only 4 or 5 and ended in Victory. Anyone else getting this?

fsx
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by fsx » Fri Dec 12, 2014 7:49 am

Some victory condition should be modified, because these conditions and the mission objectioves dont fit. viewtopic.php?f=326&t=54672#p510003
At Defending Minos Crossing I did not found a wrong trigger or condition in the scenario editor.

Could you upload your last savegames before you win, please?

lancerunolfsson
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by lancerunolfsson » Fri Dec 12, 2014 9:28 am

I will try I will have to replay it because I lost from scenario early end. Problem I have is that I don't know when the scenario ends. It ended when it said turns still left!!
Thanks

lancerunolfsson
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by lancerunolfsson » Fri Dec 12, 2014 10:57 pm

Ok as you can see scenario ends in defeat on turn 7 without the Orks having taken all the objectives. Supposed to be 18 turns. Thanks

Edit: I don't see the attachment It says that file extension not allowed tried renaming it .jpg still not allowed same with .doc what am I supposed to do?

lancerunolfsson
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by lancerunolfsson » Sat Dec 13, 2014 12:36 am

I Can see now what is going on. On turn 7 the victory hexes change location. The Orks can control one of the hexes before turn 7 but the legion has to control it on turn 7 or they lose. kind of strange.

fsx
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by fsx » Sat Dec 13, 2014 10:21 am

Thanks for reporting and finding the reason for that issue.
A savegame would help a lot, because it is a rare combination.
Please, ZIP the savegame. This extension is allowed.

Added to the issue list: viewtopic.php?f=324&t=54831&p=511231#p511231

Kerensky
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by Kerensky » Sat Dec 13, 2014 6:07 pm

Again, this is what it is supposed to be.
Scenario Objective: Control all three Victory Hexes and wait for additional orders.
Otherwise, the player can simply abandon their forward positions and fall back behind the river line immediately. It's all explained in the game text. :)
Objectives held. Now fall back behind the river to form a new defensive line! Scenario Objective Updated: Control all three new Victory Hexes until the end of the scenario.

lancerunolfsson
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by lancerunolfsson » Sat Dec 13, 2014 7:13 pm

Here is the Zip
Attachments
Autosave (Steel Legion) - Copy.zip
save game zip
(18.84 KiB) Downloaded 170 times

lancerunolfsson
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by lancerunolfsson » Sat Dec 13, 2014 7:26 pm

Kerensky wrote:Again, this is what it is supposed to be.
Scenario Objective: Control all three Victory Hexes and wait for additional orders.
Otherwise, the player can simply abandon their forward positions and fall back behind the river line immediately. It's all explained in the game text. :)
Objectives held. Now fall back behind the river to form a new defensive line! Scenario Objective Updated: Control all three new Victory Hexes until the end of the scenario.
It is very easy from the initial description to conclude one must hold the objectives at the end of the game. this is a typical requirement. The way the thing plays out the actual requirement is Hold the objectives on turn 7. You can let the Orks take an objective before turn 7 in order to have Ork units on clear terrain to blow up easily. You just have to hold the objective on turn 7:^) An accurate scenario description as it stands would be "Hold initial objectives on turn 7 when your orders will change". :^)

Kerensky
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by Kerensky » Sat Dec 13, 2014 7:56 pm

Hmm, I'll consider it, but generally that kind of terminology is a little bit too immersion breaking. We can't ever have a voice actor ever say something like 'I will go ahead with my Titan into the bulk of the enemies (to the victory hex) and destroy as many as I could".

It says to hold those three hexes, so you need to hold those three hexes! :D

lancerunolfsson
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by lancerunolfsson » Sat Dec 13, 2014 8:03 pm

Kerensky wrote:Hmm, I'll consider it, but generally that kind of terminology is a little bit too immersion breaking. We can't ever have a voice actor ever say something like 'I will go ahead with my Titan into the bulk of the enemies (to the victory hex) and destroy as many as I could".

It says to hold those three hexes, so you need to hold those three hexes! :D
I guess I just prefer accuracy over immersion.

Shrike
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by Shrike » Sat Dec 13, 2014 8:04 pm

There's a genuine bug in Relief Operation though. The win condition of "Capture all 4 victory hexes" is incorrect, as there are only 3 present :D Fortunately, those 3 win you the scenario.

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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by FroBodine » Sat Dec 13, 2014 8:07 pm

A simple text change could be, "Control all three victory hexes until you receive new orders."

The word "until" pretty much tells you what you need to do. Hold them until you are told otherwise, then follow the new orders.

Kerensky
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by Kerensky » Sat Dec 13, 2014 8:31 pm

lancerunolfsson wrote:I guess I just prefer accuracy over immersion.
I generally do agree, but there is a limit to how far this can go! :wink:

It's why we have pop up messages at all, to facilitate important gameplay information with none of the lore 'fluff' or clutter.

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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by Kerensky » Sat Dec 13, 2014 8:32 pm

FroBodine wrote:A simple text change could be, "Control all three victory hexes until you receive new orders."

The word "until" pretty much tells you what you need to do. Hold them until you are told otherwise, then follow the new orders.
Not a bad suggestion. This last patch actually introduced a typo to this mission, so now is as good as any time for a text adjustment because we do have another patch scheduled before this year is out. :)

Kerensky
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by Kerensky » Sat Dec 13, 2014 8:34 pm

Shrike wrote:There's a genuine bug in Relief Operation though. The win condition of "Capture all 4 victory hexes" is incorrect, as there are only 3 present :D Fortunately, those 3 win you the scenario.
Confirmed. There was a problem with gaining access to the 4th Victory Hex because of how the edge of the map works (you can never enter what appears to be a full tile because it is an edge hex) so it was removed. Better correct the text though!

orci
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by orci » Sun Dec 14, 2014 8:10 am

Honestly for me the mission description was absolutely ok. Also changing the victory hexes without knowing it in advance.
Since when do you get clear and complete orders from your boss?
And also the best plan doesn't survive enemy contact.

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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by Skanvak » Sun Dec 14, 2014 8:26 am

For the the mission text may be you could be more dramatic "Hold all the objectives until further order! Do not fall back comrade!" or "Do not let any one fall, the Emperor is watching you!".

As for the above question, I have some issue in a mission where I should have taken 4 objective and ended when I hold only 3. Sorry don't remind which one. But overall I felt there was a problem on several mission objectifs checking. Even in Defend Tartarus Hive, I felt I lost when I should have one more turn on the opposite the ork was holding an objective with no unit and it did not trigger the objective loss.

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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by Rmarsden » Fri Jan 16, 2015 3:39 am

Act 1:

The find the two downed craft Mission went funny. Swarms of orks, and I was unable to hold both objectives, but it still ended in victory. That whole mission felt a touch off.

The Mission where you need to clear a path for the Titan. Long before the Titan reached the objective I had my cavalry (that's right! Horses! I ride horses!) enter the victory hex. The mission ended. The mission told me not to get too close, but I thought I'd be clever and clear the area, and leave when the Titan drew near.

Is there a thread about plot-holes? In Training, for example, the Ork invasion isn't shown. One mission you know a space hulk is coming, the next, the Orks have arrived and decimated, but the dialogue seems to think I saw or know something all about that. I keep thinking there should be artwork and some dialogue about invasions, or titans blowing up.

fsx
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Re: Campaign Battles Ending early?

Post by fsx » Fri Jan 16, 2015 6:11 am

Rmarsden wrote:The find the two downed craft Mission went funny. Swarms of orks, and I was unable to hold both objectives, but it still ended in victory. That whole mission felt a touch off.
You only need to find the survivors. You dont need to protect the place after you find they.
Rmarsden wrote:The Mission where you need to clear a path for the Titan. Long before the Titan reached the objective I had my cavalry (that's right! Horses! I ride horses!) enter the victory hex. The mission ended. The mission told me not to get too close, but I thought I'd be clever and clear the area, and leave when the Titan drew near.

The scenario designer decided to change something since version 1.00. But some of the strange things are not changed yet. We had some discussions about this. Please, seach for "obedience".

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