klayeckles has won The Slitherine Trophy . . .

The Slitherine Trophy

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stockwellpete
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klayeckles has won The Slitherine Trophy . . .

Post by stockwellpete » Thu Oct 23, 2014 10:31 pm

. . . will be between Londo and klayeckles. Congratulations to both players for reaching the final and well played too to LordNytram and IMC who were the beaten semi-finalists. :D

Londo
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by Londo » Wed Oct 29, 2014 12:59 pm

The final match is now underway. Out of all the hundreds of armies available in the six FOG army books, I chose Classical Spartan, and Klay ... also chose Classical Spartan! :)

I hope everyone will be rooting for good King Londonidas to triumph over the usurper, Kleon the Degenerate.

Pete, as you requested by PM, we can do screenshots and some running commentary. Would you like them posted to this thread?

stockwellpete
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by stockwellpete » Wed Oct 29, 2014 2:06 pm

Londo wrote:The final match is now underway. Out of all the hundreds of armies available in the six FOG army books, I chose Classical Spartan, and Klay ... also chose Classical Spartan! :)

I hope everyone will be rooting for good King Londonidas to triumph over the usurper, Kleon the Degenerate.

Pete, as you requested by PM, we can do screenshots and some running commentary. Would you like them posted to this thread?
Yes please, Paul, that would be fabulous. :D

I have also created an AAR thread for the Slitherine Trophy section of the forum as well and I will copy anything you and Klay send over there as well . . .

viewtopic.php?f=248&t=53587

Londo
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by Londo » Fri Oct 31, 2014 3:52 pm

At the start of the Slitherine Trophy, I compiled a list of armies that I wanted to use. Classical Spartan was #1 on that list. No hesitation.

With 350 points, you can have up to 13 Spartan citizen hoplites - superior armoured HF with offensive spear. They are the best all-round troops in the game, in my opinion. With average luck, they'll beat Roman legionaries, average pikes, and virtually every other type of infantry. Missiles do little to them. Cavalry can't touch them, at least while they're steady. The biggest danger to Spartans would be dismounted knights in heavy armour. But these type of armies haven't been very popular in the Trophy, so I felt I could ignore this possibility.

The other advantage of Spartans is high BPs, due to a large number of 2 point LF and Mobs. I was not going to take an army with less than high 30s BP. With Spartans, I could get an Inspired leader, and the maximum number of citizen hoplites, and still have 38 BP.

But Klay out-did me on that score. He also took Spartans, but with a different structure, totalling 45 BP. So he's starting with a lead of 7 BP. In what could be a very close game, that's a big advantage.

My advantage is the inspired leader, who gives +2 to cohesion rolls along the entire line of hoplites. Klay's leader - a troop general, I think - only gives +1, and only to part of his army. The rest will be out of command. I have to capitalise on this, if I'm to stand a chance.

The two armies can be seen below closing on each other across open ground. I've pulled my LF javelinmen back behind the hoplites. Because they have to get so close to the enemy to use their weapons, they can be easily caught by other LF or cavalry. Klay has more LF, so I won't attempt to fight a skirmisher battle. Some Thracians and cavalry are moving about on the flanks, but I don't think they'll play a big role. It will all come down to the hoplites, who are only a couple of turns from contact ...

Londo
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by Londo » Fri Oct 31, 2014 4:42 pm

(Lord I hate the archaic, slow, and buggy Slitherine forum system, with its ridiculous 256 KB limitation on attachment size ...)
FOG01.jpg
Turn 2
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klayeckles
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by klayeckles » Sat Nov 01, 2014 4:01 am

I have the bigger army (as I brought lots of women and children), but my commander is lowly...this will be a very interesting test of the value of an inspired commander. in first two turns I attempt to advance obliquely to give my troops rear support...a nifty trick if you can pull it off...but as you will see you can expose a flank if not careful...

I threw out a friendly challenge that the first mob that gets a kill should score double pts...just to add something to talk about around the campfire after the battle!

Londo
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by Londo » Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:30 am

Here's a screenshot from Turn 4.

The lines are closer now. On my right is a gaggle of helot Mobs. They're basically Klay VPs on the hoof. If I leave them behind, he'll probably send cavalry after them, so I'm moving them in behind the line, but not so close that they'll be in danger if any of my hoplites break.

I didn't understand, until he explained it above, why Klay is advancing obliquely. The answer is that you get +1 to cohesion rolls for having a unit behind you, so advancing like that maximises the chance of staying steady if a unit loses on impact. Even the oldest dogs can learn new tricks in this game! :)

Unfortunately, though, Klay's manoeuvers into an oblique line have left one of his hoplite units with an exposed rear, in reach of my hoplites. Being Greeks, the sight of an exposed rear makes us very excited! Stay tuned to see what happens ...
FOG02.jpg
Turn 4
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Miras
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by Miras » Tue Nov 04, 2014 5:47 pm

Londo ----- Maybe movie ?

klayeckles
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by klayeckles » Wed Nov 05, 2014 3:45 am

Londo wrote:Here's a screenshot from Turn 4.

The lines are closer now. On my right is a gaggle of helot Mobs. They're basically Klay VPs on the hoof. If I leave them behind, he'll probably send cavalry after them, so I'm moving them in behind the line, but not so close that they'll be in danger if any of my hoplites break.

I didn't understand, until he explained it above, why Klay is advancing obliquely. The answer is that you get +1 to cohesion rolls for having a unit behind you, so advancing like that maximises the chance of staying steady if a unit loses on impact. Even the oldest dogs can learn new tricks in this game! :)

Unfortunately, though, Klay's manoeuvers into an oblique line have left one of his hoplite units with an exposed rear, in reach of my hoplites. Being Greeks, the sight of an exposed rear makes us very excited! Stay tuned to see what happens ...
FOG02.jpg
I hate to admit my error there...but it was a newbie! using the hoplite troops icons it can sometimes be a little confusing which way is their "front", I simply missed that. on the plus side...I have more troops in the front of my wedge than Paul has...so if I win there I may be able to wrap him...and leap out of the forest with my thracians...

PAUL...your move!

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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by Londo » Sat Nov 08, 2014 9:08 am

Miras wrote:Londo ----- Maybe movie ?
It would be the saddest movie ever made - the story of how good King Londonidas, the noblest of all Spartans, was brought down by the evil of Kleon the Reprehensible, and by the inability of his men to fight properly.

It's now turn 7. The enemy unit that brazenly flaunted their posteriors was fragmented and then routed. I had hoped that this might lead to the weakening of the enemy centre, but no such luck. Their centre is holding. My left wing hoplites have been soundly defeated, and are running for the hills. The only good news is that my right is doing well, with a couple of enemy units fragmented.

On my far left, Thracians are fighting Thracians. As you will see, I hired the wrong ones. I would have got more value out of a unit of baby rabbits.

Alas, who can read this tale of woe and not weep? :D
FOG03.jpg
Turn 7
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Miras
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by Miras » Sat Nov 08, 2014 10:45 am

Londo ---- Fight or die. This is Sparta !!! :D

stockwellpete
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by stockwellpete » Sat Nov 08, 2014 12:04 pm

Londo wrote:The lines are closer now. On my right is a gaggle of helot Mobs. They're basically Klay VPs on the hoof. If I leave them behind, he'll probably send cavalry after them, so I'm moving them in behind the line, but not so close that they'll be in danger if any of my hoplites break.
If you used some of the helot mob units as support for your front line, might that not have given you the edge in the centre? Risky, I know - but maybe it would be one way to nick an advantage?

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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by klayeckles » Mon Nov 10, 2014 1:37 pm

Londo wrote:
Miras wrote:Londo ----- Maybe movie ?
It would be the saddest movie ever made - the story of how good King Londonidas, the noblest of all Spartans, was brought down by the evil of Kleon the Reprehensible, and by the inability of his men to fight properly.

It's now turn 7. The enemy unit that brazenly flaunted their posteriors was fragmented and then routed. I had hoped that this might lead to the weakening of the enemy centre, but no such luck. Their centre is holding. My left wing hoplites have been soundly defeated, and are running for the hills. The only good news is that my right is doing well, with a couple of enemy units fragmented.

On my far left, Thracians are fighting Thracians. As you will see, I hired the wrong ones. I would have got more value out of a unit of baby rabbits.

Alas, who can read this tale of woe and not weep? :D
FOG03.jpg
As I saw I had a slight advantage on his left, I have kept pressing on that end...on the other end where he quickly gained an advantage, I simply pulled back with my Cav and skirmishers...no sense throwing good money after bad as they say...things look very good on his left, but my remaining center is very fragile and about to be overlapped on his right...

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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by stockwellpete » Fri Nov 14, 2014 7:29 am

The deadline for completion of this match is Sunday 23rd November.

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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by Londo » Sat Nov 15, 2014 1:19 pm

Miras wrote:Londo ---- Fight or die. This is Sparta !!! :D
Tonight-we-dine-in-hell.jpg
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Londo
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by Londo » Sat Nov 15, 2014 1:48 pm

stockwellpete wrote:If you used some of the helot mob units as support for your front line, might that not have given you the edge in the centre? Risky, I know - but maybe it would be one way to nick an advantage?
I had planned to use perioikoi - average hoplites from the villages around Sparta, the army must take at least 6 - as rear support for the 13 superior hoplites. But as the saying goes, no plan survives contact with the enemy, and I was forced instead to deploy most of them out to the wings, where enemy thracians and cavalry were looming.

The picture below is from turn 8. The previous move I made a big decision. A pocket of my hoplites had formed in the centre. They had taken a lot of casualties, but were all steady.

If King Londonidas, the inspired leader, stepped into the pocket with his perioikoi bodyguard, he would be adjacent to 4 other hoplite units, who would all get +4 on any cohesion test (+2 within range of inspired leader, +1 adjacent leader, +1 rear support). That's a huge bonus on 2d6, and with superior units, pretty much guarantees they're not going to fail.

On the other hand, some of the units, particularly the one at the head of the pocket, had taken heavy casualties. If Klay got a big roll in melee, he might do enough damage to auto-rout it, and it might then rout through Londonidas' unit. But I felt I should take the risk. I was feeling a bit desperate after my left flank disintegrated. "The centre must hold!", boomed Londonidas in his Scottish accent, as he boldly moved into the pocket.

The picture shows what happened next. The pocket has almost collapsed, and Londonidas' unit is fragmented. :cry:
FOG04.jpg
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klayeckles
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by klayeckles » Sun Nov 16, 2014 12:31 am

Londo wrote:
stockwellpete wrote:If you used some of the helot mob units as support for your front line, might that not have given you the edge in the centre? Risky, I know - but maybe it would be one way to nick an advantage?
I had planned to use perioikoi - average hoplites from the villages around Sparta, the army must take at least 6 - as rear support for the 13 superior hoplites. But as the saying goes, no plan survives contact with the enemy, and I was forced instead to deploy most of them out to the wings, where enemy thracians and cavalry were looming.

The picture below is from turn 8. The previous move I made a big decision. A pocket of my hoplites had formed in the centre. They had taken a lot of casualties, but were all steady.

If King Londonidas, the inspired leader, stepped into the pocket with his perioikoi bodyguard, he would be adjacent to 4 other hoplite units, who would all get +4 on any cohesion test (+2 within range of inspired leader, +1 adjacent leader, +1 rear support). That's a huge bonus on 2d6, and with superior units, pretty much guarantees they're not going to fail.

On the other hand, some of the units, particularly the one at the head of the pocket, had taken heavy casualties. If Klay got a big roll in melee, he might do enough damage to auto-rout it, and it might then rout through Londonidas' unit. But I felt I should take the risk. I was feeling a bit desperate after my left flank disintegrated. "The centre must hold!", boomed Londonidas in his Scottish accent, as he boldly moved into the pocket.

The picture shows what happened next. The pocket has almost collapsed, and Londonidas' unit is fragmented. :cry:
FOG04.jpg
note to the wise...you need same quality level to provide rear support and be in good order!
so on his left I had an advantage...and kept pushing forward with it...also the commitment of the lionidus to the battle proves true desperation as I break him on the next attack...with some freedom to move, I will try and swing the open flank before my center collapses

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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by voskarp » Sun Nov 16, 2014 7:34 am

klayeckles wrote:...
note to the wise...you need same quality level to provide rear support and be in good order!...
?

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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by Londo » Sun Nov 16, 2014 7:49 am

Skipping along to Turn 11. I'm 28/38, Klay is 22/45, so things aren't looking good.

My centre is now gone. Londonidas has routed. He's running for his life on the right side of the map, pursued by enemy LF javelinmen. (That would have been a different, amusing ending to the film 300, no? Leonidas and his men routing away, with Persian light troops throwing things at them to keep them on the move. Perhaps that explains why his men didn't wear armour - they didn't want to be encumbered when fleeing!)

My right has defeated everything in front of it, and swung about to face the enemy centre. I have 7 hoplites left, Klay has 8, but many of his have a skull symbol.

Unfortunately, I'm about to lose an LF and a cavalry unit, though I'll get one of Klay's LF. This was another big mistake on my part - in what looked like it would be a close game, I should have been ultra-cautious with the light troops and cavalry.
FOG05.jpg
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Londo
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Re: The Slitherine Trophy Final . . .

Post by Londo » Sun Nov 16, 2014 8:00 am

voskarp wrote:
klayeckles wrote:...
note to the wise...you need same quality level to provide rear support and be in good order!...
?
Yeah, I'm a bit puzzled by that too. The help file says you get +1 in cohesion tests for "adjacent friends other than skirmishers to the rear". No mention of needing to be same quality or in good order.

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