Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Order of Battle is a series of operational WW2 games starting with the Pacific War and then on to Europe!

Moderators: The Artistocrats, Order of Battle Moderators

Post Reply
Erik2
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 5388
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:59 pm
Location: Norway

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by Erik2 » Thu Jul 05, 2018 8:33 am

I can't find any issues with the trigger/events in Second Bardia. Did you get a green check mark after eliminating all Axis units?

Mascarenhas
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:45 am

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by Mascarenhas » Thu Jul 05, 2018 10:43 am

No. I wonder if that´s because I´ve been playing since prior versions and updating the campaign as new versions are being releasaed.

Erik2
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 5388
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:59 pm
Location: Norway

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by Erik2 » Thu Jul 05, 2018 1:34 pm

Maybe...
Usually a scenario update means you just need to restart said scenario.
There have been radical changes to the campaign file so it would probably be safest to restart the campaign and nuke your way through scenarios you do not want to play again.

GabeKnight
Lieutenant Colonel - Panther D
Lieutenant Colonel - Panther D
Posts: 1245
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:24 pm

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by GabeKnight » Thu Jul 05, 2018 4:18 pm

Mascarenhas wrote: No. I wonder if that´s because I´ve been playing since prior versions and updating the campaign as new versions are being releasaed.
Erik2 wrote: Usually a scenario update means you just need to restart said scenario.
Yeah, a scen restart should do the trick. If you can play the mission, it means the campaign file as such must work.

What often leads to false update-errors are misunderstandings of the folder structures used with custom campaigns and scens. The savegame files are linked to the folder names used there. You'll have to make sure, that the updated campaign and scenario files actually overwrite the old ones!

For example, this campaign folder was named "Desert Rats 1940-1942" before the v3 update, now it's "Desert Rats 1940-1943". If I didn't notice this, and didn't change the folder name manually, my existing savegame files would still take further scens from the outdated '42 folder and not the new '43. Was it understandable like that?
Erik2 wrote:There have been radical changes to the campaign file so it would probably be safest to restart the campaign and nuke your way through scenarios you do not want to play again.
That would be the measure of last resort.

Mascarenhas
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
Posts: 16
Joined: Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:45 am

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by Mascarenhas » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:54 am

So, your suggestion is that I change back campaign´s folder name to 40-42?

GabeKnight
Lieutenant Colonel - Panther D
Lieutenant Colonel - Panther D
Posts: 1245
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:24 pm

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by GabeKnight » Fri Jul 06, 2018 12:49 pm

Mascarenhas wrote:So, your suggestion is that I change back campaign´s folder name to 40-42?
Could be, but my actual suggestion just states to be sure to install updated campaigns/scens properly. A simple extraction or drag&drop might not be enough, it's all I'm saying. Don't know what the case may be for you.

And bear in mind, even the almighty Erik tends to leave a few mistakes in his works, as to not appear perfect and divine. :wink:

Erik2
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 5388
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:59 pm
Location: Norway

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by Erik2 » Fri Jul 06, 2018 2:01 pm

Mistakes? Erik? Noooooo....

SirAllan
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2016 5:24 pm

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by SirAllan » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:25 pm

Hi Erik
A suggestion and a question to your Desert Rats cmp.
Why not either reduce the supply from 30 to 20 and ad 5 to the other two VP's - that makes more sense to defense something, which have some value or even better keep the 30 and ad 3 to the other two VP's :shock:

To the question: How can I edit in your campaign (never tryed or dared before) so I can test, the ideas that comes to my mind :o

Erik2
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 5388
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:59 pm
Location: Norway

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by Erik2 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 9:08 am

Sir

Which scenario are you suggesting supply changes to?

Select Editor and then Campaign if you want to edit campaign stuff.
If you want to edit specific scenarios you need to copy them from the My Games -Campaigns...Scenarios to the My Games...Scenarios folder.

SirAllan
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2016 5:24 pm

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by SirAllan » Sun Jul 08, 2018 9:33 am

Hi again Erik and thx.
The 3rd scenario "The Battle of Girba".
Btw even if I like your units names, I like to change them into my own historical names but when I do and then save the game and return later, they have changed back to your original names - how can that happend :?:
It is rather clever by you keeping your personal touch in the game no matter what :wink:

Erik2
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 5388
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:59 pm
Location: Norway

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by Erik2 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 11:16 am

I'll take a look at Girba.
I've seen the unit name issue earlier. Maybe post about it in the Tech support forum?

Edit: The British sole supply source in Girba is on the primary objective.
The Italians need their own supply source and I find it is better to have that on the northern map edge to prevent the British from cutting Italian supply too easily. The Italians are one the offensive here anyway.

SirAllan
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2016 5:24 pm

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by SirAllan » Sun Jul 08, 2018 12:48 pm

Yep but you have to defend 3 VP and if you loose just one - you loose the scenarie :shock:
It just make more sense (to me) if there were a reason, why to defend the other two (they are primary objective as well) in this case it could be supply.
Another thing is, you dont get any RP after the fight, so you cant repair your core force. Is this intentionel :?:

Erik2
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 5388
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:59 pm
Location: Norway

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by Erik2 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:43 pm

Girba has only the one objective. British held at start.
Maybe you mean another scenario?

SirAllan
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
Senior Corporal - Ju 87G
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2016 5:24 pm

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by SirAllan » Mon Jul 09, 2018 2:55 pm

It is Girba which have one start objective (defend 3 VP's Goldflag) and later on destroy Italien Armor - as i earlier have said it was a suggestion.
Why not either reduce the supply from Main Objective (Goldflag) of 30 to 20 and ad 5 to the other two VP's (Goldflag) - that makes more sense to defense something, which have some value or even better keep the 30 and ad 3 to the other two VP's :shock:

Erik2
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 5388
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:59 pm
Location: Norway

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by Erik2 » Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:29 pm

Aha, I forgot about the later enabled objective.
And I missed the two other golden flags... :oops:
Good suggestion, actually :D

bru888
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 2168
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 5:39 pm
Location: Long Island

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by bru888 » Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:07 pm

The dust (sand?) seems to have settled a bit here . . . no new versions in nearly a week . . . so perhaps it's time for my CSI sweep.

Here's an initial recommendation: Don't do anything with this now because it's too much work in the campaign editor but in the future, if you were to put a preceding zero in your scenario folder names, it would help to sort them in a file explorer window so that you can see them in proper order. As it is, we have this order:

Capture1086.jpg
Capture1086.jpg (393.96 KiB) Viewed 230 times

If you do anything else on the scale of GGC (94 scenarios!) you may want to put two preceding zeroes, as "001Poznan."

Here's another preliminary. This campaign description doesn't seem adequate any more. It was apprpropriate when Desert Rats first came out but you have greatly expanded it so you may want to jazz this up a bit to be more far-reaching in scope:

Screenshot 1.jpg
Screenshot 1.jpg (27.47 KiB) Viewed 224 times

Wow, I'm looking at "Border" now and you have upped your game in this campaign with the briefings!
- Bru

Erik2
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 5388
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:59 pm
Location: Norway

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by Erik2 » Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:45 pm

I think you colonials are suffering from US measuring/date systems and whatnots.
My Norwegian folder is sorted perfectly with the current numbering system.

bru888
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 2168
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 5:39 pm
Location: Long Island

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by bru888 » Tue Jul 10, 2018 2:59 pm

You may have a point; there are differences in the way things are done as demonstrated in Windows by a peek at the Control Panel / Region settings. I noticed that in your zipped file, the order is indeed correct (which image I am keeping as a guide):

Capture1087.jpg
Capture1087.jpg (725.25 KiB) Viewed 219 times

No matter; it's only a minor inconvenience over here. Back to the Border!
- Bru

bru888
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 2168
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 5:39 pm
Location: Long Island

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by bru888 » Tue Jul 10, 2018 3:39 pm

Border Raid v. 3.6

How strict to do want to be when the first truck escapes and the primary objective is failed? Because I let it happen deliberately by turn 4:

Screenshot 2.jpg
Screenshot 2.jpg (366.21 KiB) Viewed 215 times

Now, if you are strict, that means the AI should win at this point and the scenario is over. This does not happen because you don't have an AI objective for it to win in this case.

Ok, so maybe I still want to pull out a minor defeat by smashing the Italian supply dump/airstrip (perhaps thinking to avoid a major defeat). So I attack it thusly and am aggravated, as you have been, that a lowly truck can cut off supply (I think your complaint was about a train doing that) but this is not your doing, of course:

Screenshot 3.jpg
Screenshot 3.jpg (361.89 KiB) Viewed 215 times

So, back to the Border, I go ahead and achieve the secondary objective by turn 7:

Screenshot 4.jpg
Screenshot 4.jpg (370.68 KiB) Viewed 215 times

But that now means sitting there for five more turns with nothing to do but clicking next turn until the scenario ends . . . in a Draw?

Screenshot 5.jpg
Screenshot 5.jpg (357.73 KiB) Viewed 215 times

It's a Draw because by these definitions, nobody has achieved all their primary objectives (the AI didn't have any to achieve):

Capture1088.jpg
Capture1088.jpg (72.21 KiB) Viewed 215 times

Major/Minor Defeat are not even possible in this scenario; the worst outcome is a Draw.

I always feel the need to sneak in this disclaimer: It's supposed to be fun; it doesn't have to be perfect (and maybe losing this scenario is actually meant to be hard to do); I only point stuff out in case you want to follow up on it; I don't go back to check on whether you do so.
- Bru

bru888
Order of Battle Moderator
Order of Battle Moderator
Posts: 2168
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 5:39 pm
Location: Long Island

Re: Desert Rats 1940-42 beta testing

Post by bru888 » Tue Jul 10, 2018 4:07 pm

Border Raid v. 3.6

Three more things. First, I am confused by these triggers as to why you did them this way. The exit hexes are as shown, and I think "Truck-2" is the one that actually does the trick because it's the one that points to an exit hex. The others point elsewhere with a Distance of 0; the exact spot is required; even Distance = 1 would make sense if you are trying to allow for trucks bypassing roadblocks. If not, why not merely Check Unit Count / Italian Truck / Exited >0?

Screenshot 1.jpg
Screenshot 1.jpg (405.11 KiB) Viewed 195 times

The second thing is, in two playthroughs, I watched the Italian AB 40 literally waltz around the British Daimler Dingo without ever attacking:

Screenshot 2.jpg
Screenshot 2.jpg (357.97 KiB) Viewed 209 times
Screenshot 3.jpg
Screenshot 3.jpg (358.04 KiB) Viewed 209 times
Screenshot 4.jpg
Screenshot 4.jpg (354.8 KiB) Viewed 209 times

I think this is due to "Land-based Recon units will also be more likely to retreat from combat to prevent taking significant losses" and that you have the AB 40's AI team set to only 50 aggression. When I cranked that up to 99, the AB 40 attacked in the third playthrough (to its detriment):

Screenshot 5.jpg
Screenshot 5.jpg (349.81 KiB) Viewed 209 times

The third thing is, I'll take back what I said about "maybe losing this scenario is actually meant to be hard to do." I don't think so at all once that I have tried to really play it. Too many trucks at one time and the player is certainly not helped by this Universal Carrier being utterly useless against trucks! (Zero attack versus mechanised.)

Screenshot 6.jpg
Screenshot 6.jpg (478.04 KiB) Viewed 196 times

That's it for this one. Moving on to Capuzzo this evening, perhaps.
- Bru

Post Reply

Return to “Order of Battle Series”