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Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:38 am
by Jabster
First off just to say this is very much a enjoyable game and one that I expect to spend sometime playing. The problem I’m having is though I’ve played quite a few PC wargames, and even tabletop ones many years ago, they’ve mostly been WWII based and for me what works and what doesn’t is far more intuitive in that era. I’ve switched on detailed tooltips and the combat log, read the manual but still find myself sometimes feeling all at sea over whether my overall plan has any hope to succeed.

Is it just a case of playing more and trying things out or indeed would multiplayer with a helpful ‘tutor’ be more useful. Any thoughts and ideas most welcome.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:44 am
by stockwellpete
There is no substitute for experience. Pick just a couple of armies and play your first few games with them and then start experimenting a bit with your selections (more or less cavalry or skirmishers, a bigger or smaller army etc). Romans, Macedonians, Seleucids are all good places to start. Once you have a bit of confidence branch out to other armies such as Carthage (with elephants) or Indians (with archers).

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 12:07 pm
by Jabster
Thanks for the advice and I’ll give it a try. Currently I’ve been playing with the Fight Now option.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 12:53 pm
by Bombax
I'm wondering if the Seleucids might be a bit confusing for a 'beginner'? I agree that Romans are a good choice, also maybe try the Gauls - pretty effective Warband and Cavalry, and relatively simple to use!

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 2:02 pm
by Alsagoz
I started playing as Campanian. I feel that its army is pretty solid and straightforward. It has all basic foundations you can work with.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 3:16 pm
by Adraeth
I will suggest to select armies you know, maybe you read about some famous battle so you might understand how some armies behaved; so for istance try Rome vs Carthago or maybe try same armies battle so you might "learn from AI" so try Roman vs Roman or Gauls vs Gauls

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 4:22 pm
by Cablenexus
I learned most by diving directly in MP skirmish battles. Your opponents are strong and you can learn from their moves.

I learned more in one MP battle then in a thousand tutorials.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 5:24 pm
by GiveWarAchance
The 3 painful lessons I learned from MP: never set up open challenges cause people accept them and don't play them, do not chase skirmishers in the beginning of battles, and just accept that elephants will kill off your troops with impunity.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 5:37 pm
by devoncop
That's odd. I must have put up over a dozen open challenges since the game released and only one has not continued until conclusion. Maybe I have just been lucky. Elephants really really suffer from javelins and also struggle v medium inf in rough terrain.

It would be good mind you to have a "claim game" button on any non active games so a challenge list doesn't get cluttered. I am sure P&S had this feature.....

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 5:45 pm
by Jabster
Cablenexus wrote:I learned most by diving directly in MP skirmish battles. Your opponents are strong and you can learn from their moves.

I learned more in one MP battle then in a thousand tutorials.
I do fancy a bit of multiplayer when I’ve learnt the ropes a bit more. One thing I’m weary of, after playing Combat Mission, is how to avoid the players who think there’s fun in sealclubbing.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 5:45 pm
by GiveWarAchance
devoncop, I tried like you said to use javelins vs elephants but the players know that so they charge into melee quickly with elephants so you can't throw javelins at them. The rough terrain idea is good if available. I'm having a battle out in a desert wasteland with no cover so there is an elephant, actually two but one in particular has a serious issue with Romans, routing my units one after another. I even hit the rear of the elephants with a fresh cavalry causing zero damage and the cavalry unit literally self-destructed over several turns and routed themselves. :cry:

I could use some tutoring on anti-elephant tactics.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 6:01 pm
by SnuggleBunnies
Well, never use cavalry to engage elephants, they'll get slaughtered. Even if they flank attack engaged elephants, they will not cause a cohesion drop. As you say, skilled players will attempt to either screen their elephants with lights or quickly get them into melee. Pin them with infantry, and then flank attack them with other infantry. Infantry attacking engaged elephants in the flank/rear do cause an automatic cohesion drop. Decent melee infantry can hold out against elephants for a long time, even if they don't cause any casualties; use that to your advantage. Successfully routing an elephant unit can turn the whole tide of battle, with all friendly units 2 squares in every direction taking a cohesion test.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 6:03 pm
by devoncop
Don't ever use Cavalry v Elephants....Elephants frighten horses (as do Camels). If you are fighting Roman Elephants depending on who you are fighting with you have a good chance of being able to outnumber their skirmishers...leaving your Light Javelins to hit the Elephants...

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 6:04 pm
by GiveWarAchance
SnuggleBunny, thanks that's very good advice.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 6:07 pm
by GiveWarAchance
devoncop, thank you. No more horses vs elephants for me. I actually am Romans fighting against the insidious Seleucids and they have two of those monsters rampaging. This battle is definitely lost for me also cause of their powerful phalanx units, but it was a learning experience and thanks for the tips from you and Snuggles.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 6:12 pm
by devoncop
No worries....Learning and seeing your results improve is half the fun...☺

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 6:25 pm
by Cheimison
GiveWarAchance wrote:The 3 painful lessons I learned from MP: never set up open challenges cause people accept them and don't play them, do not chase skirmishers in the beginning of battles, and just accept that elephants will kill off your troops with impunity.
Elephant battles are hilarious, they never really end, the oliphants suck at attacking unless it's a rear charge, and charging them is suicide, so they just end up locked in these eternal 4-damage melees.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 6:28 pm
by GiveWarAchance
In another game, some elephants just crushed my infantry in a wooded area whilst remaining unscratched themselves. Okay they had support from a flank attack, but still it was a giant asswhooping from the giant rascals.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 6:29 pm
by the_iron_duke
It can be useful to create a blank scenario as a sandbox to test out various units and terrains. Set it as a Hotseat game to control both sides. Any time you want to check something out you can return to the editor and add to the scenario whatever troops or terrain you want to test.

Re: Ideas for how to learn the game?

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 6:37 pm
by Jabster
the_iron_duke wrote:It can be useful to create a blank scenario as a sandbox to test out various units and terrains. Set it as a Hotseat game to control both sides. Any time you want to check something out you can return to the editor and add to the scenario whatever troops or terrain you want to test.
I do rather like that idea and I was also thinking about saving the game at each turn to try different tactics. The dicussion about elephants in this thread just shows how much I have to learn.