Increasing number of figures displayed

TimDee58
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by TimDee58 » Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:17 am

This looks extremely interesting, a few questions please....

1 - Will it work with Belisarius dlc?
2 - Will it work with Rise of AI?
3 - Will it work with TT Mod?

It may be worth actually setting up a new game install for this and just modding that version of the game to allow me to play Vanilla as usual, has anyone tried this?
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Paul59
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by Paul59 » Thu Jul 19, 2018 12:33 pm

TimDee58 wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:17 am
This looks extremely interesting, a few questions please....

1 - Will it work with Belisarius dlc?
2 - Will it work with Rise of AI?
3 - Will it work with TT Mod?

It may be worth actually setting up a new game install for this and just modding that version of the game to allow me to play Vanilla as usual, has anyone tried this?
The Mass Effect Mod is just a modded Squads.csv file. This file contains all the unit properties for the units used by the game.

So;

1) It looks like this Squads.csv file contains all the Belisarius DLC units, so it should work for the Belisarius DLC.

2) The Rise of AI Mod, as far as I know, does not use it's own Squads.csv file. So the two mods should work together.

3) The TT Mod uses its own Squads.csv file, with hundreds of new units. So the only way to get the two mods working together would be to edit the TT Mod Squads.csv file to show the increased number of figures per unit. If you wanted to do that I would advise you to wait a couple of weeks, because I will be releasing a new version of the TT Mod soon.


cheers

Paul
Scenario Designer - Age of Belisarius, Rise of Persia, and Wolves at the Gate.

TT Mod Creator

TimDee58
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by TimDee58 » Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:18 pm

Thanks Paul, as ever you are on the ball
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rbodleyscott
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by rbodleyscott » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:35 am

WARNING: These mods should not be used in MP games unless your opponent is also using exactly the same version of the mod.

The mods are not purely visual, they alter the ManCount value in the squads file, and this may cause anomalies if both players are not using the same version of the squads file. Pi-R's mod also alters the formations callback script.

In situations where the players are using different builds, the replays may not work correctly. This is important because they are not merely replays. In fact what the game saves at the end of each player's turn is the situation at the start of their turn, and the list of actions taken during the turn.

The replay actually re-creates the situation at the end of the enemy turn. It starts from the position at the start of the enemy turn, then runs through the player's actions in turn, eventually getting back to the position at the end of the enemy turn. Because random number generators generate the same sequence of random numbers if you start from the same seed number, if you do everything the same, in exactly the same order, the result will be exactly the same as happened in the player's turn. The game then continues from the position re-created by the replay.

This is fine as long as the players' builds are identical. However, if the players' builds differ, then, like a butterfly beating its wings on the other side of the world, the results and the final positions may be different. So not only will the other player see different results from those seen when the opponent played his turn, but the situation at the start of the player's turn (prior to automatic resolution of melees, routs and pursuits) will actually be different from what it was at the end of the opponents' turn.

Hence the in-game warning. It should be heeded.

Hence also the reason why we advise players not to mod their main build, but to put their mods in user content modules (which the engine calls "campaigns"). If this is done, the MP system will prevent players from accepting a challenge unless they have the same user content module installed.
Richard Bodley Scott

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76mm
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by 76mm » Sun Aug 12, 2018 12:27 pm

I have not installed this mod, but just completed an MP game against someone who apparently has installed it. A few comments:

1) The mod also affected the visual representation on my side, at least with some units: skirmisher units had twice as many figures as normal, but at least some other units were unaffected. Also, some of my opponent's cav units were surrounded by a weird "purple haze" (really!). These effects were mildly irritating, but nothing I could not deal with.

2) The second issue was more significant: I watched as my opponent charged one of my units with one of his fragmented units--I was so surprised by this that I re-watched the replay and saw the same thing again (I would have recorded it but do not know how to do so...). When I asked my opponent about this, he said that he had not done so, and would not have done so even if he could have (indeed, it would have been a dubious tactical decision under the circumstances). This leads me to believe that my opponent and I were seeing different results in our game, which is obviously a significant issue.

Based on my limited experience so far (one game!), I won't be playing any more MP games against people with this mod.

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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by pipfromslitherine » Mon Aug 13, 2018 3:08 pm

I will investigate. I thought I prevented mods from working in MP at all, but I may be wrong. It certainly shouldn't allow people to play with changes applied without complaining. Did any error messages come up?


Edit: Missed RBS's post. The game will definitely not work correctly with different mods running. It sounds like disabling them in MP would cause consternation. I will try and think of a better solution to prevent inadvertent issues.


Cheers

Pip
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by rbodleyscott » Mon Aug 13, 2018 3:18 pm

pipfromslitherine wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 3:08 pm
I will investigate. I thought I prevented mods from working in MP at all, but I may be wrong. It certainly shouldn't allow people to play with changes applied without complaining. Did any error messages come up?


Edit: Missed RBS's post. The game will definitely not work correctly with different mods running. It sounds like disabling them in MP would cause consternation. I will try and think of a better solution to prevent inadvertent issues.


Cheers

Pip
I suspect that the user in question has modded his main build rather than using a proper user content folder, because the MP system would not allow a player without the user content folder from accepting the challenge. And I believe that warnings were issued by the MP system.

Likewise I don't think it can have been a global mod, because you did disable global mods in MP.
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by pipfromslitherine » Mon Aug 13, 2018 4:37 pm

rbodleyscott wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 3:18 pm
pipfromslitherine wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 3:08 pm
I will investigate. I thought I prevented mods from working in MP at all, but I may be wrong. It certainly shouldn't allow people to play with changes applied without complaining. Did any error messages come up?


Edit: Missed RBS's post. The game will definitely not work correctly with different mods running. It sounds like disabling them in MP would cause consternation. I will try and think of a better solution to prevent inadvertent issues.


Cheers

Pip
I suspect that the user in question has modded his main build rather than using a proper user content folder, because the MP system would not allow a player without the user content folder from accepting the challenge. And I believe that warnings were issued by the MP system.

Likewise I don't think it can have been a global mod, because you did disable global mods in MP.
Understood. I will hold off doing anything unless asked.

Cheers

Pip
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76mm
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by 76mm » Tue Aug 14, 2018 2:07 pm

Yes, the MP system issued a warning. The player involved said to ignore the warning, because the mod that triggered the warning only modified visuals on his end; I wasn't that worried about it, because it was a normal MP game, not a tourney, etc. I just wanted to warn other people about my experience. I definitely would not want to repeat the experience in a tourney context.

TimDee58
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by TimDee58 » Thu Aug 30, 2018 2:34 pm

Hi I love the look of this Mod and am desperate to integrate it with TTMod+ 1.3.9.

However (because i'm useless with spreadsheets) I cannot figure out how to add the data to the spreadsheet using Open Office and then generate a useable csv file.

I must be stupid but its just not happening.

I like to look of this Mod and would suggest that it would be a useful combination of Mods......

Having given this mod extensive thought over quite a long period can I suggest the following unit sizes please:

Pikes 16
Heavy and Medium Drilled Infantry: 12
Heavy & Medium Irregular Infantry 14 (incl Warbands, Hillmen, Mobs, Rural Levies etc)
Light Infantry: 5
Elephants: 2
Heavy Chariots: 1
Light Chariots: 2
Massed Archers (Drilled) 8
Massed Irregular Archers: 7
Cataphracts & Companion Type Cavalry 7
Other Heavy Cavalry 5
Light Cavalry: 3
Artillery: 1

I honestly feel that this would look right for the game.
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by rbodleyscott » Thu Aug 30, 2018 2:39 pm

TimDee58 wrote:
Thu Aug 30, 2018 2:34 pm
Hi I love the look of this Mod and am desperate to integrate it with TTMod+ 1.3.9.

However (because i'm useless with spreadsheets) I cannot figure out how to add the data to the spreadsheet using Open Office and then generate a useable csv file.

I must be stupid but its just not happening.

I like to look of this Mod and would suggest that it would be a useful combination of Mods......

Having given this mod extensive thought over quite a long period can I suggest the following unit sizes please:

Pikes 16
Heavy and Medium Drilled Infantry: 12
Heavy & Medium Irregular Infantry 14 (incl Warbands, Hillmen, Mobs, Rural Levies etc)
Light Infantry: 5
Elephants: 2
Heavy Chariots: 1
Light Chariots: 2
Massed Archers (Drilled) 8
Massed Irregular Archers: 7
Cataphracts & Companion Type Cavalry 7
Other Heavy Cavalry 5
Light Cavalry: 3
Artillery: 1

I honestly feel that this would look right for the game.
It would also entail modding the FORMATION_CALLBACK() function in Callbacks.BSF, because the current code only supports formations for units starting with 2, 4, 8, 12 or 16 figures. Other sizes will just produce amorphous blobs of men unless the function is modded to support them.
Richard Bodley Scott

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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by TimDee58 » Thu Aug 30, 2018 2:46 pm

understood sir, thanks
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TimDee58
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by TimDee58 » Sat Sep 01, 2018 7:10 pm

I've merged the mods and they do work (I'm relieved to say), however some of the unit sizes do create weird looking formations (not only when static but especially when moving - using the modded callback file that the author posted earlier).

How do i access and edit a bsf file please, can anyone enlighten me?

Ignore that question, Ive managed to open the file and frankly it's gobbledegook to me..... I may need to rethink unit sizes
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by jjaquemond » Sun Sep 02, 2018 6:58 pm

Great to see you're working on combining the Mods!

Any reason you're not using the original mod's formation/sizes?

Heavy and Mid Infantry: 12
Light Infantry: 7
Warbands/Pikes: 16 (unchanged)
Elephants: 3
Heavy Chariots: 1 (unchanged)
Light Chariots: 2
Aux. Archers: 8
Cavalry: 7
Light Cavalry: 3
Artillery: 1 (unchanged)

Cavalry and light infantry being in more 'unformed' units didn't seem that odd to me - in fact seemed more appropriate.

Looking forward to this :)

TimDee58
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by TimDee58 » Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:18 am

@ Pi-R,

I have sent you a private message mate, i hope you get time to read it, thanks in advance.

Tim

ALSO - AN OPEN QUESTION FOR THOSE MUCH CLEVERER THAN ME

Despite using the callback file downloaded from this thread I seem to be getting formations different to those illustrated in the 'strip images', these:
Image

In other words, a 5 figure cavalry unit is displayed as 1 - 3 - 1 and not 2 - 3 (front rank - rear rank - see image) which i'd hoped for

Have I (as usual) overlooked something?
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TimDee58
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by TimDee58 » Sat Sep 29, 2018 5:12 am

this is a request to the ME / Callback author for clarification on my previous question please
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by Pi-R » Tue Oct 02, 2018 6:50 pm

Hi Tim,

As I already told you in a private message what you see is the default behavior of FOG2 as formations have only been defined for 2, 4, 8, 12 and 16 figures per unit.

These are defined in FUNCTION FORMATION_CALLBACK in callbacks.bsf that is located in ...\Field of Glory II\Data\Battle\Scripts. With every update of FOG2 this file can be overwritten in that location.

I don't know if it can also be kept in a campaign folder in ..\Documents\My Games\FieldOfGlory2\CAMPAIGNS because then it would not be overwritten when a new version of FOG2 becomes available.
Richard do you know if this is possible? Maytbe putting it in a folder Scripts in the campaign folder?

For now I have created a new version based on the latest version of callbacks.bsf, i.e the one from FOG2:Rise of Persia.
Callbacks.zip
(10.47 KiB) Downloaded 24 times
For each future version the below code needs to be inserted in FUNCTION FORMATION_CALLBACK of the latest version of callbacks.bsf, before the line stating
"if (GetAttrib(me,"Reversing") == 0) // If not reversing"

Code: Select all

	if (manCount == 3)
		{
			if (IsLightTroops(me) == 0)
				{
					if (moraleState == 0)
						{
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 0, -18);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 0, 14);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 0, -2);
						}

					if (moraleState == 1)
						{
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, -4, -18);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 0, 14);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 4, -4);

						}

					if (moraleState == 2)
						{
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, -4, -16);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, -8, 20);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 0, -4);

						}

					if (moraleState > 2)
						{
							// Use default blob
						}
				}
			else
				{
					if (moraleState == 0)
						{
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 2, -18);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, -4, 14);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 4, -2);
						}

					if (moraleState == 1)
						{
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 6, -16);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, -2, -4);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 0, 14);
						}

					if (moraleState == 2)
						{
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 6, -16);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, -8, 12);
							SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 0, -4);
						}

					if (moraleState > 2)
						{
							// Use default blob
						}
				}
		}
		
	if (manCount == 5)
		{
				if (moraleState == 0)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 8, -10);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 8, 6);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, -8, -18);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, -8, 14);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, -8, -2);
				}

				if (moraleState == 1)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 10, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 8, 10);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, -12, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, -8, 4);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, -10, 14);
				}

				if (moraleState == 2)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 8, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 12, 20);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, -8, 26);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, -12, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, -16, 4);
				}

				if (moraleState > 2)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 16, 20);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 2, -8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, -6, 4);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, -16, 22);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, -26, -14);	
				}
		}

	if (manCount == 7)
		{
			if (moraleState == 0)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 8, -18);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 8, 14);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 8, -2);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, -8, 22);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, -8, -26);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(5, -8, 6);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(6, -8, -10);
				}

			if (moraleState == 1)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 10, -20);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 8, -6);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 12, 14);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, -8, 26);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, -12, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(5, -8, 4);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(6, -10, -8);
				}

			if (moraleState == 2)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 10, -20);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 12, 20);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 8, -10);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, -8, 26);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, -12, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(5, -8, 4);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(6, -16, -8);
				}

			if (moraleState > 2)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 16, -20);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 20, 14);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 2, -8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, -16, 22);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, -16, -14);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(5, -18, 4);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(6, -26, -8);	
				}
		}

	if (manCount == 14)
		{
			// Positions reorganised so that men can be removed in order
			if (moraleState == 0)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 18, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 18, 24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 18, -8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, 18, 8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, 6, 16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(5, 6, -16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(6, 6, 0);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(7, -6, 24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(8, -6, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(9, -6, 8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(10, -6, -8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(11, -18, 16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(12, -18, -16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(13, -18, 0);
				}

			if (moraleState == 1)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 20, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 18, 24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 14, -8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, 18, 8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, 4, 16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(5, 6, -16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(6, 6, 0);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(7, -8, 24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(8, -6, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(9, -2, 8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(10, -6, -8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(11, -18, 16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(12, -20, -16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(13, -14, 0);
				}

			if (moraleState == 2)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 20, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 18, 20);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 14, -8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, 18, 10);					
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, 4, 10);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(5, 6, -16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(6, 10, 0);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(7, -8, 20);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(8, -6, -24);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(9, -2, 4);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(10, -6, -8);			
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(11, -18, -16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(12, -20, 10);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(13, -18, -8);
				}

			if (moraleState > 2)
				{
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 24, -20);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(1, 16, 16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(2, 14, 0);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(3, 18, 10);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(4, -2, 4);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(5, 4, -6);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(6, -6, 0);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(7, -16, 22);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(8, -16, -14);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(9, -18, 4);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(10, -26, -8);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(11, -18, 16);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(12, -20, -12);
					SetFormationRowXYExtended(13, -18, 2);
				}
		}		
For each mancount there is a formation defined for several morale/disorder levels.

For moralestate = 0 the formations are usually very strict except when it is intended for units that should have loose formations.
The higher the moralestate the larger the departures from the strict formation.

Note there is no formation for mancount = 0 as this formation only has one figure displayed and that is placed in the middle of the square, similar to SetFormationRowXYExtended(0, 0, 0).

For SetFormationRowXYExtended(i,x,y), the number i is just an ID number for each figure in the formation (i = 0 for the first figure, i = 1 for the second figure etc.).
The number x defines the forward/backward departure from this middle of the formation. I believe negative numbers is more towards the front of the formation and positive numbers is more to the back.
The number y defines the sidewards departure from this middle of the formation. I believe negative numbers are more towards the left of the formation and positive numbers more to the right.
Although I may have swapped the effect of negative and positive numbers for both the second and third number.

So in a similar way one can define also formations for 6, 9, 10, 11, 13 and 15.

Pi-R

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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by TimDee58 » Wed Oct 03, 2018 1:44 am

Thanks, I'll have a look at this first thing in the morning
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by rbodleyscott » Wed Oct 03, 2018 12:00 pm

Presumably the modded Squads file also gets replaced by the vanilla version each time the game is updated.

The recommended way to do mods, which avoids such issues, and avoids breaking MP games, is to isolate the mod in its own folder(s) rather than modding your main build.

See:

http://archonwiki.slitherine.com/index.php/Modding

All you need to do is copy each folder that you want the mod to apply to from /Campaigns in the main build to /Documents/My Games/FieldOfGlory2/CAMPAIGNS

Then you can put modded scripts and squads file into each such folder as shown in the file tree at the end of the above page.

So, say for example you wanted to mod the sandbox campaigns folder:

Copy the whole "2MPSRiseOfRome" folder from /Campaigns to /Documents/My Games/FieldOfGlory2/CAMPAIGNS and change the folder name to "Modded2MPSRiseOfRome".

Then put your modded Squads.csv file into that folder, and your modded Callbacks.BSF file into /Modded2MPSRiseOfRome/DATA/BATTLE/SCRIPTS.

et voila.

(If that doesn't work you might also need to copy $DEFAULT.BSF into the latter folder)

You will need to do this for each folder that you want the mod to apply to.

These will then appear in the list of available modules, as the second one of the name. If you want it to have its own name, you need to change the IDS_CAMPAIGN_NAME string in Text1.txt in the modded folder (and also in Text9.txt if there is one there and it has an IDS_CAMPAIGN_NAME string).
Richard Bodley Scott

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TimDee58
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Re: Increasing number of figures displayed

Post by TimDee58 » Wed Oct 03, 2018 12:11 pm

Indeed Richard, thats exactly what i do
Georgia's Tale (You Tube Link) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qsWSme56lnc

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