Diplomacy Open Beta

Field of Glory: Empires is a grand strategy game in which you will have to move in an intricate and living tapestry of nations and tribes, each one with their distinctive culture.
Set in Europe and in the Mediterranean Area during the Classical Age, experience what truly means to manage an Empire.

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Daniele
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Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by Daniele » Thu Dec 12, 2019 10:44 am

Field of Glory: Empires developers didn't rest on their laurels. As previously anticipated, the next big thing about Empires is the Diplomacy Update, designed to enhance greatly the way the game makes players and AI kingdoms interact through diplomatic efforts. You won't have to wait any longer as today is the D(iplomacy)-day.

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Since this update is significantly massive and would probably affect the overall balance and gameplay mechanics in multiple ways, we opted for releasing the Update as a public Open Beta. Everyone willing to help us with feedback and thought is very welcome to download it and to try it.

The update is a separate installer, meaning that it will be like downloading a separate game, so no one will be forced to play with the Update in place if that is not his intention.

The Diplomacy Version can be downloaded in the members area section accessible through the "My Page Area". We have created a dedicated sub-forum thread here.

But how the new Diplomacy system work? What are the new features and mechanics that would be added in the update?

I – Legitimate ownership
Now when you are at war and conquer a region, it is flagged as ‘war-occupied’. It means that if you were to make a peace which returned the original regions to each side you would also cede back the conquered region. Said differently you no longer instantly gain regions you conquer in a war; it must be claimed during the peace negotiation.
Note that during a peace deal, you can also ask any region owned by the opposing side and are not restricted to demanding just what you managed to conquer.

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II – Warscore
When war erupts, a warscore will appear in the Diplomacy Interface. That’s the measure of how the war is going on. A positive value means you are winning (slightly or substantively, depending of the value). A negative value means you are losing. Three things affect warscore:
Region conquests
Leader deaths
Battles

Warscore is used as the currency when settling peace.

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III - Peace Treaty
When a side wants to settle peace, and once you have clicked on the ‘Peace’ button, a new panel will open showing you the current warscore (although you can always see this from the main diplomacy interface), the stance you are adopting in the negotiation and a list of possible clauses.

If you are winning the war (positive warscore), you can ask the defeated to give, relinquish or accept clauses for your benefit. There are 12 possibilities so far.

If you are losing the war (negative warscore), then you can only cede items (including regions). You can’t bargain and ask for a few things while mostly giving away other items.

As you ask for items, as the winner, your warscore allowance will reduce towards zero. In turn, you’ll change stance progressively, as you are demanding more and more things. Initially, you’ll be set in a Generous or Conciliatory stance, but it can shift to ‘Extorting’, if you are pushing the limits.

There are two interests in staying within a not too demanding stance. First, the acceptance chance by the defeated is much bigger. Second, this will have a profound effect on the new relationships between you and the vanquished. If you don’t care they hate you for a long time, then try to pressure them to the maximum. But if you want the peace to be a long lasting one, then you might want to stay with a conciliatory stance.

Once you are satisfied with the items requested or given up, validate the treaty. There will be a one turn delay before the other side sees it, and then another turn to receive their answer.

There can be 3 kinds of answers
Yes, No, Counterproposal.

The first two are rather self-explanatory. As for the third, it means the other nation perceives some interest in your proposal but is not quite satisfied with some entries. The counterproposal issued, if you accept it, will be the final Peace Treaty.
If you disagree with the new terms, you too have the options to say simply No. Or to issue another counterproposal.

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IV – Transaction Treaty
The transaction treaty is very similar in concept and in format with the Peace Treaty. It can be issued between two nations which are not at war. Here too, you have to play with a currency, which is not the warscore, but ‘Bargain Points’.
The main difference compared to a Peace Deal is that in this transaction, or trade, both sides can ask and give at the same time. So this is a rather free-form deal, where you can give away a region, in exchange of some gold and … why not, some war elephants?

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V – Possible Clauses
There are twelve possible clauses. Most can be used in both treaties, but some are restricted to only one type. (T) means it is only available in a transaction treaty while (P) means it will only be available in a peace deal. If nothing is indicated, both treaties support the clause.

Client-State: The nation becomes a client-state of the other nation.

Cooperation Treaty (T): As part of the transaction, add a cooperation treaty.

Alliance (T): As part of the transaction, enter a mutual alliance.

Absorb the other nation: The proposing nation is completely absorbed into the other nation. In practice it means being removed from the map!

Ask (or Give) Money, Metal, Manpower: A straightforward clause where you ask (or give) one of the three.

Humiliate (P): This will cause a loss of legacy, and a portion of the lost points will be received by the requester.

Regions: Cede or give a region (or several) that you legitimally own.

Province: A convenience Clause that will add at once all possible (and legit) regions of a given province.

Units: Provide or request special units. The other side doesn’t have to have the actual units in his army but he needs to be able to produce them. Only provincial units and a very few special units can be requested. There will be an extra fee of 75 Money per unit to be paid by the gifter, so as to cover recruitment and transportation cost (abstracted).

Disband (P): Accept or demand the other side disband part of his army or fleet. The cost will vary with the size of the enemy military and the percentage to disband. Units will be disbanded randomly until the required percentage is reached.

Bivox
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by Bivox » Thu Dec 12, 2019 6:35 pm

I really like what you are adding to the game and your dedication to it. Pretty awsome work until now. I really like the ambitions you are adding to nation like Armenia.

Just I have a proposition to add : adding governors to provinces and loyalty to them and general. In the Ancient world and even until medieval age , over ambitious generals, governors and powerfull aristoracts were as much dangerous to a nation as foreign powers. Back-stabbing politics , espionage and treasons will be a nice touch to the game.

I really like also improving more how different goverments worked from republics like Rome and Carthage to Monarchies like Seuleucid and Macedonia. Have each it's own strength and weaknesses. Like monarchies can have Dynastic marriages with other monarchies like Seuleucid and Maurya did but one the down side they risk civil wars with pretenders when a king died.

Republic would be more stable but be prone to elections and struggle between different classes and political parties. Rome had a lot of class struggle and political bickering between rival parties.

Geordietaf
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by Geordietaf » Thu Dec 12, 2019 6:46 pm

I have set up an open challenge in Beta MP called Diplomacy 101 if anyone would like to have a run with the new rules

lostangelonline
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by lostangelonline » Fri Dec 13, 2019 1:35 pm

Geordietaf wrote:
Thu Dec 12, 2019 6:46 pm
I have set up an open challenge in Beta MP called Diplomacy 101 if anyone would like to have a run with the new rules
Just accepted.

So far, I just switched earlier to the beta steam version (it seems options are reset, so if I plan to switch between release and beta, it'll be faster to stick with default settings) and played a few quick turns with Iberii(?) in SP and fully conquered the 2-regions neighbor in the east.

The only notable change I've noticed (besides the ones listed above in the release notes) is that "Just conquered" penalty was replaced with "Conquered" penalty (-15 loyalty, -25% food/infr./comm., -50%culture) who only went away after I fully conquered the original owner (who did not accept my peace offer to cease his 2nd region). This will put some more pressure on the winner to seek peace faster and conquer fewer regions than before.

Since my peace deals were not accepted, the war was automatically over/won after conquering his last region, just as before. While at war, I could still create the province with the new conquered region, just as before. I could still "fully" manage the new region, just as before (except the temporary "Just conquered" was replaced with the "permanent" "Conquered").

My first impression: since nothing was made less realistic (only more realistic with the new diplomatic options, while "Conquered" seems more realistic to be permanent while war is still ongoing even after decades, due to original owner still fighting to liberate his conquered people who will not accept new ruler while old ruler did not abandon them by signing peace), I am completely happy with the changes so far.

EDIT/correction: switching between release and beta is very easy & fast, settings are not reset (just that when you open the Beta the first time, it is like the game was installed and run the first time, settings were not imported/kept from Release version)
Last edited by lostangelonline on Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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gregb41352
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by gregb41352 » Sat Dec 14, 2019 12:09 am

I bought this on Steam but it doesn't seem to give an option to opt in to the beta.
Also, where do I find my serial number so I can register of game with Matrix?
Many thanks.

choppinlt
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by choppinlt » Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:05 am

Bivox wrote:
Thu Dec 12, 2019 6:35 pm
I really like what you are adding to the game and your dedication to it. Pretty awsome work until now. I really like the ambitions you are adding to nation like Armenia.

Just I have a proposition to add : adding governors to provinces and loyalty to them and general. In the Ancient world and even until medieval age , over ambitious generals, governors and powerfull aristoracts were as much dangerous to a nation as foreign powers. Back-stabbing politics , espionage and treasons will be a nice touch to the game.
+1
Great work and dedication! :D Kudos for this patch on international diplomacy, but I don't mean to jump too far ahead by agreeing that the addition of internal politics could add even greater depth and exciting possibilities. 8)

lostangelonline
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by lostangelonline » Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:33 am

gregb41352 wrote:
Sat Dec 14, 2019 12:09 am
I bought this on Steam but it doesn't seem to give an option to opt in to the beta.
To play the Beta on Steam: in your Steam games list, you'll have to right-click on "Field of Glory: Empires" > "Properties.." > "Betas" tab > in the "Select the beta.." drop-box select "beta.." > Close > Play.
To switch back to release version, repeat the above and select "None.." in the drop-box.
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alrope
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by alrope » Sun Dec 15, 2019 11:14 pm

Is it possible to participate in the beta with a GOG version of FOG Empires?

Pocus
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by Pocus » Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:46 pm

alrope wrote:
Sun Dec 15, 2019 11:14 pm
Is it possible to participate in the beta with a GOG version of FOG Empires?
Sorry no, there is no beta for the GOG version.
AGEOD Team - Makers of Empires, ACW2, WON, EAW, PON, AJE, RUS, ROP, WIA.

Pocus
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by Pocus » Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:47 pm

gregb41352 wrote:
Sat Dec 14, 2019 12:09 am
I bought this on Steam but it doesn't seem to give an option to opt in to the beta.
Also, where do I find my serial number so I can register of game with Matrix?
Many thanks.
You are better to contact support here, I would not like to say stupid things:
support@slitherine.co.uk
AGEOD Team - Makers of Empires, ACW2, WON, EAW, PON, AJE, RUS, ROP, WIA.

Culthrasa
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by Culthrasa » Thu Jan 02, 2020 12:06 am

Hey all,

Been playing a lot of FOGE beta over the holidays and thought i give some feedback...

First off, It is an absolute improvement. I really like the added diplo options!
Two things could use some improvements imho.
- An auto-return from proposals to the diplo screen, similar to rejecting/accepting a co-operation request.
- In a peace deal provinces are quite expensive, especially when the other nation is quite small. Currently no way to take for example 2 provinces from a 5 province minor, which means the easiest thing is just to conquer it totally. Perhaps a extra WS based upon difference in army strength/territory or something. It is just not logical that a small nation would prefer total annihilation instead of just losing half their territory when facing a juggernaut.

Keep up the good work!

Pocus
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by Pocus » Tue Jan 07, 2020 9:25 am

Thanks for the feedback. Glad to see Diplomacy is adding a lot :D

In the new round of beta testing, regions and thus provinces will be cheaper, rest assured.
AGEOD Team - Makers of Empires, ACW2, WON, EAW, PON, AJE, RUS, ROP, WIA.

rilos
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by rilos » Thu Jan 09, 2020 8:22 am

The features outlined here seem like a wonderful addition.

Seamus
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by Seamus » Wed Jan 15, 2020 6:14 pm

Oh HELL YEAH! :)

Just started up a new campaign Balanced as Rome. Didn't realize how big an improvement this is; accidentally let Senones have peace without ceding Picenum :P

Whoops, but ah well, easy to reload.

This is AWESOME! This is exactly what this game needed!

USGrant1962
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by USGrant1962 » Tue Jan 28, 2020 8:08 pm

I've had time to play a bit of the Diplo Beta(s) over the last couple of weeks. Overall a great improvement.

One thing that seems a little off is the peacetime deals for "absorb nation" and "become client state". Because the mid-game and later are awash in resources it turns out that the player can easily buy client states, and ultimately absorb nations, with units/manpower/metal/money. I like the mechanism, but the result seems a little too certain when laid on top of the current resource model. I know Pocus has been tweaking the resource model so perhaps that will be adjusted further.

Another suggestion to tone this down would be to cap the deal success chance at say 80%, and perhaps have a bigger relationship penalty for failed offers.

USGrant1962
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by USGrant1962 » Mon Feb 03, 2020 11:05 am

I have what appears to be a minor display bug in the beta. I just went from Stable to Glorious as Skythia (still Level 1 tribal horde) and it is displayed in the CDR table in yellow, like I'm in a Golden Age.
turn 164 became glorious (2).jpg
turn 164 became glorious (2).jpg (645.1 KiB) Viewed 386 times

Bullseye500
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Re: Diplomacy Open Beta

Post by Bullseye500 » Sat Feb 08, 2020 11:20 pm

Solved.

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