"Another one" - Plaid vs Morris

After action reports for Commander Europe at War.

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supermax
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Post by supermax » Sat Aug 20, 2011 10:43 pm

Keep it going Plaid.

Veyr interesting AAR.

You are my "brother" games, we need to defeat Moriss in both our games.

From the outlook of it, things are not looking so bad for you right now. You should be able to put a strong outing in Russia. Stronger than me thats for sure!

What is your plan in order to defend Italy against allies, since Tunis can now easily be taken from Vichy France? You always have been superb in defense against me in Italy. But now that Tunis is a surrender city, what do you normally do?

This is a major sore spot in my strategic thinking as well. The way i see this, Tunis has to be taken before any armistice or surrender with the french. I am planning to have the Italians occupy the place on the very turn they can make it happen.

Also, when the time comes, 1942 should see some attacks by the western powers. You do anything different in the new MOD version? The cover the beaches strategy doesnt work as well as before obviously...

supermax
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Post by supermax » Sat Aug 20, 2011 10:47 pm

rkr1958 wrote:
_Augustus_ wrote:C'mon now. No reason to get overexcited and take eye off the ball. The beast is in the east...

_augustus_
This sums up my take on Morris' strategy. He seems he is trading Britain's sacrifice for a weaker and / or later Barbarossa. In fact I would bet the he's hoping that you go for Sea Lion or Close the Med. My take is that he plans to win this with Russia and bring in the USA when you've been weaken by the Russian.

Right now the UK has been weaken and is not a threat. One way to exploit this is to build up for an execute an early spring 1941 invasion of Russia.
Only way to fend it off in my opinion is to do a quick and cheap invasion of Britain, and grind your way down in France. All of it has to be done in 1940, so you can really attack the Russians in 1941. Then anything goes if you can hit the bear hard enough.

Plaid
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Post by Plaid » Sun Aug 21, 2011 5:42 am

About defence of Italy - there are several ways.
Sicily can be defended with really strong force (including german units, SS maybe) together with massive garrisons. So you go for block the beaches with some counterattacking power in case few garrisons will be destroyed on the very shore (they cant destroy them all at once, really). Also keeping high tech italian subs around is effective - it helps agains navy doing shore bombardment (they lose effectiveness very swift), also subs can block critical shore hexes (this, from which landing to 3 Sicily hexes possible, for example).

Another way is placing defencive DAK (like 3 infantry, fighter, mech maybe) in Tobruk area and stopping 8 army here.

If allies go offencive early you can probably defeat them and force retreat to Nile or even further (like in our game with Victor). It will seriously delay Torch or Husky of any sort, likely.

In winter your air assets are basically free in russia, so they can be redeployed for other area, and its really great argument when dealing with early allied invasions - in 1941/42 4 bombers can turn the tide with minimal help of ground units.

3rd important thing is blocking western pass to the MED (via Gibraltar) with reasonable italian naval force in most narrow placed. Allies will break through eventually maybe, but they will lose time and you will be warned.

Plaid
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Post by Plaid » Sun Aug 21, 2011 1:24 pm

Well it turned out, that apart from BEF there is british SAC at Trondheim. Another infantry and Rundstedt's HQ shipped to do something with this troops. Also 2 luftwaffe bombers are here to gain some free experience when attacking british GAR.

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Our yugoslavian campaign also going fine, as we reached Belgrade outskirts and may start assault on the city next turn.

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UK troops reach Tobruk, I am start thinking about finally sending DAK. Defeating 8th army (and I believe Morris will use it very reckless way) will allow to close the Suez atleast, well delaying any allied intervention in MED region.

Plaid
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Post by Plaid » Sun Aug 21, 2011 2:53 pm

Despite MUD weather campaign in Yugoslavia going good. Belgrade will fall this or next turn for sure.

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I decide to slightly change my traditional axis strategy for this case - we will NOT invade Greece, neither we send any troops to Lybia (conquest of Greece is really useful for long campaign in Lybia, since it allow to quickly redeploy airpower from USSR).
It will help us to save some PPs for really important campaigns, also with allies aiming (like I was told) for landing in France in 1942 I shall not care too much about MED. Reasonable defences on Sicily with some naval presence will work for now.

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Post by leridano » Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:15 pm

So you will go for a strong Barbarossa. Hope you will be lucky about the weather so you can start Barbarossa in may (even better in april!). The sooner you start kicking the butt of the soviets the better results and the faster progress you will make. Starting Barbarossa in 2 june or even worse in 22 june is not so effective and playing against Morris could be a mistake to delay Barbarossa unnecessarily.

Another question is that starting that soon will give you a chance to try something in Moscow.

And finally, a carefully planned 1st turn of Barbarossa is crucial: you have to destroy the more mech units you can even using paradrops for avoiding retreats and for easing encirclements.



    Plaid
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    Post by Plaid » Sun Aug 21, 2011 5:50 pm

    Yes I aim for may at the moment.

    Actually only sort of "something" I like to do with Moscow is bombing the place into 0 income.

    Attack through all this forests usually hurt, if there are any reasonable defences. Also soviets can quite easily retake the place during SW.

    Plaid
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    Post by Plaid » Mon Aug 22, 2011 6:45 am

    Belgrade still holds at 1 step, but will fall next turn.

    Image

    Some action near Tobruk and continues bombing campaign at Bergen.

    Next turn we are starting to actually plan our eastern campaign and build troops for it.

    There is an option to send some strike force to Lybia and defeat british near Tobruk, but why? There is no RN in whole MED (just checked with italian subs), so they simple can't land in Sicily even if they try.

    I also reinforce defences of Sicily with 2 italian INF and mech (now its in build queue).

    Plaid
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    Post by Plaid » Mon Aug 22, 2011 8:58 am

    Yugoslavian campaign finally closed.

    Image

    Now its time to plan USSR invasion.

    Damaged Italian troops evacuate from Lybia.

    I have noted that Malta fighters actually have 6 air combat value. It means that Morris build some labs for UK (at least air one).

    Plaid
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    Post by Plaid » Mon Aug 22, 2011 11:20 am

    Axis resistance in Lybia will collapse soon. At least we were able to do some damage and to evacuate corps and mech.
    With proper use of RN, which stands now idle somewhere, I would have no chance to evacuate anything.

    Image

    This time Bergen finally reached by german troops in Norway, and defenders reduced to 5 steps and 0 effectiveness.

    Current plans are to launch Barbarossa late April if weather allows. It means that we have 6 turns left and next turn I start to actually build troops.

    Most likely and builds of labs / subs will be delayed until Barbarossa launched - now PP needed to purchase troops and generals.

    Plaid
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    Post by Plaid » Mon Aug 22, 2011 1:58 pm

    In Lybia axis forces are pushed more and more :

    Image

    In Norway Bergen is about to fall.

    This turn first builds done for Barbarossa:

    3 x Armour
    5 x Corps
    2nd para division

    Manstein rectuited as 3rd commander for Barbarossa (together with Model and Rundstedt)

    Also started build of 3rd italian SUB.

    Plaid
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    Post by Plaid » Tue Aug 23, 2011 11:02 am

    More reports from Lybia :

    Image

    3 more infantry built this turn for Barbarossa. We will keep building infantry now until the very April.

    Plaid
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    Post by Plaid » Thu Aug 25, 2011 8:16 am

    Operation Barbarossa launched

    I had fair weather only on May 13, which troubled deploying troops for Barbarossa (some hexes had winter weather still), but still we were ready to start at May.

    Initial disposition of german forces :

    Image

    Army group North under general Model's command. This group is rather strong with many corps, 2 armour units, 1 mech, paratroops and elite.
    Initial goal is destruction of soviet corps and mech units in Latvia and Belorussia.

    Image

    Army group Center's commander is general Manstein. Solid luftwaffe support attached to the group, aswell as small but elite group of italian troops under Ambrosio's command. Initial goal of this troops will be capture of Lvov city and destruction of soviet MECH forces near Vinnitsa.

    Image

    Northern wing of army group South consist of german troops (commander - general Rundstedt). Their goal is to overcome soviet resistance near Chisinau with infantry forces and then destroy or block mech/corps units there with paratroops and armour, they have at hand.
    Group of Hungarian troops will take care of soviet garrisons in Carpathian mountains.
    Southern wing of AGS is made of entirely romanian troops, whos goal is to advance in direction of Odessa and Chisinau from the south.

    Results are following :

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    German troops succesfully destroyed many soviet mech and corps formations in border combats, though less cities were captured, then usual. I tryed this strategy first time, but I believe that destruction of MECH unit, for example, is much more valueable, then owning of 1 PP city for couple of additional turns.

    In MED allies still can't capture Tripoli. RN formations detected in the region, but we recently commisioned new italian sub flotilla, which will help to deal with any invasion.

    Image

    German research :

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    I did not built any labs prior to launching Barbarossa, to have a chance to build enough troops in time.
    Now we should catch up. Previous turn I built general lab, and this turn - infantry one. This builts consumed most of humble 110 PP german income so far.

    Plaid
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    Post by Plaid » Thu Aug 25, 2011 1:53 pm

    Barbarossa goes on, with more soviet troops destroyed and cities captured

    Image

    Image

    All objectives skipped on turn 1 are now secured by german troops, even though with slight casualties (1 step here and there).

    Now its time to redeploy airpower and rally troops around commanders for phase 2 of Barbarossa - we are pushing straight to borders of 3 supply zone.

    This turn 3rd armour lab was built for germany. Rest PPs were used to build reserve infantry corps.

    Crazygunner1
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    Post by Crazygunner1 » Thu Aug 25, 2011 8:12 pm

    Nice opening on Barbarossa Plaid, looking good. Not to mention the time of the early start. Next turn is the 22June so when Barbarossa should have started. :D

    I always love the early start, everything is "hunky dory" until you cross the Dnepr all of the sudden you don´t have enough troops to cover the line. So what line of attack will you use? What targets have you set before winter?

    Crazyg

    Plaid
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    Post by Plaid » Fri Aug 26, 2011 6:17 am

    This turn progress little slowed down, as luftwaffe was used to attack soviet navy. Baltic fleet is now completely destroyed, while black sea one - badly damaged.

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    Cities like Odessa, Kiev, Kherson, Tallin still captured this turn. AGS main armour force upgraded near Minsk, while infantry march to the area.

    I can't say much about my targets before I see any soviet defences.

    ferokapo
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    Post by ferokapo » Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:20 am

    Plaid wrote:[...]
    I can't say much about my targets before I see any soviet defences.
    Why are you choosing your targets only once you see his defenses? For sure, one must adapt to a specific situation, but IMHO without defining strategic targets of your own, you loose the initiative, despite being on the offensive.

    Plaid
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    Post by Plaid » Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:23 am

    Allies are trying to land on Sicily!

    Image

    Luftwaffe assets railed from the East and general Reichenau called from Berlin to coordinate them.
    Sicily local italian garrison also alarmed and cover most of beaches. How many invasion points have UK this early? 1 or 2 i believe. It will be costly to land any real force on Sicily.

    More reserves (including wehrmacht infantry and mechanized formations) will be deployed for the area, our goal is decisive victory over british 8th Army!

    In USSR german forces almost reached their 1941 destination points :

    Image

    Image

    Sevastopol cut off from USSR mainland and can't be reinforced with new units. The fortress will fall!

    I totally don't want to enter 3 supply zone (never ended good in my recent games). Remaining objectives for 1941 campaign are : Sevastopol; Dnepropetrovsk; Smolensk; Novgorod and Leningrad if there is no defences around the city.
    Last edited by Plaid on Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

    Plaid
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    Post by Plaid » Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:25 am

    eisenkopf wrote:
    Why are you choosing your targets only once you see his defenses? For sure, one must adapt to a specific situation, but IMHO without defining strategic targets of your own, you loose the initiative, despite being on the offensive.
    Thats because I play way unpredictable person. As you see now I have to heavily commit to MED campaign at cost of eastern front, or I will lose Italy prior to Christmas.

    ferokapo
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    Post by ferokapo » Fri Aug 26, 2011 9:49 am

    Plaid wrote:
    eisenkopf wrote:
    Why are you choosing your targets only once you see his defenses? For sure, one must adapt to a specific situation, but IMHO without defining strategic targets of your own, you loose the initiative, despite being on the offensive.
    Thats because I play way unpredictable person. As you see now I have to heavily commit to MED campaign at cost of eastern front, or I will lose Italy prior to Christmas.
    To be honest, I think you made a mistake there. The threat of invading Italy is a weak one, and more of a diversion. Consider his forces: Some INF, some FTR, some CV. I am convinced that you could easily hold them at bay until winter, and then send the Luftwaffe there to deal with them decisively. In my humble opinion, I think you should have used the Luftwaffe to achieve more in Russia.

    EDIT: Admittedly, I forgot the Canadian MECH, so he's got two MECH. But I still think a couple of German INF is sufficient to deal with that threat ;-)

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