Britcon table size - time for something new?
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Britcon table size - time for something new?
OK, as there is a fair body of opinion amongst players that 800 points on 6x4 tables is leading to a lack of variety in armies and a lack of variety in game play - and this is leading to players drifting away from the game.
However, to date, in GB at least, no "big competition" has taken the plunge and changed the format, which can only reinforce the status quo and the downward trend.
Therefore, I'd suggest that it needs a big, high profile, competition to break this trend - and in GB it doesn't get bigger than Britcon. So how about we suggest that for Britcon this year the FoG:AM games are played on 5' wide tables? I'd perhaps even suggest that depth is reduced to 3'6" as well.
Alternatively, if people really cannot drag themselves away from 6x4 I'd suggest 900 points, however, I think table size is the thing to change.
And just to pre-empt one argument - "The Worlds" do not mandate any particular format, so there is no need to follow what has gone before because Britcon is also "The Worlds" this year.
However, to date, in GB at least, no "big competition" has taken the plunge and changed the format, which can only reinforce the status quo and the downward trend.
Therefore, I'd suggest that it needs a big, high profile, competition to break this trend - and in GB it doesn't get bigger than Britcon. So how about we suggest that for Britcon this year the FoG:AM games are played on 5' wide tables? I'd perhaps even suggest that depth is reduced to 3'6" as well.
Alternatively, if people really cannot drag themselves away from 6x4 I'd suggest 900 points, however, I think table size is the thing to change.
And just to pre-empt one argument - "The Worlds" do not mandate any particular format, so there is no need to follow what has gone before because Britcon is also "The Worlds" this year.
Nik Gaukroger
"Never ask a man if he comes from Yorkshire. If he does, he will tell you.
If he does not, why humiliate him?" - Canon Sydney Smith
nikgaukroger@blueyonder.co.uk
"Never ask a man if he comes from Yorkshire. If he does, he will tell you.
If he does not, why humiliate him?" - Canon Sydney Smith
nikgaukroger@blueyonder.co.uk
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Any reason why a common table size should be used, assuming you have themes?
Western medieval, classical world, etc, would be good on 5x4, even 4x4. Steppes, Ghilmen, eastern medieval, etc, type armies are fine on 6x4, but 5x4 would make for a different challenge.
Mix it up, make players think.
(And if you are running themes, have you considered one at 650AP on 5x3 or 4x3, with the same timetable? For those who prefer a more relaxed weekend.)
Western medieval, classical world, etc, would be good on 5x4, even 4x4. Steppes, Ghilmen, eastern medieval, etc, type armies are fine on 6x4, but 5x4 would make for a different challenge.
Mix it up, make players think.
(And if you are running themes, have you considered one at 650AP on 5x3 or 4x3, with the same timetable? For those who prefer a more relaxed weekend.)
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Nik
I agree that the current table size for 15mm is too big, I suggest you set up a poll with the varing suggested sizes, and see what people vote for.
On the subject of 650pts (5x3), yes I would enter if this was available at britcon, I would enter it- if it was open or in a period that I have figs for- and I would be keen on more games in that comp, if scheduling and no of players allowed that to happen.
Spike
I agree that the current table size for 15mm is too big, I suggest you set up a poll with the varing suggested sizes, and see what people vote for.
On the subject of 650pts (5x3), yes I would enter if this was available at britcon, I would enter it- if it was open or in a period that I have figs for- and I would be keen on more games in that comp, if scheduling and no of players allowed that to happen.
Spike
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do.
Benjamin Franklin
A fool and his money are soon elected.
Will Rogers
Pitty the fool!!!
Mr T
Benjamin Franklin
A fool and his money are soon elected.
Will Rogers
Pitty the fool!!!
Mr T
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Not keen on doing a 650pt comp at Britcon - purely for the selfish reason that we already have a 650pt tournament series in Scotland. Happy for it to be offered as one of the themes so others can opt for it.
Also OK with reducing table size. But only if terrain sizes, deployment and ambush limits are also reduced. If terrain pieces are not reduced in size they become proportionately larger for the table and we can end up fighting through loads of muck. Makes it even harder to get a result.
My suggestion is to offer
1. Open 650pt on 5'x3' tables
2. Other themes remain on 6'x4'
Also OK with reducing table size. But only if terrain sizes, deployment and ambush limits are also reduced. If terrain pieces are not reduced in size they become proportionately larger for the table and we can end up fighting through loads of muck. Makes it even harder to get a result.
My suggestion is to offer
1. Open 650pt on 5'x3' tables
2. Other themes remain on 6'x4'
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- Chief of Staff - Elite Maus
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If terrain rules stay the same less terrain will be able to fit. A 16" piece will not fit on a 5 or 6. It will also be the only terrain piece to fit on a side edge, whereas 2 are common at 6x4. As for deployment area, if you want to get to grips quickly deploy the full 10MU forward, helps foot armies, if you want some manouver don't.AlanCutner wrote:Also OK with reducing table size. But only if terrain sizes, deployment and ambush limits are also reduced. If terrain pieces are not reduced in size they become proportionately larger for the table and we can end up fighting through loads of muck. Makes it even harder to get a result.
A large number of themes does not offer much of a World Championship.My suggestion is to offer
1. Open 650pt on 5'x3' tables
2. Other themes remain on 6'x4'
phil
putting the arg into argumentative, except for the lists I check where there is no argument!
putting the arg into argumentative, except for the lists I check where there is no argument!
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I've just raised this exact point with the bhgs representative for the worlds.philqw78 wrote:It would also be nice to know what Britcon is going to offer for FoG AM. Are there any FoG AM players on the committee?
If they have an opinion then hopefully they will communicate with nobby / hammy to request a particular format for the worlds / britcon.
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Robert241167 wrote:Phil, a very large compulsory piece has a bigger impact on smaller tables and more or less guarantees something significant for terrain troops to utilise.
Rob
Exactly.
The idea of a different size table would be to change the dynamics of the game a bit, not to play the same game on a smaller table - i.e. to try and do something to alter the case we have of a lack of variety in armies and a lack of variety in game play.
Nik Gaukroger
"Never ask a man if he comes from Yorkshire. If he does, he will tell you.
If he does not, why humiliate him?" - Canon Sydney Smith
nikgaukroger@blueyonder.co.uk
"Never ask a man if he comes from Yorkshire. If he does, he will tell you.
If he does not, why humiliate him?" - Canon Sydney Smith
nikgaukroger@blueyonder.co.uk
At last a chance to bring back a bit of spice back into FOG I'm with Nic if it stay's the same people will move to other rules games ect.nikgaukroger wrote:Robert241167 wrote:Phil, a very large compulsory piece has a bigger impact on smaller tables and more or less guarantees something significant for terrain troops to utilise.
Rob
Exactly.
The idea of a different size table would be to change the dynamics of the game a bit, not to play the same game on a smaller table - i.e. to try and do something to alter the case we have of a lack of variety in armies and a lack of variety in game play.
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david53 wrote: At last a chance to bring back a bit of spice back into FOG I'm with Nic if it stay's the same people will move to other rules games ect.
If sir is not enjoying FoG:AM as it is currently offered, may I suggest FoG:R
Nik Gaukroger
"Never ask a man if he comes from Yorkshire. If he does, he will tell you.
If he does not, why humiliate him?" - Canon Sydney Smith
nikgaukroger@blueyonder.co.uk
"Never ask a man if he comes from Yorkshire. If he does, he will tell you.
If he does not, why humiliate him?" - Canon Sydney Smith
nikgaukroger@blueyonder.co.uk
Like a lot of people now trying out FOG R, no I've tried that as well, but I like ancients more and would like to play FOG but if the majority of events stick to 6 by 4 tables I'll just go back to LH armies again or might even try and get past the deployment part of MM rules.nikgaukroger wrote:david53 wrote: At last a chance to bring back a bit of spice back into FOG I'm with Nic if it stay's the same people will move to other rules games ect.
If sir is not enjoying FoG:AM as it is currently offered, may I suggest FoG:R