Allied: Bardia

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uran21
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Allied: Bardia

Post by uran21 » Fri May 03, 2013 3:40 pm

Please post here your comments about this scenario.

omegabet
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by omegabet » Fri May 03, 2013 8:38 pm

Thread for merge with this one: viewtopic.php?f=148&t=42333

It's true the American Equipment displayed too early & Australian can't be selected.

billmv44
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by billmv44 » Fri May 03, 2013 10:42 pm

General level. Starting prestige 3143, ending 2255. Triumph on 17/18.

This one was a bit tougher than any of the previous scenarios. Those forts are tough! They required very careful maneuvering of my infantry, arty and ships. Despite the many available deploy hexes, I chose to concentrate around the road. I was able to punch trough okay, but ran into those darn forts. They took some time to reduce. No losses, but lots of casualties. I used the Aussies as cannon fodder when necessary. Preserving my core units as much as possible.

My volunteer cruiser is still in my core force, but I did not see any deploy hexes for it.
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Ballacraine
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Ballacraine » Fri May 03, 2013 10:51 pm

omegabet wrote:Thread for merge with this one: viewtopic.php?f=148&t=42333

It's true the American Equipment displayed too early & Australian can't be selected.
Agreed. Too early for US units.

IIRC it was Operation Torch they made their entrance, when they suffered heavy casualties but fought bravely.

Balla. 8)

Zhivago
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Zhivago » Sat May 04, 2013 4:43 am

Can't buy Australian units, even though they are available for purchase and I have available core slots. What gives?

LostAgain
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by LostAgain » Sat May 04, 2013 5:33 am

Playing FM. I see it was previously mentioned but...American equipment is identified as available but is not, and Australian equipment can't be purchased either although the appropriate flag is there. Another "problem" I had with this scenario was the rude shock I got when I brought one of my auxillary Engineer units back to strength, 470 PP was a surprise I'd have wished to avoid! Had I know it would be that expensive I'd have left him at a strength of 8 instead of burning all that PP! This was the most challenging scenario to date, but that doesn't say a lot as I've found this DLC to be a major disappointment so far. I purchased EVERY DLC that Panzer Corp has brought out but so far I'm not sure I'd put out my hard earned dollars for what I've seen to date. I've looked at a few of the other comments and realize mine are harsher, but I'm pretty sure I'm not here to tell you what you want to hear, rather what it's important that you DO hear.

Ballacraine
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Ballacraine » Sat May 04, 2013 6:33 am

Yes, these early scenarios are simplistic, but it is important to remember that these early scenarios are weighted to get new players into the game.

Balla. 8)

Kamerer
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Kamerer » Sat May 04, 2013 7:10 am

6) Bardia– beta 1

Level: Field Marshal
Prestige: Begin: 1,250 (after purchases). End: xxx. Net: +500.
Result: DV 18/18, but only got "Victory" at end.
Replacement policy: Sent air, arty, tanks out at 12.

Core Changes:
Purchased:
  • 1x Engineer
    2x 6” Artillery
Problems:
  • • I tried to add replacements to an aux Aust. Infantry unit, and it was only allowing me to buy 1 strength point, for 470 prestige. Huh?
    • Tried to reinforce other units, was not allowed to.
    • Caputred all objectives, but only awarded “victory.”
General impressions/comments:
  • • This was a real blood bath without being able to reinforce units, or only marginally at exorbitant prices. Pretty sure that's NOT what is intended and a glitch.
    • Did take Bardia, (and all other objectives), but only “Victory” and not DV/Triumph was awarded. Not sure, but something's off here.

nikivdd
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by nikivdd » Sat May 04, 2013 11:39 am

Colonel level.
Upgrades:none
Purchases: a Matilda II and a Stirling
I didnt overstrength any units

Current core: 2x engineer, 2x 6inch artillery, 2x cruiser I, 1x Matilda II, 1x Hur I, 2x Beaufighter, 1x Stirling, 1x Vickers AA

I left the AA unit and a Beaufighter in the barracks. I am not going to repeat the previous comments of this thread except that it is somewhat annoying that the new UK units are not displayed. I also noticed a change in ingame reinforcements, especially for the auxiliaries. Therefore i needed to change my tactics somewhat because now it is really easy to lose aux units and i am not spending any points on ingame elite reinforcements.
I breached the frontline in two places and cleaned up some of the minefields. Progress is somewhat slow due to the fortresses in front of Bardia but my new level bomber could drain ammo and gain xp quickly. I do have the impression that the british engineers are not as efficient as their german counterparts. Fortunately i kept them backed up by artillery.
In the line of introductionary missions, i suppose this mission is hard enough. The few italian medium tanks tried but did not succeed to take out any of the soft units, at least they tried... Two italian units didnt come into action at all, the L3/35 and infantry unit at the northern edge of the map. The ships were welcomed assets in pounding harbour defenses. Thank you for this wonderful scenario.

Losses: an aux engineer. DV 15/18, 3409PP

Ballacraine
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Ballacraine » Sat May 04, 2013 12:28 pm

Not directly related to this scenario, but I just noticed that the Iron Cross is displayed on the unit card when a unit receives a medal.
Should really be a more generic gold coin with ribbon, I suppose?

Balla. 8)

Razz1
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Razz1 » Sat May 04, 2013 6:03 pm

General
start 3209
End 1963
Triumph

Lost two core engineers, but I pounded my way through. Considering it isn't a big deal to loose a unit now due to OS up to 15 for any unit I don't care about loosing those engineers. Besides one was a virgin for this map.

Making Aux units expensive to reinforce is a good idea on this map.

I bought a strategic bomber half way through the map. Figured I needed it, but I think another land unit would have been better.

I bought a Matilda to start this map along with Chevy WB
End map with:
2 fighters
1 strategic bomber
Vickers AA, kept in reserve
25lb
6"
Chevy WB
AC
Cruiser Mk I
Matilda
Vickers VI
2 British infantry. One of them was kept in reserve on this map.

Heros:
1D on Vickers Mk VI
1D and 3D on Crusier Mk I
1D on Rolls Royce AC
2D on Hurricane

Rudankort
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Rudankort » Sat May 04, 2013 6:07 pm

Ballacraine wrote:Not directly related to this scenario, but I just noticed that the Iron Cross is displayed on the unit card when a unit receives a medal.
Should really be a more generic gold coin with ribbon, I suppose?
That is because we are still using the old german skin instead of the new allied one. When that is finished, the awards will be displayed in a more meaningful way.

Ballacraine
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Ballacraine » Sat May 04, 2013 8:30 pm

I thought that would be the case.

Balla. :)

Longasc
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Longasc » Sun May 05, 2013 10:33 am

Bardia

Level: General
Start Prestige: 3687
End Prestige: 2058
Result: Triumph, 11/18
Bought/Upgraded/Losses: Bought a Matilda MkII which did very little if any good, upgraded 2 Infantries to Engineers and overstrengthened them to 15. Lost some Aux Engineers. 2738 Prestige at start of the scenario.

I like this scenario, plays nicely. Liked the duel of the two cruisers with the fortifications, the destroyer as spotter and the general mines/fortifications layout.
I also experienced for the first time reinforcements arriving "suppressed" and the effect this has on the defending unit. -> I am very concerned what this will mean for all defensive scenarios in Panzer Corps and the DLCs. Defending units are easier to destroy this way.

Some things are odd:

1.) "American Troops are available". Mentioned at the start of the mission, but you can't buy them nor will they ever show up. You can also not buy Australian troops, confusing. I also found it odd that I could only replace the Aussie Engineers with Elite replacements which could have caused problems if I wouldn't have had my own Engineers.
2.) I could move my recon unit and fully reinforce it in a desert tile, full ammo and full repair, is that new? Thought half ammo and no reinforcement after movement.
3.) 2:9 vs 3:6 are the odds of a 0 star 15 str Engineer vs a 10 str Engineer vs a bunker. If one unit moves closer it becomes 1:9 and a one-shot kill is highly likely. Unlikely the 10 str Engineers a 12,13,14 STR Engineer will be able to go on at near 100% efficiency for the next turns where the 10 str Engineers would have to reinforce or would be lessened in effectivity.
4.) Working as intended I suppose, but buying 1 STR point for a 2 STR Aussie Aux Engineer was shown to cost 470 prestige! Ugh! -> Tell me I should not expect Aussie reinforcements in the briefing or so?

^ as you can see the scenario is absolutely A-ok, the "American Troops" are odd and the changed mechanics for the first time show themselves in force in this scenario.
Also, very nice debriefing for a loss in this scenario! ;) ("In the old days an officer in your position would be tendered his service revolver and shown the way to an empty room where he would be expected to spend a very few minutes with himself. I liked the old days.")


Suggestion: Make the requirement for a Triumph to destroy the 3 huge forts as well.

Tarrak
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Tarrak » Mon May 06, 2013 12:14 am

Scenario: Bardia
Outcome: Vicotry on turn 18/18
Starting Prestige: 4031
End Prestige: 4167 (incl. victory reward)

Bought at the begin one Cruiser IV tank and upgraded two of my 25pdr guns to 6 inch guns with new transport. My core setup was as follows: 3 x Infatry, 1 x Engineer, 2 x Cruiser IV, 2 x RR recon, 2 x 6 inch gun, 1 x Hurricane MK.I, 1 x Beaufighter Mk.IF. Both guns and planes was overstregthen to 15, rest of the units left at 10.

From the technical point of view just what everyone already said: U.S. Units shows as available while they wasn't, some of the new british equipment doesn't trigger the window showing it's availability, the auxiliary australian forces can only get elite replacement in combat for insane costs per point.

The scenario seems to be a huge jump up in difficulty from the previous ones. The italian forts can be a real pain in the arse. Due to the mines, the terrain and enemy troops they are very hard to reach and keep pounding my units to pieces. Either i chosen the wrong approach route or had bad luck with rolls but they managed to badly shot my units and the other italian units made short work of them. I managed to lose one infantry and one Cruiser tank totally and get other of my units badly hurt. I had to replace the losses in combat multiple times to keep some of them alive. I think i managed to lose most of the auxiliary australian chaps too. At the end i was one turn short of a Triumph.

While the scenario itself certainly isn't to hard i think the jump in difficulty is way to high, at least for new players.

Edit: Played the scenario the second time. This time it went a lot better for me but i still managed to lose two core units. This time one RR recon car and one infantry unit. The fort gun fire is just volatile but i managed to pull off a Triumph at turn 14/18. A big part in that tho probably have my REALLY bad luck today:
wtf.jpg
Fun with the Dices
wtf.jpg (49.16 KiB) Viewed 1933 times
wtf2.jpg
Fun with the Dices part Deux
wtf2.jpg (48.63 KiB) Viewed 1933 times
I gave up talking screenshots of odd dice rolls after this two as i would have to take like 5 screenshots per turn at least.

So generally the scenario seems ok for me but it does include a high probability of core units loses due to the forts and as i already said it is a huge step up in difficulty from the previous scenarios.

uran21
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by uran21 » Mon May 06, 2013 6:28 pm

Thanks to all for feedback so far. I mentioned earlier how border between tutorial and other content is blurred. I look at this scenario as an advanced tutorial of sort. Concentrating effort and maintaining focus is the key here. This would made breach rather easy but slowed down and inside defensive perimeter there is some real fighting. If new player becomes to overconfident this scenario will force him to take more sober attitude towards fighting.

Some general informations about the campaign. This campaign is made for British and American units. Americans will join in Tunisia and will have separate entry point at Torch. At this point game gives info messages about US equipment because they are listed as core units in campaign file but in the future this will be filtered out as well as US elite units until they join the fight. Minor Allies were not included as core units. If they were than every next scenario would need to list them as combat nation for that scenario and how war progresses there would be to many of them. So much that it would cause problems in the UI because there is no room for all the flags. Also whole effect would be rather minor because they consist mainly from infantry. So they are included in the game only as auxiliaries.

Auxiliary engineers provided on this map have strength of 10 but max strength in editor was set to 1. So you cannot replace losses and to use them wisely until eventually they burn out. They are god for breaching in. That one point of (elite overstrength) replacement is allowed if unit gets its first star. But with this new mechanic experience is not mandatory anymore.

Have checked victory conditions and it seems they are fine.

produit
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by produit » Wed May 08, 2013 4:05 pm

Triumph 9/18. Ending prestige 1338. FM. Chess mode.
Bought a Strat bomber (Stirling) and 6 inches artillery, also upgraded an infantry to engineers.
Mainly playing with OS unit of 15 only. Lost only 15 points of core units : 1 Strat, 4 tanks, 3 infantry, 7 engineers. It seems that playing with OS units is a plus.
Scenario is quite easy. It was strange for me that there was no enemy airplane at all.

monkspider
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by monkspider » Fri May 10, 2013 4:25 am

Bardia

Level: General
Ending pretige 2268
DV on turn 18/18

This one was very tough for a tutorial mission! I managed a DV but only by the skin of my teeth and after taking horrendous losses. The forts on this one probably need to be toned down. A nicely designed scenario to teach players the idea of "schwerpunkt" and the need to focus your attack occasionally.

Tarrak
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Tarrak » Fri May 10, 2013 9:34 am

It's strange how different the outcomes on this map are for different people. Some says the missions is very easy and are scoring Triumph between turn 9 and 11 while others are having problems and barely managing a triumph at last turn. Of course the explanation could be different skill levels and/or core compositions but the difference seems to be way to high for me. I wonder if some counterattack or unit spawn trigger maybe only works sometimes or under special conditions virtually providing two different versions of this scenario.

I played it twice and both playthrough looked same to me but maybe anyone else can take some time and replay it to check if he encounter any differences.

Tarrak
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Re: Allied: Bardia

Post by Tarrak » Sat May 11, 2013 4:40 am

Played the scenario again in Beta 2. I still think the Italian forts need to be toned down a bit. Either reduce their strength to 8 or range by 1. At the moment they are plain deadly. Except of this the scenario seems fine to me.
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Bardia AC Beta 2 replay
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