Allied: Advance to Elbe

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Re: Allied: Advance to Elbe

Post by Gompel » Mon May 27, 2013 7:49 pm

Ok thanks for explaning. Didn't know that. Than I understand how it works and why you can't make it visible for playing axis.

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Re: Allied: Advance to Elbe

Post by okiemcguire » Wed May 29, 2013 9:52 pm

Advance to Elbe - Beta 4

Level: General
Prestige Begin: 7130 At Deployment: 135 End of War: 369
Results: Triumph 16/18...End of War, met Russians at river

Comments: Map was great and the axis forces deployed at good locations and not entirely passive. Again, good air power, artillery, and heavy tanks advanced the line.

Inf: Commando, Engineer, SE Ranger, HW Inf
Armor: 4 x Churchill IV, Comet I, Sherman Firefly, Tortoise, Crocodile, M4A3(76)W, M26, Daimler, 2 x M36 Jackson
Artillery: M7 Priest, Sexton, 2 x BL 7.2inch, 155mm M12 GMC, and Calliope
Air: Tempest V, 2 x SE Meteor, 1 SE P-51D Mustang, 2 x Mosquito VI S2, 2 x Lancaster III, and B-17G

Spread forces in small artillery backed groups from North to the South. Moved the entire line East easily defeating any axis forces encountered. Began a little tougher about halfway through. With their backs against the Russians, the axis forces were tough and depleted alot of my forces strength. In particular a Maus that took a lot to destroy.

Enjoyed the game...
(29.05.2013) Advance to the Elbe, Turn
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Staff Sergeant - Kavallerie
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Re: Allied: Advance to Elbe

Post by produit » Fri May 31, 2013 7:40 am

Beta 4, FM, Chess mode, Triumph 10/18, Ending prestige 1282.

Compared to Beta 3, this map is a promenade in the gardens. Enemy tanks do not attack, and thus I was able to destroy all enemy units piece per piece. I am still surprised that the Maus Tank didn't attack my Comet tank. With a Str of 10 and a exp. of 300, my losses should have been greater than his, and thus it should have attacked. I had 2 Comet tanks in front of him, on hexes (28,11) and (28,12). The difference on this map is also AA. Without exp. and reduced strength, they cannot inflict real damages.

Finally, this map was really easy for me, but it is perhaps good, as it should be the easy path of the campaign...

Perhaps a final remark on units exp. and heroes, from my unit list.

Heroes and exp. by unit types:
Infantry (4 units): Heroes (3,3,2,2) -> average of 2.5, Stars (3,3,2,2) -> average of 2.5 (only SE units that came a bit latter during the campaign)
Tank (9 units): Heroes (3,3,3,3,3,3,3,3,1) -> average of ~3, Stars (4,4,3,3,3,3,3,3,2) -> average of ~3
TD (4 units): Heroes (3,3,2,2) -> average of 2.5, Stars (3,3,3,3) -> average of 3
Artillery (7 units): Heroes (1,1,1,1,0,0,0) -> average of ~1, Stars (3,3,3,3,3,2,2) -> average of ~3
Fighters (4 units): Heroes (3,2,2,0) -> average of 2, Stars (3,3,3,2) -> average of ~3
Tac bombers (4 units): Heroes (3,3,3) -> average of 3, Stars (4,4,4) -> average of 4
Strat bombers (3 units): Heroes (2,1,0) -> average of 1, Stars (5,4,3) -> average of 4

From these statistics, we can see experience is quite good distributed (excepting perhaps Tac and Strat bombers) and that artillery and strat bombers have really a problem with heroes. Fighters are also not optimal. For exp., it is much more OK. As a result, as the gain of XP per attack must be different by unit types, should it not be the same for the heroes, and have a different hero level per category ?

If I am computing the nb of kills by unit type:
Infantry (575,480,330,222) -> average ~400
Tank (943,926,833,703,609,468,459,418,94) -> average ~600
TD (372,370,336,277) -> average 300 (only US TD from the UK campaign, thus coming later), but will still be smaller than tank.
Artillery (100,96,83,80,76,70,60) -> average 80 (only US TD from the UK campaign, thus coming later), but still really low.
Fighters (431,389,330,64) -> average 350 (not take the last, as it is a SE unit coming later)
Tac bombers (777,743,501) -> average of 650
Strat bombers (256,169,57) -> average of 150.

If we look to the numbers, Tank and tac bombers are the bests for heroes. The limits for heroes for Artillery should be 10 times lower than Tac and Artillery. This divisor should be 5 for Strat bomber, 2 for fighters and TD, and perhaps 1.5 for Infantry.
With different limits per unit, that would really help to have a better repartition for heroes.

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Re: Allied: Advance to Elbe

Post by Raven_427 » Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:03 pm


First impression: quite a bit of ground to cover .. but the germans will be weak this time .. ?

- perfect 1st turn, cleaning up almost everything visible.
- in turn 2, two axis SPAA attack stupidly. They inflicted no losses, just exposing themselfes to destruction in turn 3
- Crocodiles are to slow for my advancing speed .. ooops. Went through 2/3 of the map in 3 turns. Getting slower, closing to the elbe.
- Impressive Maus next to Halle, covered by a TA152, which is covered by an AA unit. Took a while, to get behind Halle, destroying the AA.
- T34/41 NW of Chemnitz perfectly shows desperate situation of the germans
- bypassing Leipzig in the south at turn 8, leaving 10 turns to clean up.
- Did not understand that russian fighters, crossing the map. Just some recon mission?

All in all, this one is relatively easy .. a bit disappointing as it is the last one. But having it harder, it would be to unrealistic. So, disappointment is my fault, having wrong expectations. It's fine the way it is!

So this is it. Hope, my notes on the campaign have been of at least some use (not really believing it, compared to the competence of some other testers). Looking forward to doing this again in the release version. Thanks for giving me the chance to participate in this beta test.

Best Regards

Private First Class - Opel Blitz
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Re: Allied: Advance to Elbe

Post by gunnytanner » Tue Dec 15, 2015 12:45 am

What is up with the Ivan unit?

Master Sergeant - U-boat
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Re: Allied: Advance to Elbe

Post by Molve » Sun Oct 22, 2017 9:05 am

I'm afraid the feedback made Slitherine gut this scenario completely.

The Germans just sit there. You simply race your M26s and Comets straight ahead (occasionally getting stopped by a mine field).

I think there was perhaps a single German tank with experience and firepower to be a threat - but since you scout ahead with your invincible planes, not even that is an issue.

The biggest issue on this map is running out of ammo. You reach the Elbe bridge by turn 9 (or possibly 10) - out of 18!

I realize this is quite too late to make changes anymore, but in this case I get envious by reading the first page of this thread, where there was an actual challenge.

Sorry, but this scenario was a huge disappointment.

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Re: Allied: Advance to Elbe

Post by Molve » Sun Oct 22, 2017 9:25 am

billmv44 wrote:I'm curious as to the purpose of the exit hexes at 37,19 38,19 and 39,19. I was expecting possibly a message to stop the Germans from escaping south to form a "National Redoubt" but I never got that message. Do they serve an purpose?
Since apparently nobody has noticed (enough to post back here):

I believe the designers have set up a lure - a Soviet flyby, some units you can attack as the Allied player. However, I can't find any evidence of any consequences of doing so (you still get the Triumph based on not killing the soviet infantry greeting you at the bridge).

Imagine a "corridor" of hexes going straight up from the marked Axis hexes until you reach impassable territory (the river Elbe), where the Soviet planes will spawn.

Now, the planes only spawn if the Allied player's ground offensive has reached the area, but with no actual Allied aircraft in the "corridor". This is because the Soviet planes are programmed to fly straight south, to the exit hexes. If there was an Allied bomber there, the game code would make the Soviet planes attack it, and presumably the designers did not want the Allied player to be able to say "the Ruskies fired first". You can have planes to the west and east of this three-hex wide "corridor" just fine and still trigger the event.

Btw, the Axis markings aren't actually necessary - they're just a nice gesture to give us a chance of finding out where the "corridor" is (and to wonder about the issue at all, I guess) - the editor "code" for exit/reserve hexes is separate from the marker overlays.

I didn't count the distance, but if they don't reach the exit hexes in just the one game turn, this creates an opportunity for the Allied player to fight some more units "just for fun". If he does not engage, well, then all they do is fly out through through the exit hexes the next turn.

I haven't experimented so I don't know if the distance actually means the Soviet units do spend a turn on the map, and if so, if there's space to position a bomber in such a way as to make the game attack it (hide a defending fighter "behind" (south of) the bomber, making sure any nearby German unit or flag is dead so they can't spot the fighter, and so you can say "they fired first" after all.

One experiment could be: What if you "block" the exit hexes by flying in your entire airforce to occupy them? The Soviets should fight their way to their destination - but this assumes reasonable combat odds, and since they aren't given any more experience than the Germans, it is unlikely they will ever attack a four-star Allied unit.

Perhaps the experiment will need you to allow the Luftwaffe to almost kill a bomber for you during the early part of the scenario, so you can reinforce it with green recruits? This way, you should be able to dangle an inexperienced bomber unit in front of the Soviets.

But again, if the distance means the Soviet units never spend a turn on the actual map, all this is moot.

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Re: Allied: Advance to Elbe

Post by huckc » Fri Dec 22, 2017 5:43 pm

I'm not an expert scenario designer, but I don't think there's anything to go by apart from what's in the script and victory conditions tab in the editor.

Guessing those exit hexes and soviet units were just a cut feature or minor flavor.

e: What would be really cool is if someone can actually beat the scenario as the Germans. Even at the default difficulty it seems next to impossible.

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