Range.

PC : Turn based WW2 goodness in the mold of Panzer General. This promises to be a true classic!

Moderators: Slitherine Core, Panzer Corps Moderators, Panzer Corps Design

Post Reply
stormbringer3
Sergeant - 7.5 cm FK 16 nA
Sergeant - 7.5 cm FK 16 nA
Posts: 220
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 7:00 pm
Location: Staunton, Va.

Range.

Post by stormbringer3 » Sat Sep 21, 2019 4:51 pm

When I have an artillery with a +1 range I hope for an A+3 as my second hero. If a second R+1 appears is that worthwhile or too much of a good thing?
Thanks for any opinions.

captainjack
Colonel - Ju 88A
Colonel - Ju 88A
Posts: 1557
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2012 7:42 am

Re: Range.

Post by captainjack » Sat Sep 21, 2019 5:39 pm

I've had 2 range heroes. They are very good for counter-battery and for suppressing AA,, also for forcing surrender of soft or lightly armoured units. While it's tempting to go for a big gun, these roles suit lighter guns with decent Rate of Fire since you want a lot of suppression rather than a few kills (and the higher ammo count means more shooting and less reloading). You also have some other interesting options like converting to a 3 range Stug3, 4 range 75mm or nebelwerfer etc.
The 3A plus range is probably better than 2R but you can have some fun with 2R.

RVallant
Administrative Corporal - SdKfz 232 8Rad
Administrative Corporal - SdKfz 232 8Rad
Posts: 155
Joined: Tue Jun 16, 2015 10:12 am

Re: Range.

Post by RVallant » Sat Sep 21, 2019 10:54 pm

2R artillery heroes can probably go behind your ground AA units and bombard over them, your 'front' artillery and then beyond the defensive unit. That can mean you can use them to fire when you need to reload the frontline artillery etc and you don't have any risk from air attack either.

On the attack they'll allow you to get an earlier shot off some days if they're self-propelled. :)

captainjack
Colonel - Ju 88A
Colonel - Ju 88A
Posts: 1557
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2012 7:42 am

Re: Range.

Post by captainjack » Sun Sep 22, 2019 7:47 am

I hadn't considered very long range SPArt (other than Stugs) due to the lower ammo on most SP units but a fast 5 range sp gun would make a very large part of the battlefield risky, at least for soft targets. There's always something new to learn.

hugh2711
Sergeant Major - Armoured Train
Sergeant Major - Armoured Train
Posts: 583
Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:45 pm

Re: Range.

Post by hugh2711 » Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:31 am

Much to my surprise I once had TWO +2 range heroes on 2 wurfrahmens. It was really bizarre. I do think the heroes come in batches in games, not so random. I have also had occassionally +2 range heroes on towed 17" or sig 38's. I tend to run with 4 towed and 4 mobile arty in GC

MaxF
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun May 21, 2017 10:47 pm

Re: Range.

Post by MaxF » Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:01 pm

I just got my first +1R hero and have it on a towed 15cm.
I'm very tempted to have it on a Niebelwerfer 15cm! when it will become available.
Also tempted to have it on a StugIII, but that's ok also without range, until the soviets get too powerful tanks (best thing is to have 2 StugIII together so they help each others).

Range is also useful on a Flak88, which makes it a 5 hexes range including the 1 movement, practically a 11 hexes wide!
But you can get the same range with +1movement.
In my last full GC East, I had 1 Flak88 + 1 15cm, both with +1 movement (without transport)

goose_2
Tournament Organizer of the Year 2017
Tournament Organizer of the Year 2017
Posts: 2645
Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2014 5:22 am
Location: Winterset, Iowa
Contact:

Re: Range.

Post by goose_2 » Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:47 pm

MaxF wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:01 pm
I just got my first +1R hero and have it on a towed 15cm.
I'm very tempted to have it on a Niebelwerfer 15cm! when it will become available.
Also tempted to have it on a StugIII, but that's ok also without range, until the soviets get too powerful tanks (best thing is to have 2 StugIII together so they help each others).

Range is also useful on a Flak88, which makes it a 5 hexes range including the 1 movement, practically a 11 hexes wide!
But you can get the same range with +1movement.
In my last full GC East, I had 1 Flak88 + 1 15cm, both with +1 movement (without transport)
+1 Range Niebelwerfer's or Wurfrahmen's are both great useful artillery for shredding soft and suppressing hard units. Enjoy
goose_2
Lutheran Multiplayer Tournament Organizer. :-)

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCRHQShaOv5PWoer6cP1syLQ

heinzrondorf
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Posts: 35
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2019 9:02 pm

Re: Range.

Post by heinzrondorf » Fri Dec 06, 2019 9:26 pm

MaxF wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:01 pm
I just got my first +1R hero and have it on a towed 15cm.
I'm very tempted to have it on a Niebelwerfer 15cm! when it will become available.
Also tempted to have it on a StugIII, but that's ok also without range, until the soviets get too powerful tanks (best thing is to have 2 StugIII together so they help each others).

Range is also useful on a Flak88, which makes it a 5 hexes range including the 1 movement, practically a 11 hexes wide!
But you can get the same range with +1movement.
In my last full GC East, I had 1 Flak88 + 1 15cm, both with +1 movement (without transport)
Personally I like to convert the first artillery units which receive +1R heroes into StuG IIIB as they then become a useful offensive unit. I just played through the Stalingrad scenarios with StuG III/StuH 42s with range heroes and they were awesome in that environment. That said, I can certainly understand why you would like to convert into a Nebelwerfer or Wurfrahmen though. It's also a good choice.

goose_2
Tournament Organizer of the Year 2017
Tournament Organizer of the Year 2017
Posts: 2645
Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2014 5:22 am
Location: Winterset, Iowa
Contact:

Re: Range.

Post by goose_2 » Fri Dec 06, 2019 10:43 pm

heinzrondorf wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 9:26 pm
MaxF wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:01 pm
I just got my first +1R hero and have it on a towed 15cm.
I'm very tempted to have it on a Niebelwerfer 15cm! when it will become available.
Also tempted to have it on a StugIII, but that's ok also without range, until the soviets get too powerful tanks (best thing is to have 2 StugIII together so they help each others).

Range is also useful on a Flak88, which makes it a 5 hexes range including the 1 movement, practically a 11 hexes wide!
But you can get the same range with +1movement.
In my last full GC East, I had 1 Flak88 + 1 15cm, both with +1 movement (without transport)
Personally I like to convert the first artillery units which receive +1R heroes into StuG IIIB as they then become a useful offensive unit. I just played through the Stalingrad scenarios with StuG III/StuH 42s with range heroes and they were awesome in that environment. That said, I can certainly understand why you would like to convert into a Nebelwerfer or Wurfrahmen though. It's also a good choice.
The interesting thing about my Manstein playthrough is that I was able to get a ton of heroes for multiple units, over 100 by the start of 45. Because of this, I have experimented a lot with various units. Nebelwerfer's by a great deal are the most effective weapon at getting a 3rd hero. I have two with 3 heroes, and one poised to get a 3rd in Berlin. My StuG3B Range hero did not get awarded a 2nd hero until late 45 so the chance of getting effective heroes with your Range StuG's is almost nonexistent. Wurfrahmen's received their 2nd hero rather quickly and are poised to receive 3 heroes in Berlin. Probably.

So I think StuG3B are great, I use them in almost every scenario for their cheap effective defensive posture. But they do not acquire heroes quickly at all.
goose_2
Lutheran Multiplayer Tournament Organizer. :-)

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCRHQShaOv5PWoer6cP1syLQ

MaxF
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun May 21, 2017 10:47 pm

Re: Range.

Post by MaxF » Sat Dec 07, 2019 3:48 pm

goose_2 wrote:
Fri Dec 06, 2019 10:43 pm

The interesting thing about my Manstein playthrough is that I was able to get a ton of heroes for multiple units, over 100 by the start of 45. Because of this, I have experimented a lot with various units. Nebelwerfer's by a great deal are the most effective weapon at getting a 3rd hero. I have two with 3 heroes, and one poised to get a 3rd in Berlin. My StuG3B Range hero did not get awarded a 2nd hero until late 45 so the chance of getting effective heroes with your Range StuG's is almost nonexistent. Wurfrahmen's received their 2nd hero rather quickly and are poised to receive 3 heroes in Berlin. Probably.

So I think StuG3B are great, I use them in almost every scenario for their cheap effective defensive posture. But they do not acquire heroes quickly at all.
How do you get so many heroes, is it because of Manstein difficulty level?

dalfrede
Sergeant First Class - Panzer IIIL
Sergeant First Class - Panzer IIIL
Posts: 395
Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2017 7:48 pm

Re: Range.

Post by dalfrede » Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:51 pm

MaxF wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 3:48 pm
How do you get so many heroes, is it because of Manstein difficulty level?
Heroes come from kills, Manstein has AI with +5 strength units.
So yes, with 50% more strength points to kill, you get more kills, more kills more heroes.

MaxF
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun May 21, 2017 10:47 pm

Re: Range.

Post by MaxF » Sat Dec 07, 2019 5:35 pm

dalfrede wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:51 pm
MaxF wrote:
Sat Dec 07, 2019 3:48 pm
How do you get so many heroes, is it because of Manstein difficulty level?
Heroes come from kills, Manstein has AI with +5 strength units.
So yes, with 50% more strength points to kill, you get more kills, more kills more heroes.
Thank you. I guessed some Manstein bonus. I'm already letting the AI to reform its units in battle to 'farm' them, sometimes.
I will increase the enemy strenght then. (That means, in my current game, from the end of 1940 GC.)

captainjack
Colonel - Ju 88A
Colonel - Ju 88A
Posts: 1557
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2012 7:42 am

Re: Range.

Post by captainjack » Sun Dec 08, 2019 5:56 am

Stug 3 with a range hero is very handy. A 3 range nebelwerfer is probably even better once the 21cm is available, although a 3 range 75 (or a 25 pounder) with loads of ammo and 110% RoF is good against soft targets and worth a try.

For me a range hero on AA is better on a 7/1 AA than on an 88 (or allied equivalent) as you have enough mobility to provide defensive cover for mobile groups (which the 88 isn't good for) and attack enemy air over a decent area.

Post Reply

Return to “Panzer Corps”