Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

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LynxCom
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Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by LynxCom » Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:25 pm

Some thoughts about a speed of infantry... :idea:

Regular (basic) infantry is cheap, it needs only 3 CP per unit and has solid stats (not great but still solid). It has 6 movement points so regular inf is...pretty much fast? It is same fast as Valentines, Cromwells, KVs, some Shermans, LVTs, etc. From what I know a ww2 infantry div. on march averages 25 km (15 miles) per day. Of course there were longer marches but they were made by elite units. A regular infantry unit was more exhausted after longer marches (and less prepared for an instat fight).

So my idea for regular infantry units is:
- to change speed of regular infantry to 4 movement points
- to give them "Forced March" ability (able to turn on/off like mortar beside heavy inf) which will increase speed to 6 movement points but decrease combat efficiency one point per move.
- this will increase a value for buying trucks or halftracks for infantry (we know we players barely buy trucks or HTs for our inf units).

Opinions?

GabeKnight
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Re: Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by GabeKnight » Sun Sep 27, 2020 8:12 pm

Slow infantry like the engineers or constant eff. loss like moving through jungle? I think the "unreliable" trait on the tanks is annoying enough.

In my opinion, you could try to change it yourself, play a few scens like that and give feedback then.

A "weapon/instantrevert" switch unit with the "unreliable" trait, for example, should give you what you want.

EDIT: Sorry to say, but whatever the historical etc. explanations, it's just impractical. You DO NOT want your infantry units moving two-hex/turn or losing eff. every turn. Never had engineers moving w/o transports? Through diff. terrain or forests it's just one-hex/turn. That's just annoying in a GAME.
Last edited by GabeKnight on Mon Sep 28, 2020 7:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

kondi754
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Re: Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by kondi754 » Sun Sep 27, 2020 8:15 pm

LynxCom wrote:
Sun Sep 27, 2020 6:25 pm
Some thoughts about a speed of infantry... :idea:

Regular (basic) infantry is cheap, it needs only 3 CP per unit and has solid stats (not great but still solid). It has 6 movement points so regular inf is...pretty much fast? It is same fast as Valentines, Cromwells, KVs, some Shermans, LVTs, etc. From what I know a ww2 infantry div. on march averages 25 km (15 miles) per day. Of course there were longer marches but they were made by elite units. A regular infantry unit was more exhausted after longer marches (and less prepared for an instat fight).

So my idea for regular infantry units is:
- to change speed of regular infantry to 4 movement points
- to give them "Forced March" ability (able to turn on/off like mortar beside heavy inf) which will increase speed to 6 movement points but decrease combat efficiency one point per move.
- this will increase a value for buying trucks or halftracks for infantry (we know we players barely buy trucks or HTs for our inf units).

Opinions?
+1
I believe that the general idea is correct, you should just check the values you write about so that they don't disturb the balance of the game
And second issue, what to do then with other types of infantry, how to change their coefficients? Lower mp for Hv Inf to 2?

prestidigitation
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Re: Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by prestidigitation » Sun Sep 27, 2020 8:18 pm

From what I’ve seen infantry has the same move speed but the mech move type seems much faster than the foot move type even with the same number of move points. My foot infantry certainly can’t keep up with my mech units. Even my airborne guys are regularly hopping in their trucks to keep up.

terminator
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Re: Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by terminator » Mon Sep 28, 2020 4:11 am

Light infantry is a designation applied to certain types of foot soldiers (infantry) throughout history, typically having lighter equipment or armament or a more mobile or fluid function than other types of infantry, such as heavy infantry or line infantry. Historically, light infantry often fought as scouts, raiders and skirmishers—soldiers who fight in a loose formation ahead of the main army to harass, delay, disrupt supply lines, and generally "soften up" an enemy before the main battle. After World War II, the term "light infantry" evolved, and now generally refers to rapid-deployment units (including commandos and airborne units) that specifically emphasize speed and mobility over armor and firepower. Some units or battalions that historically held a skirmishing role have kept their designation "light infantry" for the sake of tradition.

cutydt02
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Re: Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by cutydt02 » Mon Oct 12, 2020 5:47 am

In afrika korps, even regular inf with truck cant keep up with my tank, halftrack can but not worth. Its madness when all regular inf just move as fast as engineer of heavy inf. About reality, its true but about mechanic ? Not so. A Totally nightmare in large map (in afrika) and jungle map (in pacific)
Last edited by cutydt02 on Tue Oct 20, 2020 6:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

Protonic2020
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Re: Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by Protonic2020 » Sun Oct 18, 2020 2:34 pm

cutydt02 wrote:
Mon Oct 12, 2020 5:47 am
In afrika korps, even lignt inf with track cant keep up with my tank. Its madness when all regular inf just move as fast as engineer of heavy inf. About reality, its true but about mechanic ? Not so. A Totally nightmare in large map (in afrika) and jungle map (in pacific)
Good point, depends on the tank itself now but in general it must be one overlooked game mechanic that should get tweaked, i think. Halftracks and such would win the "race"any day top speed wise and just considering the tanks weight (muddy roads, terrain etc.).

Admiral_Horthy
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Re: Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by Admiral_Horthy » Wed Oct 28, 2020 7:37 pm

That is why I am developing a new infantry movement system. Roads are no longer an advantage for walk, must rely on horses, bikes, trucks, motorcycles, wagons, sleds whatever for faster road movement. Useful for pre motorization (WWI, Boer wars ets)

Horst
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Re: Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by Horst » Wed Oct 28, 2020 10:01 pm

Admiral_Horthy wrote:
Wed Oct 28, 2020 7:37 pm
That is why I am developing a new infantry movement system. Roads are no longer an advantage for walk, must rely on horses, bikes, trucks, motorcycles, wagons, sleds whatever for faster road movement. Useful for pre motorization (WWI, Boer wars ets)
You can tweak the road factor for each chassis type, like foot, wheel, track, etc. including also the difference for each climate. It's also possible to add completely new chassis types, what I did like all-wheel drive, horse, light_foot, etc.
What is unfortunately not possible - and would be most important (*sigh*) - is modifying the road factor for each terrain type. If you are used to hex-games like Panzer General and its clones, (rail-)roads simply overwrite the underlying terrain speed mods there what this game doesn't do; it only multiplies the terrain's base cost.
E.g. if you want to make certain terrain almost impassable for certain chassis types, even a road with speed factor of 0.5 (reduces cost by half) can still turn every movement there into a crawl despite a road. Too bad about OoB and can't do anything about this without godly intervention.

StuccoFresco
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Re: Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by StuccoFresco » Thu Oct 29, 2020 6:50 am

Horst wrote:
Wed Oct 28, 2020 10:01 pm
Admiral_Horthy wrote:
Wed Oct 28, 2020 7:37 pm
That is why I am developing a new infantry movement system. Roads are no longer an advantage for walk, must rely on horses, bikes, trucks, motorcycles, wagons, sleds whatever for faster road movement. Useful for pre motorization (WWI, Boer wars ets)
You can tweak the road factor for each chassis type, like foot, wheel, track, etc. including also the difference for each climate. It's also possible to add completely new chassis types, what I did like all-wheel drive, horse, light_foot, etc.
What is unfortunately not possible - and would be most important (*sigh*) - is modifying the road factor for each terrain type. If you are used to hex-games like Panzer General and its clones, (rail-)roads simply overwrite the underlying terrain speed mods there what this game doesn't do; it only multiplies the terrain's base cost.
E.g. if you want to make certain terrain almost impassable for certain chassis types, even a road with speed factor of 0.5 (reduces cost by half) can still turn every movement there into a crawl despite a road. Too bad about OoB and can't do anything about this without godly intervention.
How did you create a new chassis types? You just add a line in the chassis.csv and reference to its name in the units.csv?

Horst
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Re: Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by Horst » Thu Oct 29, 2020 2:39 pm

StuccoFresco wrote:
Thu Oct 29, 2020 6:50 am
You just add a line in the chassis.csv and reference to its name in the units.csv?
Yes, add your new line with followup-id to all chassis files for each climate. These are unfortunately not displayed in the game, hence don't need any text entry.

StuccoFresco
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Re: Forced March (and Infantry Speed)

Post by StuccoFresco » Thu Oct 29, 2020 3:12 pm

Cool, thank you very much!

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