Very frustrated...

Field of Glory: Empires is a grand strategy game in which you will have to move in an intricate and living tapestry of nations and tribes, each one with their distinctive culture.
Set in Europe and in the Mediterranean Area during the Classical Age, experience what truly means to manage an Empire.

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76mm
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Very frustrated...

Post by 76mm » Fri Nov 20, 2020 4:03 am

I've played three games as Rome now, all of them have played out about the same--great until about turn 100, then a stalemate of "whack-a-mole" with rebelling regions and declarations of war until about turn 130, then the wheels come off.

I've read the manual a couple of times now, no help. Some enemy armies that can't be beaten, ever. My capital not loyal, ever. Can't earn "progress tokens" except by taking objectives too far away to make it worth it. Every game I've tweaked my play based on my last reading of the manual, and some things have improved, but ultimately absolutely no difference in the end. So far this is far too much work to be any fun for me.

Before giving up in frustration, I wanted to see if anyone can point me to a more thorough strategy guide than I've been able to find that might show me the error of my ways?

Pocus
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by Pocus » Fri Nov 20, 2020 2:37 pm

Don't give up, the game is very nice once you get the hang on things :wink:

You can check these guides here. I would suggest you read the beginner tips guide and also the one on Decadence!
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1011390/guides/


Also Rome can be tough at start, you can try Macedonia or Egypt.
AGEOD Team - Makers of Empires, ACW2, WON, EAW, PON, AJE, RUS, ROP, WIA.

Gray Fox
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by Gray Fox » Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:26 pm

This is a guide I did here at Slitherine:

http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtop ... 63&t=98599

Plenty of veteran gamers will be glad to give you advice. The game is epic. Good luck!
For new players: Grand Strategy AAR and Steam Guide: Tips for new players

76mm
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by 76mm » Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:50 pm

Pocus wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 2:37 pm
You can check these guides here. I would suggest you read the beginner tips guide and also the one on Decadence!
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1011390/guides/
I checked Steam before, but most of the guides seem focused on particular issues (buildings, etc,),but apparently I need more general guidance. I will review the one on Decadence.
Pocus wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 2:37 pm
Also Rome can be tough at start, you can try Macedonia or Egypt.
hmm, I guess I'll try one of those next.
Gray Fox wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:26 pm
This is a guide I did here at Slitherine:
http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtop ... 63&t=98599
Thanks, I will take a look.

76mm
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by 76mm » Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:57 pm

OK, one immediate question:
Generally combat seems to work OK, but sometimes I encounter an army that I just can't beat under any circumstances. For instance:
1) I can't seem to beat a 2-2 general, no matter what. I can outnumber them by more than 2x, no help. There seems to be no concept of attrition where a bigger army can gradually wear down a smaller army with an excellent general.

2) In my last game, I was fighting a Germanic nation with only one region--forested--left. Their general was a 1-1, nothing special. But repeated attacks by my 2-0 general did nothing, even with twice as many troops. After the first couple of losses I figured that I had too many heavy foot for a forest region, and sent many more medium and light troops. Did absolutely no good at all. Again, no concept of attrition, and no way to wear down this smaller army by attrition, but devastating its sole remaining region, etc. It was rather frustrating.

How to deal with situations like these?

Gray Fox
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by Gray Fox » Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:32 pm

You posted that you were playing as Rome, so are your troops well-trained with the best gear? Are you using the best ranged units for the terrain? One huge stack only has an advantage if the battle goes to several combat phases. Split your force into several stacks and attack with each in the same turn. This should cause one battle after another to wear the enemy down. If nothing works, try diplomacy and make them a Client State.
For new players: Grand Strategy AAR and Steam Guide: Tips for new players

76mm
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by 76mm » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:15 pm

Gray Fox wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:32 pm
You posted that you were playing as Rome, so are your troops well-trained with the best gear? Are you using the best ranged units for the terrain?
When this fiasco started, my army was very experienced and twice as large as the German force, although it was presumably too heavily-weighted towards heavy foot. In subsequent turns I reinforced the army with many more (newly-recruited) Alae, Italian foot, and velites, thinking that they would do better in a wooded region. Made no apparent difference.
Gray Fox wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:32 pm
One huge stack only has an advantage if the battle goes to several combat phases. Split your force into several stacks and attack with each in the same turn. This should cause one battle after another to wear the enemy down.
Thanks for this tip, but honestly it is a bit counter-intuitive--in most games, you're encouraged to have one big attack (within reason) rather than several small attacks. If nothing else, I hoped that I could attrit the Germans down by attacking repeatedly over several turns, but their force was not reduced over time and my army always lost in the first round.
Gray Fox wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 2:32 pm
If nothing works, try diplomacy and make them a Client State.
Well, first I would play it out in FOG2, where I expect that I would win. But ultimately I'm not going to play a game where I can't understand the combat engine or its results.

poesel71
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by poesel71 » Wed Nov 25, 2020 8:00 am

Maybe what I wrote here helps you:
http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtop ... 94#p891218
76mm wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 4:03 am
I've played three games as Rome now, all of them have played out about the same--great until about turn 100, then a stalemate of "whack-a-mole" with rebelling regions and declarations of war until about turn 130, then the wheels come off.
FOGE is not so much a military game as one would think. Made the same mistake in my first game as the Goths. Occupied a huge amount of land only to end in a death spiral of revolutions.

The most important thing is to not get ageing tokens. You get those when you are in the lower third of the culture to decadence list you get shown at the start of every round. Before you can start a war you must be in the middle or top third.
You need to have a working state to be able to afford a war. It is easy to hire swords and conquer lands but without the proper support that empire will not last long.

Swuul
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by Swuul » Wed Nov 25, 2020 10:21 am

76mm wrote:
Sat Nov 21, 2020 11:57 pm
OK, one immediate question:
Generally combat seems to work OK, but sometimes I encounter an army that I just can't beat under any circumstances. For instance:
1) I can't seem to beat a 2-2 general, no matter what. I can outnumber them by more than 2x, no help. There seems to be no concept of attrition where a bigger army can gradually wear down a smaller army with an excellent general.

2) In my last game, I was fighting a Germanic nation with only one region--forested--left. Their general was a 1-1, nothing special. But repeated attacks by my 2-0 general did nothing, even with twice as many troops. After the first couple of losses I figured that I had too many heavy foot for a forest region, and sent many more medium and light troops. Did absolutely no good at all. Again, no concept of attrition, and no way to wear down this smaller army by attrition, but devastating its sole remaining region, etc. It was rather frustrating.

How to deal with situations like these?
To both cases: You have to take advantage of the terrain. If you can't take advantage of the terrain (for example, you don't have a properly experienced medium infantry force screened by experienced skirmishers to attack forest), then don't attack but lure the enemy force out from that terrain.

If you absolutely desperately need to take a province no matter the cost, then be prepared to pay any cost. Two or three sacrificial armies with enough skirmishers to fill the frontage (you need to have troops in the main line to fill the frontage too; cheap medium infantry, or medium cavalry (who can evade and thus take one less hit)), stage their attacks so that they arrive to the province on different impulses, and then last your main army arrives to fight the enemy who has recieved lots of attrition hits with the. If possible, time the attack to happen on a turn of harsh weather (harsh weather penalties happen before combat) if you can attack from areas who themselves are not suffering harsh weather.
EDIT: As a reminder: If you see the harsh weather marker on the map, you are too late already. That harsh weather happened this turn, the effect will not be there anymore next turn when you march your armies to the province. You can (hopefully :) ) count to four, so you will know when the harsh weather turns happen :)

To destroy that unstoppable 2-2 general, you have to choose your battlefield wisely. In good defensive terrain, preferably with a 0-2 (or 1-2 or 2-2 if you happen to have those) leader who has a bonus for the terrain (and if possible, with units who have a boost in the terrain). To lure the enemy to attack, have your initial force smaller than the opposing army so that the opponent dares to attack, but be sure to time your reinforcing armies to arrive on an impulse before the enemy arrives (as Rome this should be easy, as you have Roads, and thus always can arrive an impulse before the enemy, if both armies start equidistant).

Just remember the most expensive units are not always the best ones. A cheap unit that has a bonus in rough terrain will likely fare much better than an expensive unit who has a malus in that terrain. Likewise, if you have a 2-1 Leader who has been unstoppable so far does not mean he is in any way better than a 0-2 defending in a terrain for which he has a nice bonus, on the contrary!

FOGE doesn't have a single unit or leader who has the "this one fits all situations" attribute. Choose your tools for different tasks wisely, use your different tools wisely :)
There are three kinds of people, those who can count and those who can't.

76mm
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by 76mm » Wed Nov 25, 2020 1:55 pm

Thanks for the replies. Busy for now with other stuff, but hope to come back to the game soon. One more question: Is there any way to gain progress tokens other than by occupying objective regions assigned by the computer?

Scobie
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by Scobie » Wed Nov 25, 2020 4:06 pm

76mm wrote:
Wed Nov 25, 2020 1:55 pm
Thanks for the replies. Busy for now with other stuff, but hope to come back to the game soon. One more question: Is there any way to gain progress tokens other than by occupying objective regions assigned by the computer?
Yes, you will get most of your progress tokens from being in the top third of the CDR ranking, same as you get ageing tokens from being in the bottom third. I've found occupying objective regions to be a much less reliable method.

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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by miventi » Thu Nov 26, 2020 2:38 am

Igual yo, siento que tienen tiempo sin sacar buenos juegos como esos.

76mm
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by 76mm » Thu Nov 26, 2020 11:19 am

Scobie wrote:
Wed Nov 25, 2020 4:06 pm
Yes, you will get most of your progress tokens from being in the top third of the CDR ranking, same as you get ageing tokens from being in the bottom third. I've found occupying objective regions to be a much less reliable method.
Great, thanks.

Gray Fox
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Re: Very frustrated...

Post by Gray Fox » Thu Nov 26, 2020 4:30 pm

miventi wrote:
Thu Nov 26, 2020 2:38 am
Igual yo, siento que tienen tiempo sin sacar buenos juegos como esos.
"Like me, I feel like they have time without playing good games like that."

¡Bienvenido al juego!

Welcome to the game!
For new players: Grand Strategy AAR and Steam Guide: Tips for new players

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