Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

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goose_2
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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by goose_2 » Tue Feb 02, 2021 2:44 pm

Erasermarek wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:16 pm
And of course you run this older version on the iron and it doesn't look older every year. It looks the same. : D Unfortunately, PzC 2 already looks obsolete today.
What do you mean by this statement? I find it very interesting, but having trouble visualizing what you mean
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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by Erasermarek » Thu Feb 04, 2021 12:40 pm

goose_2 wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 2:44 pm
Erasermarek wrote:
Tue Feb 02, 2021 1:16 pm
And of course you run this older version on the iron and it doesn't look older every year. It looks the same. : D Unfortunately, PzC 2 already looks obsolete today.
What do you mean by this statement? I find it very interesting, but having trouble visualizing what you mean
The old PzC has its age and with its visual it tried to be the successor of the Panzer General that we wanted to have. No one wanted much 3D. The PzC2 had to bring something new. Unfortunately, the graphics did not bring either perfect graphics or nice graphics (such as Order of Battle). The result is too demanding a game with an average graphic visual (for today). It discourages players with older PC or veterans. On the contrary, new audiences will not get it easily because it does not graphically meet the demands of the game. It's full steam of games, which are not so great for gaming (than PzC2), but visually they look much better, so PzC2 doesn't get a chance. Those games are much easier for beginners. PzC 2 thus reached a dead end. Veterans are returning to the PzC1 more and more, and new players don't get much to PzC2. Sales are often pulled by fans of the first part (including me). When I look at steam and see that about the same number plays PzC1 and PzC2, it seems astonishing to me. And I'm not saying that the PzC1 is often played by a lot of people outside of steam. And I'm not talking about how easy new maps and scenarios were made by players.Everyone wanted something new - beautiful. And they forgot why they came to PzC1. The developers did a great job, but the result is not as great as we would all like.

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by faos333 » Thu Feb 04, 2021 2:21 pm

Erasermarek wrote:
Thu Feb 04, 2021 12:40 pm
... The PzC2 had to bring something new. Unfortunately, the graphics did not bring ....
I am a veteran player of PzC1 and played a lot in the past Panzer General, or other similar games.

The way to go in my opinion for PzC3, since 2 is already happening.
A] Do not implement a game that needs high graphic visuals, since they demand much faster PCs to be played with.
B] Build up and expand the PzC1 legacy, by bringing overall a more historical realism to the game.

Imagine a successor to the game called let’s say Panzer Corps Ultimate Edition, where all the goodies are combined and offers more realism to the game.

The ways to do that are numerous:
- Core units’ composition should be more close to reality, for example it’s not logical to deploy 7 tanks of which 7 are Tiger Is, although I very much like using them.

- Bring in supply rules and logistics problems, a historical axis problem.

- Correlate scenarios with historical outcomes, for example we cannot have a decisive victory in Kursk when all front is crumbling around you, it’s not easy but I would imagine that at some point during play, the scenario becomes dynamic and changes objectives, new auxiliary units might arrive, or new map areas uncovered, revealing a different tactical situation. In other words it’s not logical to win all the way DVs from 1939 to 1945 and ending winning another one in Berlin.

- Offer new units or improve existing ones For example add more units nationalities, or add the camo trait for AT or a U-Boat. Dump the airplanes back to airfield introduced to PzC2

- Design more detailed and more historical GC campaigns and maps eg around Berlin there have been epic battles for breaking the siege, east armies breakthrough to west, break out attempts etc. Thus offer more expansion GCs

- Offer more what if / alternative scenarios – campaigns

Finally and perhaps most importantly, add auto Mod enablers in the vanilla game. In order to expanding Modders abilities, allowing them to create more content. While at the same time more expanding the active users’ base, which is the factor for ongoing success.
Battlefield Europe get the most from Panzer Corps 8)
Download the new 2.2 Mod here http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=147&t=47985

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by PeteMitchell » Thu Feb 04, 2021 4:01 pm

It's sad to see that there is a PzC 1 anniversary thread here on the forum since more than six months that collected around 100 improvement ideas for PcZ 1 but it didn't receive any official reply or recognition by the developer or publisher team... I personally think the original game has still so much potential!

viewtopic.php?f=121&t=100067
Comprehensive Battlefield Europe AAR:
http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=145&t=86481

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by goose_2 » Thu Feb 04, 2021 4:08 pm

PeteMitchell wrote:
Thu Feb 04, 2021 4:01 pm
It's sad to see that there is a PzC 1 anniversary thread here on the forum since more than six months that collected around 100 improvement ideas for PcZ 1 but it didn't receive any official reply or recognition by the developer or publisher team... I personally think the original game has still so much potential!

viewtopic.php?f=121&t=100067
Amen Pete, truly sad this has just been ignored
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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by Erasermarek » Thu Feb 04, 2021 7:38 pm

I hope we celebrate such an anniversary with dignity. I don't want it to be almost completely ignored. I like the game too much and I would be sad about that.

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by Ursulet » Sat Feb 06, 2021 5:47 pm

I just cant get enough of PZc 1. Period.

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by huckc » Sat Feb 06, 2021 9:29 pm

PeteMitchell wrote:
Thu Feb 04, 2021 4:01 pm
It's sad to see that there is a PzC 1 anniversary thread here on the forum since more than six months that collected around 100 improvement ideas for PcZ 1 but it didn't receive any official reply or recognition by the developer or publisher team... I personally think the original game has still so much potential!

viewtopic.php?f=121&t=100067
Hopefully someday in the far off future it'll be released as open source like doom et al.
https://github.com/id-Software/DOOM

I think that's the most realistic scenario to implement most of those changes as they're probably too time consuming to be commercially viable as part of an "enhanced edition" re-release.

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by PeteMitchell » Sat Feb 06, 2021 9:34 pm

Yeah, I think you have a valid point there... I think as long as they can still sell PzC 1 once in a while (even if just on discount), they won't releave the source code...

Plus, by the way, how do you manage / maintain version control with such an open source project... you will end up with many different versions, won't you? (I am just trying to understand how it usually / best works ... or could / should work)
Comprehensive Battlefield Europe AAR:
http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=145&t=86481

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by jfk2 » Fri Feb 19, 2021 11:55 am

I like large maps, and with many units, PC2 does not allow it

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by Hollowlolo » Thu Feb 25, 2021 9:21 pm

Plus, by the way, how do you manage / maintain version control with such an open source project... you will end up with many different versions, won't you? (I am just trying to understand how it usually / best works ... or could / should work)
Hi, Generals

Yes , it's exactly what could happen , but I don't think it would truly be an issue .

The fact is , I own Brutal Doom too . What they did with it totally surpassed all my childhood dreams . I dare to say it : some modS of Brutal Doom are really better than the "vanilla" Doom of our childhood , for thoses who had the chance to meet this game . I did ! Yes, they is now many version of Brutal Doom , but by testing them you can quickly detect which of them are made for your taste . And you can even find THE mod( I got lucky with this point too with 3Live Throught Doom3 , that is a true Masterpiece . I thanked it's creator many times on Discord) .

So , if it's the fate reserved for Pzkorps 1 ? I can't await to see this !

I would only need one improvement over the current version : a OOB-like system for the supply line , along with the "micro-management" current system of PzKorps . I would be the perfect Wargame .
" Des Canons ! Des Munitions! "

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by Messmann » Tue Mar 09, 2021 6:09 pm

Modifying units requires unit graphics in 2d, since this is (nearly) the only option for a lay person to change units. People who like unit mods would have to stick around with original Panzer Corps.

Right now, I do not see the option to modify Panzer Corps 2 in the same way or in a similar way as I did with Panzer Corps 1.

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by hugh2711 » Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:31 am

why: Because Pzc2 looks awful. There is no point in playing it because it is impossible to see the information you need to make the right analysis and decisions even with a very good graphics card. It is a shame because some of the ideas (like assignable heroes) are good but its no good if you cant see what you need to see. I would love a '2D version'. The irony is slitherine were well warned about this pitfall while it was being made. They are following a well worn path like some other good turn based games that crashed with the sequel. They were warned explicitally about that with examples and eventually you will end up with more people playing PzC1 v PzC2. By that time there will be no money to be made in iether. I just hope all the scenario designers dont all drift away.

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by PeteMitchell » Mon Mar 22, 2021 7:04 am

hugh2711 wrote:
Mon Mar 22, 2021 1:31 am
why: Because Pzc2 looks awful. There is no point in playing it because it is impossible to see the information you need to make the right analysis and decisions even with a very good graphics card. It is a shame because some of the ideas (like assignable heroes) are good but its no good if you cant see what you need to see. I would love a '2D version'. The irony is slitherine were well warned about this pitfall while it was being made. They are following a well worn path like some other good turn based games that crashed with the sequel. They were warned explicitally about that with examples and eventually you will end up with more people playing PzC1 v PzC2. By that time there will be no money to be made in iether. I just hope all the scenario designers dont all drift away.
+1
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http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=145&t=86481

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by Naxor » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:07 pm

Initially the reason was I applied for panzer corps 2 beta but never got accepted so I just decided to not purchase the game at launch. :twisted: After that I heard from other players who had tested panzer corps 2 the gameplay is more complex and graphics not as user friendly as they are in pz1. Then I watched some gameplay videos and saw all the cramped maps and other stuff I didn´t like so after that it was easy pass. I think these panzer general type of games should be easy to learn and play. Little similar to chess. If I want something more complex I look for other titles.

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by dragos » Sun Mar 28, 2021 4:44 pm

Looks to be PC2 is like Panzer General 3D was for the PG series. I really don't like 3D graphics for a wargame.

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by nikivdd » Sun Mar 28, 2021 6:46 pm

I was dreaming of Panzer Corps 1.5, a bit more polished 2D graphics, more units (also minor countries), some of the PzC 2 ideas (commendation points, heroes, more options to chose from to start a campaign) and a lot more (unofficial) content (with steam workshop support). Instead we got PzC 2. I recently started to play the Spanish civil war DLC and perhaps, just perhaps, i can blame it on my age: i grew up with 2D, the five star series and the kinda top down view. I am really really trying but i have a hard time getting used to the whole 3D thing. Graphics aside, i am truly frustrated with the endless spawns of enemy units (lua stuff most likely). I am not saying that i am going to put the sequal into stasis but i do not feel the exhilaration, the adrenaline and the devil whispering in my ear to play just one more turn (and we all know how that turns out). Nonetheless, i will support the devs and purchase new content but i cannot promise that i will ever have a second playthrough. My steam version of PzC 1(gold version) has 1996 hours, not included the days, weeks and months creating more campaigns and the countless hours with the non-steam version before the gold edition.

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by captainjack » Mon Mar 29, 2021 7:21 am

Mods are definitely a good reason for sticking with original Panzer Corps.
Nikivdd's mods are great (even if they all include at least one scenario I really struggle to beat), and I enjoy developing my own mods even though I'm extremely slow and get easily distracted.

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by codman » Mon Mar 29, 2021 10:50 pm

I'll second the mod part. As I've posted before Nikivdd multiple mods have really made this game for me. There are many great mods out there that I haven't tried so please do not think that there is only one mod to try, try them all and enjoy the depth and the challenges they bring.

The other reason I stick with this game is there are "fiendish and diabolical posters" on this group who point out that Ultimate and Manstein are FUN and I'm beginning to think they might on to something... ;-)

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Re: Why do you still stick with the OG Panzer Corps?

Post by faos333 » Tue Mar 30, 2021 1:44 pm

codman wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 10:50 pm
......... The other reason I stick with this game is there are "fiendish and diabolical posters" on this group who point out that Ultimate and Manstein are FUN and I'm beginning to think they might on to something... ;-)
Please give it a try to Manstein diff is really FUN when you are getting used to it. :D :D :D
There are lots of advice around in this forum from great players like Goose among others, Also, Ultimate after Manstein is promising too.
Battlefield Europe get the most from Panzer Corps 8)
Download the new 2.2 Mod here http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=147&t=47985

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