"Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

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hurly
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Re: "Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

Post by hurly » Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:08 pm

Indigo121 wrote:I will consider these points, thanks. My tanks are all new after Stalingrad, which mean they are indeed significantly weaker. The Panzers are 3-4 stars, so that's a problem.
I mean there you have it.

you field Green Tanks in late 42 and wonder why they are not performing

and don't take that personally compare your Troops and Strategies with those one of the really best if not the best player in Panzer Corps

I have not followed the Soviet Corps Vid Series closely but clicking on the link provided in this thread

I can see easily that almost all Units (except the conscripts he uses) Braccada fields mostly 3 or 4 star Units and a few with 2 stars. That's a huge difference in Fighting Power alone to a Green Unit even if the Units are not Overstrengthened (and quite a few of them are)
What I can not see in the vid is the allocation of heroes for these vet Units, but with the generous Soviet Corps dishing out Heroes I assume all of them have at least 2 if not 3 heroes already.

Bottom Line even if you field the same Units by Name and Numbers this is not even close in actual Fighting Power.

Your problem is more in the past though, it is absolute key to build units up with experience and heroes on your path and it's even more key not to lose anything completely.
Braccada is a master in doing that, he plans and thinks his strategies so well that he rarely takes any losses (not even partly losses in a fight) so he very rarely has to buy expensive in Game replacements and amazingly few cheap ones in the next Deployment Phase.

But don't fret that is the way Braccada plays and even though anyone can learn from it, that does not mean it is really fun to play like him. I won't even have the patience to outthink the AI like he does let alone could play a Scenario in such a one and done sequence shown in the videos not even if he would set up the Units for me.
We are talking about a state of the Art masterpiece here.

You need to find your own playing style you are comfortable with to have fun with the game. While you can learn and pick up things from the Best Players and even the Good and Experienced Ones you still have to do it your way.

And don't be surprised you will change and modify your style with eperience, new challenges and different Nations you play with. There are many ways to skin a cat (do not ever consider doing that in reality !!!!!) and you will be surprised how many variations and tactical depth is in this game

So if you fail on a scenario or even a campaign, so what ? next time it will be different anyway and working out probably much better

proline
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Re: "Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

Post by proline » Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:59 am

If all your tanks died at Stalingrad, you died at Stalingrad. Operation Uranus is but a death throe. You'll have to restart the campaign. I know that sounds frustrating but you'll do way better the second time. Winning is a journey, not a destination. As you'll learn over time, there is a time and a place for each type to buy green units. Typically when your side has the advantage in that type of unit. For example, the Germans can buy tanks in Poland, Norway, or when the Tiger first comes out. Any other time and they will probably die fast. Similarly, the time for the Germans to load up on AT is in 1942, once the Stug is first available but before the Russians get the IS-1 and KV-85.

Partizanchik
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unbalanced gameplay for Operation Uranus

Post by Partizanchik » Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:13 pm

I'm still fairly new to Panzer Corps and am only playing scenarios before I move on to campaign games. For what it's worth, I use a Mac, which seems unable to download the 1.3 patch. Also, if someone can walk me through the Editor mode described in PoorOldSpike's posts, I would appreciate it. I saw Turn4441's advice on how to find the Editor function, but I bought the game though Steam and don't own the Gold edition, only Panzer Corps & Soviet Corps. On my Mac I'm not seeing any system game folder/files whatsoever.

Having said all that (and having re-read this thread multiple times) I am having the same trouble as Indigo121 with the Operation Uranus stand-alone scenario. I have played it almost 10 times, and that's at a measly Lieutenant level, let alone anything higher.

As Panzerpimp pointed out on this thread, Braccada's videos are really useful. However, they are based on the campaign game in which the player can bolster his forces significantly more than I can with 6000 prestige in the stand-alone scenario.

My experience with the Operation Uranus stand-alone scenario leads me to agree with Indigo121: under these conditions, the Soviet side is basically unwinnable. It's not simply a matter of numbers of units, although the 6 German anti-tank units add a great deal to the 7 panzers. The 3 Luftwaffe + 11+ infantry and 10 artillery and/or flak units don't hurt the German side either. (Obviously I'm ignoring all the frozen Wehrmacht units trapped within the surrounded Stalingrad pocket itself.)

As proline points out, German Panzer III tanks are crappy and KV-1Cs are the preferred reinforcement choice. All things being equal, the Soviets should have more than fighting chance. But the main obstacle in the Uranus scenario is not simply that the German units are in a number of cases over strength, but mainly that the Wehrmacht units start off with considerable experience (often 240 points, sometimes more), whereas the Red Army units are all fresh.

Midway in the game, as German troops are released to enter the battle behind the towns where the beleaguered Romanians took their initial beating, the clashes that ensue cause the Red Army units to take far more casualties than can be replaced with the 6000 prestige points available over the course of the scenario. Before long, the Soviet player simply runs out of both prestige and battlefield strength to capture the final two westernmost objectives. To test my hypothesis, I played the German side and found that I had stopped the Red Army cold - pretty much in the same location, right behind the Romanian-held cities - before even activating all of my units.

I suppose there are only two solutions: A) I have to figure out how to get into Editor on my Mac and adjust prestige and/or B) play the campaign game, hopefully with better results.

Any helpful ideas would be appreciated.

captainjack
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Re: "Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

Post by captainjack » Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:44 pm

Most single-player PC scenarios are developed for use as part of a camapign so you will almost always be at a disavantage playing them as standalone.

If you have access to cheat codes on the Mac you can make some adjustments during the game to see what helps and what doesn't. There's a recent list of cheat codes posted on the site so I won't go through them here. At least this would help you see what kind of adjustments you'd need to make if you can edit the scenarios on the Mac.

Partizanchik
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Re: "Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

Post by Partizanchik » Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:51 pm

Thx.

dalfrede
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Re: "Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

Post by dalfrede » Wed Feb 28, 2018 7:42 pm

Partizanchik

The Mac version doesn't have an editor, only the PC version does.

If you are expert user on the MAC there are ways to do it.

I use Wineskin to run the PzC editor on the Mac.
I appear to be the only one to have done so.

Partizanchik wrote: On my Mac I'm not seeing any system game folder/files whatsoever.

You have to use the 'Show Package Contents' function in the finder window to find the scenario files.
ie the scenarios on the Mac are inside the PanzerCorps game wrapper.
Applications > PanzerCorps > Contents > Resources > Data > DATA >
There comes a time on every project when it is time to shoot the engineer and ship the damn thing.

turn4441
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Re: "Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

Post by turn4441 » Wed Feb 28, 2018 8:09 pm

I have never played it as a stand alone scenario, but having looked at it, you are obviously at a disadvantage. As mentioned above, it is designed as part of the campaign, in which case, you should probably have an advantage given the generous prestige in Soviet Corps, especially early in the campaign.

As a stand alone, all of your troops have 0 experience and no heroes while the Germans are typically 2 star units. If you were playing it as part of the campaign, at that point, your units would probably range from 1-3 stars of experience with 1-2 hero bonuses, not to mention, accumulated prestige. Therefore, it is not surprising that it may be challenging. I don't know if the cheat codes work on Macs, but if so, giving all your units an equivalent 2 stars experience may make things a bit more equitable.

It's totally apples and oranges, but my records show I achieved a DV on turn 15 of 18 on field marshal level during my one play through in the campaign. This is not to denigrate your abilities, just to show that it is most likely much easier when played as part of a campaign with experienced troops. If you can win most of the scenarios as stand alone missions with the troops (mostly inexperienced) handed to you, you're probably a pretty damned good general.

Partizanchik
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Re: "Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

Post by Partizanchik » Thu Mar 01, 2018 12:36 am

Thanks captainjack, dalfrede, and turn4441 for the useful, timely feedback. One thing is certain: I'm overdue for starting a Campaign Game. Again, thanks for the clarification folks.

FYI - I'm a high school history teacher who actively encourages historical simulation playing in and outside of the classroom. Among other things, I teach a small gaming class during summer school. I would love to figure out how to get a small team of kids to play Panzer Corps. It might be fun and doable to get two or three kids on a side, dividing up the map into sectors. First I myself have to try multiplayer, of course.

muftugil
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Re: "Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

Post by muftugil » Fri Sep 04, 2020 7:01 am

Indigo121 wrote:
Fri Jan 26, 2018 10:39 am
I will consider these points, thanks. My tanks are all new after Stalingrad, which mean they are indeed significantly weaker. The Panzers are 3-4 stars, so that's a problem.
Hi Indigo121. It's been a few years but I saw your posts on this scenario. How did it go after some of the feedback here? I am now playing SC and it sure is fun.

EconMan
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Re: "Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

Post by EconMan » Tue Oct 27, 2020 7:00 pm

Just wanted to say thanks for this discussion topic. I too was having a bear (pun intended) of a time with The Russia Campaign.
From reading the threads I see my error was at the beginning -- burning out too soon. I had "theorized" the RC would require lots of Infantry, and fighting the Luftwaffe early head-on was a grave error.

Going to start over from scratch.

BTW, I use a Mac too. Hope PC2 gets a mac version.

uzbek2012
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Re: "Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

Post by uzbek2012 » Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:17 am

Alas, the Soviet corps was made on its knees during lunch breaks!

This mod Eastern Front: Soviet Storm v1.96b
http://www.slitherine.com/forum/viewtop ... 47&t=50342
This looks like a bigger mod than I'm sorry this nonsense !

jeannot le lapin
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Re: "Soviet Corps" unbalanced gameplay?

Post by jeannot le lapin » Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:33 am

EconMan wrote:
Tue Oct 27, 2020 7:00 pm
BTW, I use a Mac too. Hope PC2 gets a mac version.
PC2 only on PC. Are Mac made to play video games ?

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