PzC Future?

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Sid Meier
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PzC Future?

Post by Sid Meier » Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:11 pm

Suggestions, wishlist and ideas for Panzer Corps 2 gameplay...

lol

I just wanna to know One Thing:
Why do you kill PzC?
No support no update.
'Learning is part of any good video game'. © Sid Meier

Retributarr
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by Retributarr » Wed Sep 18, 2019 6:04 pm

Sid Meier wrote:
Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:11 pm
Suggestions, wishlist and ideas for Panzer Corps 2 gameplay...

lol

I just wanna to know One Thing:
Why do you kill PzC?
No support no update.
Why do you kill PzC?
No support no update.


Indeed!...that would be a great unexpected welcomed relief!...to breate' some 'New-Life' into this "PzCr" Game...that is still 'Not-Dead'...it hasn't yet stopped 'Kicking...Screaming & Clawing' away at it's yet unfinished life-cycle usefulness!.

If...there is any-way to resurrect this Game to some kind of 'Renewed Life'...I hope that it could be a future consideration.

Patrick Ward
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by Patrick Ward » Thu Sep 19, 2019 5:26 pm

Let me quote someone elses post from these very forums (he's NOT involved with PzC development at all and is speaking in general terms) ..
And who exactly is supposed to make new content for the old game?
It's extremely rare for a game to get new content when the follow-up is already in development. And I can't really think of any game that got new content after the sequel had already been announced (and not just been in development internally). The whole point of a new game is to start fresh. For that you need the people involved to focus on the new release, not have them split time on two games. This is even more true when the number of people involved in making the game isn't particularly large.
Do NOT read anything into that. I am NOT suggesting PzC1 is or isn't dead. I am not in a position to know anything.

But that quote does sound like someone who understands the practical reality.

Pat Ward
Art Director / Artist
............................

Pat a Pixel Pusher

............................

George_Parr
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by George_Parr » Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:22 am

There have been lots of years with new content, and plenty of patches. That seems a whole lot more of an effort spend on the game than you would normally see. Eventually moving on to a successor isn't the same as "killing the game", it is in fact the norm. Of course people won't just suddenly stop playing the game (especially when the next part isn't even out yet), and they won't stop making new mods or scenarios either, but that's people doing stuff for the fun of it, it happens regardless of whether developers still have time for the game. It seems rather odd to throw around accusations like that.

It's not like this is some sort of unusual behaviour. Civilization is in its sixth incarnation right now, and whenever a new one comes around the old one is still very much alive in terms of its community. All strategy games from Paradox are in their nth number of release as well, and it's not like they don't have plenty of DLCs for those. Even Gary Grigsby's War in the East has a new version in development. That's just how things go.

Sid Meier
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by Sid Meier » Sat Sep 28, 2019 1:40 pm

George_Parr wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:22 am
Civilization is in its sixth incarnation right now

Dude, don't touch Civilization !

Civilization are not "incarnation" (remember this).

It a Masterpiece of strategic games.
'Learning is part of any good video game'. © Sid Meier

PoorOldSpike
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by PoorOldSpike » Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:36 pm

Sid Meier wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 1:40 pm
George_Parr wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:22 am
Civilization is in its sixth incarnation right now
Dude, don't touch Civilization !
Civilization are not "incarnation" (remember this).
It a Masterpiece of strategic games.
Certainly Civ 1 was one of my favourite games back in the 1990's, (yes I'm that old, a 71 years old wargame veteran for my sins) I played it almost nonstop and that Sid Meier bloke deserves a medal, do you know him?..;)
Subsequent Civ versions haven't grabbed me half as much, but that's another story.
Regarding Panzer Corps, it's not bad but one of the reasons it's not well supported by the devs is because in March 2017 they announced a forthcoming Panzer Corps 2, so naturally that's hit sales and interest in the old PzC as people are naturally put off buying it, preferring instead to wait for PzC2, and 19 months later they're still waiting for its release, maybe the devs are trying for a Guinness Record for "longest game in development"?..;)

PS- The devs said some months ago in this forum that their work on the Campaign aspect of PzC2 is what's delaying the release, so I said "Well release it NOW without a campaign, then release a Campaign pack addon in the future", but the idea didn't appeal to the devs or to most players, so the waiting goes on. (sniffle)

PanzerCro
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by PanzerCro » Sun Oct 06, 2019 12:00 pm

PoorOldSpike wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:36 pm
Sid Meier wrote:
Sat Sep 28, 2019 1:40 pm
George_Parr wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:22 am
Civilization is in its sixth incarnation right now
Dude, don't touch Civilization !
Civilization are not "incarnation" (remember this).
It a Masterpiece of strategic games.
Certainly Civ 1 was one of my favourite games back in the 1990's, (yes I'm that old, a 71 years old wargame veteran for my sins) I played it almost nonstop and that Sid Meier bloke deserves a medal, do you know him?..;)
Subsequent Civ versions haven't grabbed me half as much, but that's another story.
Regarding Panzer Corps, it's not bad but one of the reasons it's not well supported by the devs is because in March 2017 they announced a forthcoming Panzer Corps 2, so naturally that's hit sales and interest in the old PzC as people are naturally put off buying it, preferring instead to wait for PzC2, and 19 months later they're still waiting for its release, maybe the devs are trying for a Guinness Record for "longest game in development"?..;)

PS- The devs said some months ago in this forum that their work on the Campaign aspect of PzC2 is what's delaying the release, so I said "Well release it NOW without a campaign, then release a Campaign pack addon in the future", but the idea didn't appeal to the devs or to most players, so the waiting goes on. (sniffle)

I think Daikatana (published by Eidos) was in development for like 4-5 years.

PoorOldSpike
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by PoorOldSpike » Sun Oct 06, 2019 10:29 pm

PanzerCro wrote:
Sun Oct 06, 2019 12:00 pm
I think Daikatana (published by Eidos) was in development for like 4-5 years.
Yeah some game companies will never get rich at that rate..;)

PS- I wrongly said a couple of posts ago that Panzer Corps 2 had been in development for 19 months since it was first announced in March 2017; I should have said 31 months (ie two and a half years), maths was never my strong point..:)

PeteMitchell_2
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by PeteMitchell_2 » Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:18 am

George_Parr wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:22 am
There have been lots of years with new content, and plenty of patches.
In addition, several mods were developed over the years and are still being enhanced, they may also still require certain adjustments/patches, if possible... :shock: :mrgreen:

Retributarr
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by Retributarr » Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:36 pm

PoorOldSpike wrote:
Sun Oct 06, 2019 10:29 pm
PanzerCro wrote:
Sun Oct 06, 2019 12:00 pm
I think Daikatana (published by Eidos) was in development for like 4-5 years.
Yeah some game companies will never get rich at that rate..;)

PS- I wrongly said a couple of posts ago that Panzer Corps 2 had been in development for 19 months since it was first announced in March 2017; I should have said 31 months (ie two and a half years), maths was never my strong point..:)
will never get rich at that rate
My take on the above is...That...that definitely is a point to be well taken. On the 'Flip-Side' however...the accrued benefits of this prolonged 'PzrCr2- Games' development has been the benefit of a vastly increased 'Ideas-input' from forum participants on what to possibly include in the 'Game'...as well having time to refine it into as close to a masterpiece as possible!.

The 'Experience' gained from this long-winded-development will also/could also... be a 'Catalyst'...for the development of other similar future projects. The 'Expertise' that the developers get from this grinding extended effort will likely leap-frog them into a more advanced/higher development state of capabilities to keep them on top of this gaming 'Genre'. It would then be much more difficult for the competition to try to 'Usurp' this type of Game-Delivery!.

PoorOldSpike
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by PoorOldSpike » Tue Oct 08, 2019 6:07 am

Retributarr wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:36 pm
..the accrued benefits of this prolonged 'PzrCr2- Games' development has been the benefit of a vastly increased 'Ideas-input' from forum participants on what to possibly include in the 'Game'...as well having time to refine it into as close to a masterpiece as possible!..
When I was a dev / playtester with Cases Computer Simulations in the glory days of the 1980's we use to churn out wargames in just a month or two without doing any market research or asking advice, and when they were released customers lapped them up and the cash start rolling in.
Some of my colleagues spent it on new cars or a mortgage deposit on a house, or a cruise on an ocean liner, but I spent my cut far more sensibly on wine, women and song..:)

Yogol
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by Yogol » Fri Oct 11, 2019 5:52 pm

PoorOldSpike wrote:
Tue Oct 08, 2019 6:07 am
When I was a dev / playtester with Cases Computer Simulations in the glory days of the 1980's we use to churn out wargames in just a month or two without doing any market research or asking advice, and when they were released customers lapped them up and the cash start rolling in.
Some of my colleagues spent it on new cars or a mortgage deposit on a house, or a cruise on an ocean liner, but I spent my cut far more sensibly on wine, women and song..:)
You clearly have your priorities straight :)

And, yes... I do not understand why these type of games take so much time, compared to back then. I am pretty sure that the sales numbers of Panzer General 2 will be just as high without all the pretty graphics (which is what typically delays a game). I really, really do not understand why waiting for so long.

And to the other poster: I absolutely agree with you on the no-long-campaign release. Just get the game out with a basic campaign and add the campaign later. That's how Panzer Corp did it and it worked perfectly. They could even have added another 3-4 Russian campaigns instead of the one they released. I really do not understand why the wait, if it is just a question of adding campaigns, like the DEV said.

PoorOldSpike
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Re: PzC Future?

Post by PoorOldSpike » Sat Oct 12, 2019 6:42 am

Yogol wrote:
Fri Oct 11, 2019 5:52 pm
..I am pretty sure that the sales numbers of Panzer General 2 will be just as high without all the pretty graphics (which is what typically delays a game)..
Yes, for example chess has been hugely popular for centuries without any fancy graphics..:)

PS-one of my favourite games is 'Battle Academy' (bought from Matrix) even though the graphics are simplistic and jerky but the gameplay blows my socks off, it's played on square tiles instead of hexes so it has a 'chess game' feel to it where correct positioning is everything in order to hold the enemy in check.
Note- 'Battle Academy 2: Eastern Front' in particular is hugely popular because it's got a sensational random mission generator which the original BA doesn't have..:)

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