Panzer Corp Difficulty

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Forefall
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Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by Forefall » Sat Mar 22, 2014 6:23 pm

I'm looking for a good challenge for panzer corps, and the default difficulties are pretty poor. I feel I'm a pretty good gamer and that I play this game very well. But field marshall is a bit of a joke. Manstein and Guderian would offer a challenge, but I don't think it would necessarily be fun and I'd rely on cheap tactics and AI abuse to win. Rommel is pretty easy as well. I'd love to play Deducter's mod, but alas I'm on an Ipad and he hasn't updated for 1.2x anyway.

So, my custom difficulty. I'm not posting this to brag, but instead because I'm looking for feedback and also trying to share my experience for others. This is also intended for the GC West campaign, as I know this difficulty may be too much for the GC East.

First, only 1 of each unit. Different models are allowed, so you can have 4 different panthers end game, but only one of each model. SE units are not considered different. This has the effect of really preventing easy air domination as fighters are very limited and so AA becomes a lot more important. It also makes you use all the different infantry and limits your access to the heavier tanks.

Second, no overstrenghtening. Units at 13-15 fight so much more effectively, and when they have an initiative bonus the battles become very one-sided. Keeping units capped at 10 makes fights less one-sided.

Finally, play on field marshall difficulty.

As additions, I genearlly never reload for battle events. I will reload if I get heroes that are useless (ini hero on artillery, spotting hero on AT, etc.). I also am very careful to keep hero units alive, but will redo an entire battle if I lose a hero unit. Normally though, I accept whatever battle outcome I get (usually DV, occasionally MV). And I also recommend not using Oleh Dir. That one hero is just too unbalanced and negates the whole infantry battle.

If you have any feedback or suggestions, please share. Thanks. :)
Last edited by Forefall on Sat Mar 22, 2014 8:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Resolute
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by Resolute » Sat Mar 22, 2014 7:18 pm

Well you say Oleh Dir is unbalanced but on the other hand you're rerolling hero stats? I don't think Oleh Dir is unbalanced but rerolled stats are, especially on tanks. You say Rommel is pretty easy as well. May I ask how far did you play on that difficulty with the new rules and the prestige soft cap?

sn0wball
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by sn0wball » Sat Mar 22, 2014 7:55 pm

I have tried using the 1 of each approach, but I didn´t find it feasible in GC 43 East. Against all these waves of front line tanks, only the best AFV can survive. What about playing Afrika Korps with an Italian-only core ? I have tried that and had lots of fun - until Persia, at least.

Forefall
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by Forefall » Sat Mar 22, 2014 8:17 pm

I should have mentioned I've only played 39-42. I'm also preferring to play the west GC, although afterwards I may return and do the east. In 43 I had 65k prestige, and I had stopped trying to conserve prestige so I imagine I could have had more. I have never played Rommel - I'm on the Ipad and the advanced difficulties do not work right now. My opinion that Rommel is easy is assumptive - largely based upon my own estimations and Deducter's analysis that for Rommel to truly be limiting it needs to be 25% of prestige not 50%. Because I have not played 43 or beyond, I'm not very familiar with the penalties involving the soft prestige cap, although I imagine with using one of each unit it will be much less significant.

Resolute, I don't reroll heroes on tanks, as almost every tank hero is useful. I believe I stated rerolling only the useless heroes. I do it primarily for flavour and don't feel it has a significant impact on my core strength. Perhaps I should mention that rerolling just means reloading when I get a bad hero. I do not constantly load to get another one. Because of this I have many fewer heroes on my units. But I prefer no hero over a useless one.

Sn0wball, I agree that on GC 43 east (I did the first 5 scenarios or so) the game became increasingly difficult with only 1 of each unit. I should have mentioned (and will edit the original post) that my custom difficulty is intended for the GC West.

antoniocapo
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by antoniocapo » Sat Mar 22, 2014 11:11 pm

sn0wball wrote:What about playing Afrika Korps with an Italian-only core ? I have tried that and had lots of fun - until Persia, at least.
The Graziani difficulty mode, harder than Rommel's :) Will try.

captainjack
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by captainjack » Mon Mar 24, 2014 7:59 am

When I get depressed by 44 East and feel the need for some sun I might give Graziano a go. I think on General (my normal play level) it would be beyond me, but on Colonel might just work.

sn0wball
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by sn0wball » Mon Mar 24, 2014 5:31 pm

Actually, Graziano mode (great idea for a designation!) isn´t that hard during the first levels of Afrika Korps. I needed to come up with a wholly different approach to core composition and tactics - I really came to love the 90mm AA gun in AT mode. They make short work of any early UK tank, especially when used during an ambush. Also, Italian units are cheap, so you´ll have lots of reserves for elite reinforcements.

antoniocapo
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by antoniocapo » Tue Mar 25, 2014 2:08 pm

sn0wball wrote: Also, Italian units are cheap, so you´ll have lots of reserves for elite reinforcements.
Yes, but you need more water for their pasta!

(weirdest rule exception ever from SPI's Campaign for North Africa)

nightterrors
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by nightterrors » Tue Mar 25, 2014 3:47 pm

I'm also considering replaying AK with only Italian units. Any tips on which units to rely on?
I assume I would need to have an air-heavy core as Italian air units are quite good.
They do get some German units at some point right? I remember upgrading my P40 to a Panther somewhere past Palestine, and seeing He-129 among Italian tac bombers.

sn0wball
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by sn0wball » Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:55 am

90mm AA guns in AT mode, covered by 150mm artillery. Initially, they are your only way to defeat British tanks. When it becomes available, the strategic bomber from Piaggio is a real killer, even when compared to German ones.

Also, you´ll come to love captured British tanks.

I myself allowed to buy German pioneers for mine sweeping, as the Italians lack such a unit, but should have one. Also, I kept German SE units, reasoning these are gifts to the suddenly not so ineffective Italian ally.

nightterrors
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by nightterrors » Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:27 pm

If one plays with the Steam achievement in mind (I for one can't help myself, being a fresh wargamer), one can always use the initial German core forces. These will nicely fulfill roles that are missing from the Italian rooster - pioneers, fallschirmjaeger, heavy tanks, StugIV as the ultimate artillery/AT combo and tracked AA. Historically it makes perfect sense that an elite German kampfgruppe would stay in Africa once deployed there to help Italians. Do you think that would fit Graziani mode?

BiteNibbleChomp
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by BiteNibbleChomp » Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:25 am

My idea for a new difficulty (I'm nowhere near good enough to play on it - I play on Lieutenant): "Enemy Veterans" - enemy has 200% experience rate, you have 100%

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antoniocapo
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by antoniocapo » Thu Mar 27, 2014 4:23 pm

nightterrors wrote:If one plays with the Steam achievement in mind (I for one can't help myself, being a fresh wargamer), one can always use the initial German core forces. These will nicely fulfill roles that are missing from the Italian rooster - pioneers, fallschirmjaeger, heavy tanks, StugIV as the ultimate artillery/AT combo and tracked AA. Historically it makes perfect sense that an elite German kampfgruppe would stay in Africa once deployed there to help Italians. Do you think that would fit Graziani mode?
Hey its your game, sure it will fit. That way you get the achievement plus you get more varied units for more fun. Dont go buying more germans though!

Anfield
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by Anfield » Thu Mar 27, 2014 10:30 pm

Ive said it in many places on the forum, want the game to be harder, play a historical list for your army set up. Difference is night and day on how the game plays.

captainjack
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by captainjack » Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:45 am

Rather than assault Stalingrad on a stormy night I started my attempt at AK Graziano mode.
The good news is that the Italian 37mm AT is slightly better than the German one (higher SA and INI), the heavy AA gun switches to an AT (and is otherwise pretty much as good as an 88), the Berseglieri are about as good as basic infantry, and later you can get a very good strategic bomber. That's about it for the good news. although maybe having prestige and nothing to spend it on because everything is cheap and there are no upgrade paths is a good thing - you might need it for in-game replacements.

I made it to Battleaxe and started wanting Pioneers, tanks with armour and fancy stuff like that. I am now heading back to Stalingrad. Good luck to anyone who can make it to India!

Ucross
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by Ucross » Fri Mar 28, 2014 4:56 pm

I play a difficult version of the game. Here are my rules and I find it quite enjoyable. I play on iPad.

- Rommel
- No disbanding units during deployment
- Only 1 of each unit (SS count as a different set of units)
- Ironman (no reloading ever and if you die you start all over)

I'm starting from 42 west right now with their core force. Very challenging.
I

antoniocapo
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by antoniocapo » Sat Mar 29, 2014 6:21 pm

Ucross wrote:I play a difficult version of the game. Here are my rules and I find it quite enjoyable. I play on iPad.

- Rommel
- No disbanding units during deployment
- Only 1 of each unit (SS count as a different set of units)
- Ironman (no reloading ever and if you die you start all over)

I'm starting from 42 west right now with their core force. Very challenging.
I
Good for people that like to hang from hooks.

ThorHa
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by ThorHa » Sun Mar 30, 2014 12:03 am

To be quite honest - I do not fully understand the discussion. PC as PG are very limited in the ability to emulate battlefield behaviour or armies. Given the scripted enemy units and the complete inability of PC to mirror logistics, training, doctrine and general strategy of the different armies in WW II at different times the solution of self restrict for army composition is laudable, but useless. If someone enters dlc 43 or 44 East with anything resembling the real German armies of that time he does not even need to start - the devs realistically counting on the usual player behaviour " best in everything on max overstrength only limited by available prestige" set up a moderate challenge for exactly that.

There is to my best knowledge absolutely no wargame able to mirror the stunning ability of the Wehrmacht to win or to survive on odds sometimes less than 1 to 6, with mostly outdated equipment, incompetent strategic leadership, restricted supply and Division shells filled to only 1/2 of their paper strength.

Regards,
Thorsten

iceFlame
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Re: Panzer Corp Difficulty

Post by iceFlame » Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:10 am

ThorHa wrote:There is to my best knowledge absolutely no wargame able to mirror the stunning ability of the Wehrmacht to win or to survive on odds sometimes less than 1 to 6, with mostly outdated equipment, incompetent strategic leadership, restricted supply and Division shells filled to only 1/2 of their paper strength.
True that. You can't capture fighting spirit and put it in a bottle much less in a bit of code. Some things simply transcend raw numbers and this is certainly one of them.
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