GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

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Rizzospeed
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GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by Rizzospeed » Mon Apr 02, 2018 11:32 am

Greetings !

1. In which year/which campaign can you get Elite Tanks as a reward? In the first years of the GC you can only get Elite Infantry, am I right?

2. If i remember it correctly, you don't have to use the first (weak) Rudel unit. You just have to keep him in your deployment list an do NOT disband him.
When the second (strong) Rudel appears , somewhere in 1941, you must have the weak Rudel unit in your deployment list or do you have to deploy him on the battlefield?

best regards

hugh2711
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by hugh2711 » Mon Apr 02, 2018 12:46 pm

SE Tanks first become available at norway. [The GC39 Oslo scenario. Remember to leave an open slot if you want one, if you already have two SE infantry you need to dump one beforehand otherwise you wont have the opportunity to get one untill you start GC40 when the number of SE slots goes up by one]

'Reconnnaissance rudel' has to be on the map at the minsk scenario [in GC41]. Then about turn two you will automatically be given super rudel. 'Reconnassance rudel' will stay on the map. (He is still occasionally useful in a few scenarios in the grand campaign.)

Rizzospeed
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by Rizzospeed » Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:58 pm

thanks for your quick reply !

Rizzospeed
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by Rizzospeed » Wed Apr 04, 2018 9:55 pm

There is another question about the Rudel storyline that is bothering me. I'm now at Belgrade 41 and you should get the message that "Rudel refused to become dive bomber under review". I did not receive. I did not deploy the weak Rudel (the first you get) but I have him in my reserve.

Will I get the real Rudel in the Minsk 41 scenario?

huckc
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by huckc » Thu Apr 05, 2018 12:33 am

Rizzospeed wrote:There is another question about the Rudel storyline that is bothering me. I'm now at Belgrade 41 and you should get the message that "Rudel refused to become dive bomber under review". I did not receive. I did not deploy the weak Rudel (the first you get) but I have him in my reserve.

Will I get the real Rudel in the Minsk 41 scenario?
Yep, you will get him in Minsk 41 regardless of deploying the weaker version in Belgrade and getting that message.

auda
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by auda » Tue Apr 10, 2018 3:29 pm

Hi,
I have a similar question. I've never received any special heroes (no Rudel, or high movement gebirgsjäger, etc). I have version 1.30 and no mods, I also had one unit slot available. What could be the issue?

turn4441
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by turn4441 » Tue Apr 10, 2018 4:36 pm

First of all, are you playing the vanilla campaign (PC Wehrmacht) or the Grand Campaign? There are no special heroes in the original Wehrmacht campaign.

If you start Grand Campaign '39, you should receive Rudel at the beginning of the second turn of the first scenario (Poznan). However, the unit is named Reconnaissance Flight and you have to look at the unit's heroes to see that the unit has a hero named Rudel. The next one is Oleh Dir who shows up as the 2nd Gebirgsjager on the second turn of the Lodz scenario. You can easily check by starting a new campaign in GC '39 then either playing the first turn or just passing your turn to get to the 2nd turn where you should get a message about the recon unit (Ju87). If he doesn't show, you may want to reload and reupdate your game.

AnalogGamer
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by AnalogGamer » Sat Apr 14, 2018 6:45 am

I also have questions re: "special" units.

Is there any penalty for just disbanding these units? "Recon" that isn't, and that ridiculous +3 move infantry unit, are ruining the immersion for me. I spent a chunk of change to upgrade to Gold, but if these are going to keep coming, and the scenarios are designed for them, then I may just stick with making my mod. :)

Recon aircraft are the fastest planes, not the slowest, shortest-ranged ones. :P

An infantry unit that moves TWICE as far as any other? Please make it stop.

sn0wball
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by sn0wball » Sat Apr 14, 2018 7:24 am

No, you can disband them for prestige if you don´t want them. No scenario is dependent on them, Rudel and Oleh Din are very useful, but not nescessary to complete the game. While irritating at first, I usually rename the Oleh Din unit Brandenburger and play them as special forces.

MaxF
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by MaxF » Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:43 pm

I gave to the Recon-Rudel a Me110 so I have view range = 4, and have a better survavibility. Yet the enemy will try to shoot him down with all their air-power, there wasn't a scenario in which he survived. I don't deploy him anymore.

hugh2711
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by hugh2711 » Tue Apr 17, 2018 6:56 pm

I am still occasionally very effectively using recon rudel in gc4c east, as an me410a, not every scenario of course and you do have to be careful with him.

MaxF
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by MaxF » Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:51 pm

hugh2711 wrote:I am still occasionally very effectively using recon rudel in gc4c east, as an me410a, not every scenario of course and you do have to be careful with him.
Now that I think about it, the Recon-Rudel might function as a trap/ambush. Since the AI likes to attack him, as well as any weaker unit you have (this by the principle of tearing down your firepower the sooner possible). So, flank the Rudel with many Fighters and tear down the AI's prestige and killing its better air-units.

hugh2711
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by hugh2711 » Tue Apr 17, 2018 9:38 pm

as a 410 or a bf110 he doesnt work as a trap

wargovichr
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by wargovichr » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:02 am

Simply add in recon Rudel each battle with a extra core slot cheat code. Like an enterprising commander would.
Air recon is a deficiency in the game, and ideally should be a "snoop n' scoot" type unit like the recon unit the Allies get in US Corps at D-Day.
I think you have to stay with the 110 series to maintain the base +2 spotting, plus the +2 hero spotting. Escorted of course. Safely spot those double AA defended major objectives. If it gets hit, rebuild experience with ground attack.

MaxF
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by MaxF » Thu Apr 19, 2018 11:27 am

Problem is when you spot a 3-range AA, off a 4 spot range, the AA can move and hit you (if they spot you).

I think it can work as a trap, as I see it's always attacked, when using the bf100c. Probably less if upgraded to the me410.

captainjack
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by captainjack » Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:47 pm

The advantage of recon Rudel is that he works just as well in recon role at 0 experience as at 500. Sure he might survive better with a few stars, but in practice you might as well lose him and reform him next time you need him. If you convert him to a 110, you get some benefit from upgrades that increasee fuel up to the max (95 I think) but his combat stats are rubbish so upgrades otherwise don't make much difference.

MaxF
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by MaxF » Fri Apr 20, 2018 11:57 am

I don't use reform units, so I'd loose Rudel. Otherwise it's a good idea to keep it at low experience (saving elite replacements by the way) and mounting a Bf110, using it just as a recon -- I think he will be heavily targeted thought.
I've just used him with a Me410 in first scenario of East'44 and performed well. He's got 399 exp and I use it with 11 strength.
Me410 has 7 soft attack and 8 hard. -5 of Rudel it's still a more effective bomber than Fighters.

huckc
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by huckc » Wed Apr 25, 2018 12:59 pm

Often times all I need from an air unit is to lower the entrenchment level of an enemy unit by one to get that vital surrender, retreat, or just lower the rugged defense chance. Even recon rudel at 1 strength can do that no matter what unit he is.

hugh2711
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by hugh2711 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:57 pm

I dont use reform units iether, but he has managed to survive while being regularly deployed in GC43 east. He is up to 270 kills so far. I would be happy with a spotting hero or a defense hero.

MaxF
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Re: GC Elite units and Rudel - short questions

Post by MaxF » Fri May 04, 2018 12:10 pm

I would like him with a second hero too, I will deploy him much more then.

I quote who previously asked for an Air Recon mode:
We could do it without creating a specific class. Giving to some airplanes the chance of a swithing mode, like do AA / AT, and AT / Arty, we could have a Recon choice where the unit loses its attack capability, but has increased defense and increased spotting range.
Plus I would give it a small chance to evade of 1 or 2 hexes. Since I inderstand that a full free roaming of an Air-recon would make it quasi impossible to detect and counterattack. 1 or 2 hexes would at least save him from towed AA, still can be chased by SPAA and Fighers.

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