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At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Thu Jul 18, 2019 11:05 pm
by heinzrondorf
I am playing the GC again for the umpteenth time and things are going very well at the moment. I am currently about to start Ostrov (GC41) and overall I am very happy with my core but there are a couple of minor things which are slightly annoying, more specifically the first heroes of two of my infantry units.

One of my old, trusted Wehrmacht Infanterie (350 something in XP) which has been around since 1939 has a +1 attack hero which is a bit disappointing. The other unit of "concern" is a pioniere unit (also about 300 in XP) with a decent, but not great, +2 defensive hero.

I am tempted to disband these units in hope of better heroes but on the other hand, it's already 1941 and it will take time to build up new infantry units to the same experience and I am of course not guaranteed to get better heroes next time either unless I save/reload.

My question is not so much related to what to do in my core's particular case but more general, when do you consider infantry units to peak (what year? personally I think it's the Stalingrad scenarios) and when is it "too late" to start deploying new, green units. Maybe the Wehrmacht Infanterie will get a +3 attack hero as its second hero and the Pioniere unit will get a +1 movement hero as a second hero if I just stick with them?

I know there are different schools of thought here... 1) the people who "farm" for the best possible heroes for each unit type, 2) those who just see heroes as a spice of the game and stick with the heroes they receive regardless how poor they are for that particular unit type and 3) those who save/reload until they get what they want...

* Do you disband infantry units that do not receive the heroes you want?
* If so, when do you stop disbanding infantry units and stop deploying new ones in hope of better heroes? Which year? 41? 42? 43?

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Thu Jul 18, 2019 11:37 pm
by rubyjuno
I stick with the heroes I get, I never disband units because of the heroes they receive. Of course, sometimes I'm disappointed at the heroes I receive, but it's part of the game, a bonus and they all make the unit better in some way, however minor. I'm quite possessive of my units and hate to lose any. Each to their own, but I think constantly disbanding units because you want a better hero is a bit like constantly reloading combats because you don't like the results. Once you get going, it doesn't take long before brand new "green" infantry units are a lot of hard work to build up.

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2019 2:44 am
by captainjack
2 or 3* experience is better than any one hero, and there's no guarantee that you'll get a better hero next time round so I would recommend retirement rather than disbanding.
You'll need a reasonable amount of infantry later on and having a few 2 or 3* units in reserve can be handy, so I'd suggest training up some replacements now as it gets increasingly harder to keep green units alive later on (and maybe aim for only one green unit each scenario to avoid weakening your forces too much).

I sometimes convert experienced units with weak heroes to paras in scenarios that need them since they will be much better than green units, and it's easier to cope with losing a weak hero if they end up more like Arnhem than Eben Emael. Also, while green bridgies are usually just as good as experienced ones (and green pioneers are fine for mine clearing) being able to convert experienced units to bridgies and pioneers means they can be useful in a fight as wel.

Plan B is to check number of kills. If you are close to getting the second hero, see what your second hero is and then decide what to do with them.

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2019 2:45 am
by huckc
I don't farm and I doubt the optimal approach even favors that for most units, except of course if you enjoy it then absolutely farm away :D

All infantry heroes are useful and any unit receiving their first hero is always closer to a second hero than a new unit. There's a minimum amount of kills for additional heroes so even if the first hero is bad they'll be able to re-roll much sooner for their second.

Also experience levels are a much bigger stat boost on average and there's five of them so they'll massively overshadow hero bonuses.

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2019 11:46 am
by RVallant
I wouldn't get too hung up on it tbh. Mind you, I do get annoyed enough to reload if I get a spotting hero on my tanks... -_-

Perhaps consider specialising them based on the heroes you're getting. The +2 def could maybe be a more useful defensive infantry unit, god knows you'll need them in the later scenarios if you go East and need to defend.

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2019 12:46 pm
by goose_2
I am the greatest advocate for hero farming as it allows you to build the army you want rather than the army you have, that is why I can end up with a ton of units in my core that I never use. I 2nd Captainjacks approach to things if you get an experienced hero with a lousy hero, just sideline them and use other units, I only disband lousy 1st heroes for my Bombers or my artillery.

Since artillery and Bombers gain experience so fast disbanding lousy heroes is well worth it as their first hero is so very important, so bomber or arty who get's spotting is disbanded, or movement for a plane, but movement for an arty that has them going to the front of the line for deployment. ;)

I love spotting heroes for my recons and infantry, because it makes them even more useful, for infantry I just turn them into Kradschutzen so that in my Manstein playthrough I have a Kradschutzen that has a +2 Spotting hero. He is really nice to have around to see what is coming.

I do not have to reload for better heroes I just fight with more units than most people do so I eventually get the heroes I want. ;)

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2019 11:35 pm
by heinzrondorf
Thanks everyone for your advice! I decided against disbanding those two units.
Instead I will keep them in reserve like was suggested and maybe convert them into other unit types later. Sounds like a good plan :) .

But when in the GC do you all think it is too late to start deploying green infantry units in order for them to actually make an impact in your core considering experience and heroes? Of course you can deploy green infantry units in Berlin Redux but by then it's a little late :D

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Sat Jul 20, 2019 11:15 am
by hugh2711
I dont really think there is a specific time with infantry as later on you get a couple of nicely heroed infantry gifts which even with thier first hero on top of thier base free heroes are quite good.
I would keep the plus two defence pioneer as defence is pioneers weak point so eliminating that weakness I would actually prefer a good defence hero as a pionieres first.
I would dump the attack plus one infantry, nothing special, the heroed infantry gifts are better.

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:05 pm
by PeteMitchell
I like farming heroes to some extent but I don't overdo it either… if I don’t like a unit I either don’t deploy it anymore (and just keep it in case I really need it later) or I just sell it… as simple as that...

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:14 pm
by goose_2
PeteMitchell_2 wrote:
Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:05 pm
I like farming heroes to some extent but I don't overdo it either… if I don’t like a unit I either don’t deploy it anymore (and just keep it in case I really need it later) or I just sell it… as simple as that...
Amen! Pete that is exactly what I have been trying to say, but you said it so successfully and succinctly

THANK YOU

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:39 am
by Elkarlo
I don't farm, but I tend to have more infantry than I'll ever really need. They're all leveler up XP wise. Some have great heros, and I have one that has a triple hero. I use those more than the duds with D+1 or something. I also like movement bonuses. Males it easier to hide them on rough terrain. Otherwise approaching the enemy 43 and later gets dangerous in the open.
Basically more infantry and I use the ones who have good heros more.

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:48 am
by Elkarlo
Oh I do disband artillery with unsuitable heros. Like sight or defense. Just don't need that. I disband them and hope for movement and or range

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 11:44 am
by PeteMitchell
I agree, I tend to just have more units than I need and after late 42/early 43 it is also more difficult to add new/green units...

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 7:55 pm
by ptje63
If you do chose to disband either one, Id prefer to keep the 2 defense unit.

Re: At what time should you be content with your (infantry) unit(s) heroes?

Posted: Sat Jul 27, 2019 2:27 am
by captainjack
+2 A or D is usually worth keeping - you can always change to unit type to get more benefit - eg para with +2D overcomes one of their weaknesses.
However, it's usually faster to get another unit to a first hero than to earn a second hero so artillery with spotting, +1A or +1D usually gets transferred somewhere unpleasant, just as weak heroes on experienced infantry usually become paras or other expendables for high-risk missions.