[Axis Campaign] GTPG v1.16 FINAL (26/02/17)

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nikivdd
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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by nikivdd » Tue Jul 30, 2013 4:45 pm

timek28 wrote:
Actually the Warsaw scenario after the Westerplatte has the same prestige problem. I checked difficulty between scenarios and it states Colonel as it should. I still gain only around 25 prestige for regular hexes and 50 for victory hexes, as well as half of the prestige per day guaranteed. This is way to low for me.

I don't know what happened between Westerplatte and previous mission to lead to this. But it seems that prestige behavior for colonel is the same as for FM difficulty. I switched difficulties trying to gain more prestige but apparently everything stayed the same except for the AI level. First 2-3 missions yield regular prestige, then the half thing starts.

Is there a way nikki for you to check the prestige perimeters from mission to mission? Just to be sure everything is as it should be. Also to be sure weather this problem exists only in my case.

Also if it is too much of a strain or time consuming for you just tell me. The other solution which I can think of is to raise my prestige to 200% in advanced menu. Maybe that will yield the same result? I can do that too if it is a problem for you.

Mod is awesome, but I want hexes to yield regular prestige, as well as prestige per day. Half of the prestige is too little for me, and honestly I loose interest in conquering cities with this little prestige. The prestige gain between scenarios is really low (200-500 range), so I need victory hexes in order to maintain my core.
At first, i thought the cause might be the gamerules.pzdat. One of the things you can tweak in this file, is the prestige for capturing flags. This is not the case, as the mod uses the vanilla gamerules.
Secondly, i cannot change the values of capturing flags in the scenario editor. This is related to the file i just mentioned, and the level of difficulty.
Thirdly, i know that a prestige "cap" has been introduced with patch v1.20. How the mechanics work in detail, i cannot explain. But i do know if you have a core with the latest of the latest equipment or more units in your deployment pool that you can actually deploy, prestige yields are (much) lower.

Solution...difficult.
Either you increase prestige in the advanced menu as you suggest, or you can try playing the mod with v1.14 gamerules (also selectable in the advanced menu).
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timek28
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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by timek28 » Tue Jul 30, 2013 5:07 pm

Tanks for the info nikki :)

I will try increasing prestige to 200%. I don't believe that 1.20 is causing this in relation to the equipment I have. I played whole AC campaign (1.20 rules) and never had problems of this sort on FM difficulty with latest equipment as well as full core or more units than core can have. I always gained regular prestige, and although cap was probably out there (in order to prevent 200k prestige or so that some players are able to get) I never had problems. I believe that cap isn't set that low. In AC I was able to accumulate around 10000 prestige or more which was somewhat realistic in that phase of war for allies. No need for Germans in Poland to struggle with prestige, even when playing almost perfectly.

Like I said I will try out 200% prestige as I like 1.20 rules (surrender mechanics and replacement suppression before everything else). If that doesn't work I will try playing by 1.14 rules...

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by timek28 » Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:26 am

Raising prestige to 200% did the trick. What is interesting however is when this is done, prestige per day states twice as it should (for example 80 instead of 40 for Warsaw). However I get 40 (what I should have gotten in the first place), but it is still halved from what was expected. I guess there is an issue going on with 1.20 patch compatibility and mod. I'll continue playing on this way, since 1.20 has some good features too, as well as because it is easier to breathe now with more prestige.

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by italianopribe » Thu Aug 01, 2013 6:19 pm

I would like to play someone in 1941. I can not get it to download on my computer. Post a game with the password pribe and I will accept your invite.

timek28
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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by timek28 » Thu Aug 08, 2013 7:00 pm

Just a little write up about my GTPG campaign play through...

First of all campaign is absolutely awesome! It is long, battles are large, and there is creators effort visible in every aspect of it. There was no improvising here. Enemy acts logically (as much as AI can, triggers are nice also), unit placement is logical and there is no boredom as player never knows what to expect. What I like though is that if there are several enemy air waves, player is usually warned by message. While it may ease a game a bit, it is a nice compensation to small amount of prestige player gets between scenarios. In this way player can prepare for incoming air attack and avoid unnecessary losses (which would be very hard to compensate with little prestige).

On the other hand there is a really modest amount of prestige that player can work with. I like this I must admit. At first I didn't like it at all, but now, being unable to upgrade and over strength all my units, I mostly look to use elite replacements to 10. This keeps you in constant alertness in order to avoid losses at all costs, and plan actions very carefully. There is no overpowering here. Every enemy is respectable.

Maps are very well designed, and I'm not sure weather they where hand made in some way or copied in some way from original mod.

Right now I'm in Russia and I like how there are somewhat unorthodox scenarios (Besarbia, Odessa etc). Russia seems to be a huge challenge. Odessa was a bastion, and very hard to conquer.

I have one question and one remark at the end.

Question is: what is exact difference between DV and MV? In last few missions I was unable to get a DV. Odessa is especially hard to get a DV since AI spawns new units in remote out of reach towns and the goal is to destroy all of them. Anyways, what is the difference in terms of prestige especially? I noticed that maybe only 100-200 more prestige is awarded for DV.

And the remark. While completely satisfied with mod I noticed some minor "mistakes" in mod that maybe spoil a little what is otherwise masterfully done mod. For example Gibraltar scenario is called Scene07, and Moscow41 is called Noscow41... I know this is really minor but just to note that out if there are going to be any new revisions of the mod.

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by nikivdd » Thu Aug 08, 2013 7:32 pm

Question is: what is exact difference between DV and MV? In last few missions I was unable to get a DV. Odessa is especially hard to get a DV since AI spawns new units in remote out of reach towns and the goal is to destroy all of them. Anyways, what is the difference in terms of prestige especially? I noticed that maybe only 100-200 more prestige is awarded for DV.
Different set of mission objectives. DV is harder to achieve than MV. Prestige rewards are higher for a DV, but there is not a huge difference in prestige reward between both. It is more a personal pride thing to achieve a DV ;).
And the remark. While completely satisfied with mod I noticed some minor "mistakes" in mod that maybe spoil a little what is otherwise masterfully done mod. For example Gibraltar scenario is called Scene07, and Moscow41 is called Noscow41... I know this is really minor but just to note that out if there are going to be any new revisions of the mod.
Scene07, i forgot to change the save game to Gibraltar and Noscow is a simple typo.
Right now I'm in Russia and I like how there are somewhat unorthodox scenarios (Besarbia, Odessa etc). Russia seems to be a huge challenge. Odessa was a bastion, and very hard to conquer.
Who isn't tired of playing Kiev?
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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by timek28 » Fri Aug 09, 2013 1:46 pm

Hey nikki :)

Do you have any tips for Moscow41 scenario? It seems as challenging as it gets... There is a huge air wave at the beginning of it with which I have a lot of trouble. I simply don't have enough planes and AA batteries to protect all of my battle groups. I currently have 6 fighters, 2 fighter bombers, 2 tac and 2 strat bombers. Also 4 AA batteries (2 88s and 2 mobile units). However I think there is around 8-10 enemy bombers as well as same amount of fighters coming at me which is overwhelming. I maybe could have had different core structure, but I chose to have more artillery and ground units.

Russion ground defenses are also very well placed and almost impossible to attack with this many Russian planes in the skies. Stuaks are impossible to use at this point.

I am able to break through at turn 5-6, but I have large losses in process. Some of my veteran tanks get hit hard with Soviet bombers as I'm trying to protect artillery first, but I cannot protect everything.

I will try replaying the mission by forming around 4 large battle groups. All protected by AA and planes as much as possible. Also if there is room in core I might buy a new 88 or two. I have a feeling this battle is won primarily in the air although I am sure weather will soon render planes obsolete and than the things will get pretty ugly...

edit: I bought 2 additional 88s. Boy have these guns made a difference :)

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by Ice5643 » Fri Aug 09, 2013 9:27 pm

I recently installed this mod and just wanted to pop in to say its great. I´m quite a new player and am slowly slogging through the campaign having just reached france. I´ve been able to get decisive victories at colonel so far although I suspect that will change soon. I cant wait to see the other scenarios and wanted to thank you for this excellent mod.

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by nikivdd » Sat Aug 10, 2013 8:15 am

timek28 wrote:Hey nikki :)

Do you have any tips for Moscow41 scenario? It seems as challenging as it gets... There is a huge air wave at the beginning of it with which I have a lot of trouble. I simply don't have enough planes and AA batteries to protect all of my battle groups. I currently have 6 fighters, 2 fighter bombers, 2 tac and 2 strat bombers. Also 4 AA batteries (2 88s and 2 mobile units). However I think there is around 8-10 enemy bombers as well as same amount of fighters coming at me which is overwhelming. I maybe could have had different core structure, but I chose to have more artillery and ground units.

Russion ground defenses are also very well placed and almost impossible to attack with this many Russian planes in the skies. Stuaks are impossible to use at this point.

I am able to break through at turn 5-6, but I have large losses in process. Some of my veteran tanks get hit hard with Soviet bombers as I'm trying to protect artillery first, but I cannot protect everything.

I will try replaying the mission by forming around 4 large battle groups. All protected by AA and planes as much as possible. Also if there is room in core I might buy a new 88 or two. I have a feeling this battle is won primarily in the air although I am sure weather will soon render planes obsolete and than the things will get pretty ugly...

edit: I bought 2 additional 88s. Boy have these guns made a difference :)
I used Me 110's to pick off the damaged fighters and bombers. Taking enemy airfields is also a priority as it will push them further east (for refueling and repairing). I used Stuka's only when i could give them an escort. It seems ages when i played this, i cannot recall anything else.
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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by nikivdd » Sat Aug 10, 2013 8:15 am

Ice5643 wrote:I recently installed this mod and just wanted to pop in to say its great. I´m quite a new player and am slowly slogging through the campaign having just reached france. I´ve been able to get decisive victories at colonel so far although I suspect that will change soon. I cant wait to see the other scenarios and wanted to thank you for this excellent mod.
I'm glad you like it :) Have fun.
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timek28
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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by timek28 » Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:27 am

Hey nikki, it's me again :)

Just wanted to report that prestige issues are due to 1.20 patch. There is need to turn off prestige cap, and that grants regular prestige (or at least what you intended for player). Battles are this way winnable, but still player should look to minimize unnecessary losses as prestige is not abundant as in original PC.

On the other note I finished Moscow43 scenario with a DV. Then I'm presented with 3 choices - Fight Russians till the bitter end, Allies 1944 and Allies 1945... However whichever path I choose, I am about to go on defense (I did not read briefings but I believe that is the case). Which path should I chose to have a shot of winning it all? I suppose you gave option of invading US in some of these paths didn't you?

Thanks in advance.

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by timek28 » Sat Aug 24, 2013 1:15 pm

Well I see nikki is out of town apparently :) Never mind, answer when you can...

I chose the first logical choice 1944, and Allied invasion of Italy. Now I'm about to play Normandy as I got DV in Italy.

What I don't understand is the scenario development. I got DVs in all the key hypothetical missions. That is SeaLion40, and Moscow43. I got MV only in Moscow 41, but I think that is not the issue here. Anyways, I have to defend Europe against allies now. And that is against both British and Americans!

How can this be possible? I conquered Britain with DV, and I'm supposed to hold it. Now suddenly allies are invading Normandy from Britain which I conquered?

Maybe I'm nitpicking here and it is not important on the grand scale of things, but that's why I requested campaign tree to see what I did wrong (if I did something wrong at all)...

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by nikivdd » Sun Aug 25, 2013 12:51 pm

This mod is related to the PG v6.2 mod. There are scenarios that will take you to the USA and beyond, which were added in a later version. I added the flowcharts in the attachment.
Attachments
GTPG Flowcharts.rar
GTPG 1 Flowcharts
(191.08 KiB) Downloaded 229 times
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timek28
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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by timek28 » Sun Aug 25, 2013 5:47 pm

Wow just wow :)

Well I expected something like this, but not on this scale... Basically I have to get pinned down to Berlin and then push back to conquer everything. Incredibly hard to believe scenario, but on the other hand also incredibly exciting! :) You mentioned PG 6.2. Unfortunately I'm not familiar with that version of PG, so no wonder I have no clue the way scenarios will develop.

Well I'm looking forward to play rest of the campaign :) I also like the dynamics you introduced with intense offense and defense switching... UK being in allied hands in 44 is not a problem (they could have retaken it while I was engaged in Russia), but that could have been mentioned in briefings (or maybe it was mentioned I don't know).

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by timek28 » Tue Aug 27, 2013 4:08 pm

In Gothic Line scenario I achieved MV despite achieving all objectives for DV. The objectives were to hold MIlan, Verona and Venice, and to place 20 CORE ground units on hexes marked A. I did both and achieved only a MV.

I can post screen shot of ground units on A hexes. I have one FSj and two flak units (besides tanks and other units), but I'm sure they are counted as ground. I also double checked if all units are core and they are.

I really want to play on eastern front again (Balkans 44), so I would like to get a DV. Partially due to the fact that Soviet tanks mostly don't have AA on them, and I would like to utilize my JU87Gs on them.

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by timek28 » Fri Aug 30, 2013 6:04 pm

I don't know. I may start playing campaign again altogether with standard PC settings. I played more than half of the campaign with reduced prestige cap which was introduced in 1.20, and now I'm having extreme difficulties parring with the AI. Not to mention that AI grows stronger and stronger by scenarios. It is ridiculous how many US and British planes I took down and even more comes. Frustrating and surreal...

Right now I'm playing Netherlands scenario (since I didn't get help of how to get to Balkans 44). I fear Balkans would be even harder. AI here is just overpowering and bullying me in the air. There is probably 40 enemy aircraft altogether. Some of them are extremely good, like 5 star Tempest planes which can down almost any plane. They attack even my strongest planes (4 starred Komets). I seriously don't know what to do now. Air power is the key.

I could manage this mission somehow, but I'm sure I would have losses that could be hard to recuperate from in following missions. One tactic is to completely pull air force to the rear as AI has just too many too good planes. But even with that my 6-7 flaks in perfect order cannot stop all of those planes.

It is obvious now that this mission requires maxed out prestige and maxed out experience and quality of my units. I failed to achieve this and 7 fighters (5 Me262 and 2 Komets), as well as 6 flaks are not enough to stop this air armada.

I might be trying this all again with no prestige cap... Damn :(

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by Horst » Fri Aug 30, 2013 7:18 pm

Timek, you got my sympathies. The prestige cap is simply not compatible to scenarios designed without it in mind, in particular when the designer guesses the player has most likely mainly 15-strength 5-star units in the end. This is not only the problem of this campaign here but also of the DLC campaigns. Things get especially ugly if the AI can rely on reinforcement scripts.

I guess a proper way for future scenario designs with prestige cap support is that the AI has rather only low-mid experienced troops but in increasing numbers. If you consider that you play the Germans and conquer one country after the other, I hardly doubt there are still so many excellently experienced units left to challenge the player throughout the war anyway, rather only reserves and conscripts in the end. This still hasn't to be the end of challenge though, it just needs a lof of numbers then to press on many front lines, see Russians.

Before ditching the prestige cap all together, following could also be done for each mod-campaign: putting a mod-specific gamerules.pzdat file into the mod's folder with changed prestige cap values. For a total war campaign from 39 until 46, I would change the default values as following according to the needed unit force:

NormalPrestige 400 -> 750 (this is about the 15-strength value of Pz IVJ or 11-strength Panther G. This also supports a good German airforce)
MaxPrestige 800 -> 1250 (this is the value of a 12.5-strength Tiger II or 11-strength Maus)

Especially the raised NormalPrestige minimum setting should make sure you can upkeep an excellent medium-tank force, and only a stronger, heavier force will make you feel the prestige drain. Keep in mind that SE units don't affect the prestige cap calculation, so use the best of the best units there, like 15-strength Mice.

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by nikivdd » Fri Aug 30, 2013 7:35 pm

I will have a look into Gothic line scenario during the weekend.

Keep in mind that this mod, although i gave it several updates with new vanilla equipment and messaging, that the scenarios were developed long before there was a prestige softcap, reform units cheat, most of the currently available triggers, and so on. I suppose that with the v1.20 gadgets and changes, a complete prestige overhaul would be necessary (for the AI as well). I think it still works best with v1.14 rules.
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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by timek28 » Fri Aug 30, 2013 9:19 pm

@Nikki, I agree with you.

There is just some odd feeling of incompatibility between 1.20 rules and your mod. It is a great thing that you made your mod so fast and that is so grandiose, but on the other hand with every new patch that comes out, possibly a new problem arises.

I will definitely start playing again with regular prestige, no soft cap and 1.20 surrendering rules in mind. That might give me an edge that I need against the AI. It will be a tedious task though.

What bothers me is that basically despite your excellent scenario design, AI still has to rely on huge numbers (not your fault but AI designers), and if that doesn't help then on huge numbers and surreal experience, in order to crush my defense. It is very hard to defend against 5 starred Tempest or 4 starred challenger tanks. That is why maximal prestige is needed for player. Although I guess it is hard to optimize design to suit every player.

@Horst, I agree with you too. Some nice suggestions for parameter changes. Although I turned cap down altogether. I believe though that the whole prestige system now needs fine tweaks by the designers in order to optimize game feeling and make it challenging but not punishing.

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Re: [MOD] GTPG 1 v1.11 for PC v1.20 (07/07/13)

Post by timek28 » Mon Sep 02, 2013 8:53 am

I've restarted campaign, using colonel difficulty and 1.14 rules. Although I don't like that there is no prestige gain for surrenders, as well as suppressed replacements I have a feeling this is how the mod is supposed to be played. Right now at Belgium scenario I have enough prestige to keep experience at max, as well as OS. Also I am able to upgrade required units in no more then 2-3 scenarios (for example set artillery to SP) which is the way creator intended I think. I believe that I will have very good core once the really hard battles start, so I'm optimistic now :)

Also I must say that playing campagin for the third time from the beginning is pretty boring and tedious. I like the campaign but to go through same scenarios over and over again just takes too much time, effort and concentration. Hopefully I got things right this time, as I will probably take breatk from the game once I finish this campaign. I've been playing PC almost non stop for the last two years, and I'm a bit fed up... There are some other games I also want to look into (Saints Row IV, Caslevania)... Although I must admit that none come close in terms of cerebral activity and excitement as PC.

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