Page 1 of 1

Tournament map discussion

Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2014 9:14 am
by zjorz
I was recently thinking about creating a tournament style map. The reason for this is that there is a big problem if you want to start a competition. The map and nations are not perfectly balanced so one of the player gets an advantage. No matter how many rounds you play, if both players have the same skill level one side gets an advantage.

I want to discuss the folowing:
Is it possible to have a balanced match using two different nations?
If yes: what nations are balanced towards each other at what year?

Re: Tournament map discussion

Posted: Tue Sep 23, 2014 8:52 pm
by Carius
Who ever moves first is at a disadvantage.

The years between 1941 to 1942 are easier to balance.

Re: Tournament map discussion

Posted: Wed Sep 24, 2014 11:45 pm
by ThvN
Using the 'paired game' option might help equalize some maps a bit. I think it is possible to design maps to be balanced, if you tune them to the used nations and years. Every nation/year has some units that might unbalance things if there are too many of them. You can prevent players picking out too many overpowered units by having a large pre-made force and few open slots/prestige. Or just give more prestige/core slots to the 'weaker' side.

There are a few balancing tricks already used in some sceanrios, for examples check out 'Hylan Oasis' and 'Blood and Sand', the first has some SE units to help the German player, and the second has some heroes for some of the weak British tanks. All these extra 'trick' units cannot be replaced.

1941-1942 doesn't have a bad balance if the game is between Soviet and German, but the British can buy the Churchill halfway 1941 already, and there is little that can counter it apart from air power or close terrain attacks until the Panzer IV F/2 or G comes along in the first half of 1942. Same with KV tanks, but the Soviet air units are weaker so they can be countered more easily. But in late 1942, the Fw190 gives me a lot of problems, too many of those and even with 3 vs 1 I can't get rid of them.

So for Germans vs British, halfway 1942 sounds about right?

For Germans vs. Soviets, it feels as if there is a gap in ability somewhere in the first half of 1943, so perhaps 1941-1942 and late 1943 for those scenarios works better.

The easiest way to balance units would be to mod the equipment file, but I'm not sure if that is what you want.

BTW, I agree that there are some advantages when moving last, but there is one big disadvantage as well: your opponent experiences any weather changes first, and it can be very hard/risky to anticipate those. If it is snowing, and there is no risk of air attacks, you could press end turn and than the weather changes at the start of the opponents turn. Oops, he now has clear skies and can suddenly see your units (because spotting is no longer reduced) and freely use his air units for his turn. But if you keep your air units standby during bad weather, you might deplete their fuel just when you need them the most.

So if bad weather is a regular occurence, playing last can be a disadvantage I think. And it will cripple nations/armies that are more dependant on air power, as well.

Re: Tournament map discussion

Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2014 12:40 pm
by BiteNibbleChomp
If you are willing to use it, the WWI mod is balanced until about 1917 when tanks are added.

Brit v German or France v Germans should be fine. In this case, I use the last German flag (labelled Vichy France as I can't be bothered editing that) for Germany.

Russia, Austria and most of the samller states have been weakened quite a bit.

Happy modding,


Re: Tournament map discussion

Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2014 6:49 am
by HalopepZ
A tournament would work best on one of those maps that are fairly even for both sides, so it is a matter of skill that wins, not the biggest gun.