German fighter losses before 42

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Crazygunner1
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German fighter losses before 42

Post by Crazygunner1 » Tue Feb 25, 2014 12:44 pm

This is something i wanted to adress for a long time to see if i am the only one noticing....

German fighter losses are always higher than the allies during 1940 campaigns in France and further on....I have checked for some time now and i find that around 80-90% of the time this is true. How can this be? Just to clarify, i am not counting ground combat or bomber losses, only air to air combat vs allied fighters.

Most of the time german organisation is about 20-30 points higher than their counterparts and usually equal research, wich should give them an advantage, at best i get equal results. I feel that this lasts pretty much until new fighter tech is discovered and usually beoynd 41 i get the results that is near the calculated outcome.

Even when i play the allies i am more than happy to challange the luftwaffe early in the game to inflict heavy losses on german fighters. I know there shouldn´t be a difference but can´t help to think there is.

What´s your experience guys?

Crazyg

pk867
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Re: German fighter losses before 42

Post by pk867 » Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:32 pm

As the Allies or the Axis my fighters suck early in the war.
In other words, as the Allies I take way more damage than my Axis counterpart, and if I play the Axis (rarely) I seem to suffer more that my Allied counterpart.

So I guess I am an average (ie. suck) player :)

Crazygunner1
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Re: German fighter losses before 42

Post by Crazygunner1 » Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:09 pm

He he he

You are being a bit harsh i think ;)

The point i am trying to make is that the german fighters suffer more losses than they should early in the war

Crazygunner1
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Re: German fighter losses before 42

Post by Crazygunner1 » Wed Feb 26, 2014 10:31 am

Do you get lower odds when intercepted as a "surprize" penalty? Are the odds ever change in any condition in air to air combat?

Kragdob
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Re: German fighter losses before 42

Post by Kragdob » Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:18 pm

I have the same feeling. But I am used since it is usually my 2 FTRs vs. 3-4 on Allied side (+CV). This is referring to France.

But anyway I also see the organization difference to have little impact on the combat. Usually my Russian FTRs are not that inferior to Axis' even in 1942. Even if tech and organization would suggest the different.
Never in the field of human conflict was so much owed by so many to so few.

Crazygunner1
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Re: German fighter losses before 42

Post by Crazygunner1 » Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:44 pm

Kragdob wrote:I have the same feeling. But I am used since it is usually my 2 FTRs vs. 3-4 on Allied side (+CV). This is referring to France.

But anyway I also see the organization difference to have little impact on the combat. Usually my Russian FTRs are not that inferior to Axis' even in 1942. Even if tech and organization would suggest the different.
So you experience it on the russian front as well? Usually i have tech advantage against the russians when playing Axis so combat results are almost always in favor to the Axis for me

Refering to organisation i have to disagree. I notice that performance is substancially increased when a leader is near, also when Axis get the 4th level organisation upgrade wich grants 6 more ponints, there is some differnece in performance. Not to mention the worthless italians i focused on organisation instead of industry one time and got them to actually perform rather well in combat :)

I think you also feel the weight of the russians later in the game when tech is about the same as Axis but they have caught up in organisation, or the first big ones that grant 10 points.

Peter Stauffenberg
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Re: German fighter losses before 42

Post by Peter Stauffenberg » Wed Feb 26, 2014 2:47 pm

My experience is that the Axis fighters initially inflict more losses than they receive, but after some time it changes.

I think this has something to do with the Axis always being on the attack. The Allied player usually repairs losses back to 10 steps and gains morale by resting. The Axis fighters lose morale by being on the attack and also lose some steps. The morale lost by the defender too is partially regained by just repairing.

If there are more defending air units then some defenders are not affected at all and gain morale.

The Germans have the upper hand initially since the presence of a leader brings the initial morale to a higher Level than for the Allied fighters.

Air combat is simultaneous so the defender doesn't have an advantage.

Morris
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Re: German fighter losses before 42

Post by Morris » Fri Feb 28, 2014 4:37 am

The main problem is feeling : Axis feel the air lost as a big casualty ,but for Allies especially for France ,they almost feel nothing hurt at normal loss .

Cybvep
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Re: German fighter losses before 42

Post by Cybvep » Fri Feb 28, 2014 11:41 am

When I'm playing as the Axis, I usually get the feeling that the Allies are not suffering enough. When I'm playing as the Allies, it's the opposite - why those damn Axis fighters are so effective? :D

Diplomaticus
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Re: German fighter losses before 42

Post by Diplomaticus » Thu Mar 13, 2014 11:38 pm

Don't forget also the fact that when you repair on home turf you don't lose 'veteran' status when you repair, but if you're in foreign territory all your replacements are newbs. I wonder if you're noticing the effects of combat experience?

Another possible explanation is that air combat, as I understand it, is the most randomized--that is, there are larger possible variations between 'good' and 'bad' results in air combat than in any other type. You could test for that by re-running (reloading) the same fight over and over.

Axis have the problem that they often have to be on the move, moving out of their own borders, moving beyond their '5' supply range, and it's just easier to keep effectiveness and steps at max when you can stay in one place, close to home.

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