My Review of the Various Specializations

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kverdon
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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by kverdon » Mon Jun 08, 2015 5:27 am

I think, that along with "Proximity Fuse", they should change the other option to "Radar Assisted Surface Gunfire". THAT, more than anything else, started to turn the tide in USN/IJN surface engagements. Allow a Gunfire "+" for USN ships with that option.

FWIW, in context of the Game, I like the British Fleet option at the end. Combined with your core Surface Fleet, you can battle into Tokyo Bay and have the KGV provide Naval Gubfire ashore for the final battle. The KGV, SoDak and 2CA were able to blast anything around the imperial palace into dust.

rezaf
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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by rezaf » Mon Jun 08, 2015 6:02 am

kverdon wrote:FWIW, in context of the Game, I like the British Fleet option at the end. Combined with your core Surface Fleet, you can battle into Tokyo Bay and have the KGV provide Naval Gubfire ashore for the final battle. The KGV, SoDak and 2CA were able to blast anything around the imperial palace into dust.
Yeah, I can imagine that - I even wreaked major havoc with my core fleet alone.

Btw., what's the weapon that randomly one-shot-kills some of your naval units in that mission?
_____
rezaf

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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by kverdon » Mon Jun 08, 2015 4:05 pm

I have not figured that out yet but I was wondering if they are Kaitens. The Japanese took one of their Long Lance Torpedoes, tripled the warhead explosive and added manual controls to make it a guided Kamikaze Torpedo called a Kaiten. I have not picked one up on Sonar yet but suspect that is what is happening.

Longasc
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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by Longasc » Mon Jun 08, 2015 7:55 pm

There are only Kamikaze boats and it needs two, no secret weapons of any kind there.

rezaf
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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by rezaf » Mon Jun 08, 2015 8:48 pm

That can't be true Longasc.
You see the kamikaze boats coming and, like you said, they don't one-hit kill.
But I lost three destroyers which were reduced from full strength to zero in a single attack.

I assumed it had something to do with the message about mines in the bay, but I'm obviously not sure. It's definately not the Kamikaze boats, though.
_____
rezaf

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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by Myrddraal » Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:23 pm

The AI gets access to some of the technologies / units that come from specialisations, but it's preset per scenario. In particular, you'll notice kamikaze units in the late campaign when playing as the US.

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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by simcc » Tue Jun 09, 2015 4:18 am

Rezaf I think that unit is a kamikaze sub IIRC if you choose kamikaze for Japanese specialization you can get 1 too. Need to confirm that again.

After playing many time and almost finishing both fleet admiral (US) and kamikaze (IJ) I have to say that the specialization is an added fun but seriously need rework as some of it is really out of place especially IJ campaign side. Also been doing some record on the units for both side I can safely note that the advance airplane specialization is really not helpful as there is no chance to use them.

Air Force discovery as IJ side.
- land aircraft is able to deploy in RManila, BBataan, Java, then a long break as coral, midway and Guadalcanal no land airfield then in Brisbane and Melbourne you get land airfield.
- most of the plane introduce is around Brisbane scenario which is too late in game.
- strategic bomber is only limited to 6 maps IIRC out of 12 maps which is a bummer to invest in them.
- most plane IJ players will be using and carrying in the campaign is zero, kanbaku and kanko and some better stuff in the last 3 scenario which again is a bummer and I can guarantee that many players only use zeroes for their fighter selection and we have a total of 15 fighters yet only 3 carrier base and the 2 came in Melborne (last scenario)
- awesome fighter like Toryu and other interceptor have no chance to shine due to available too late or no airfield wat a bummer. I really love Toryu chasing those strategic bomber as its very very good vs them and have a good air defence hence take less losses to enemy fighter compare to zero which air defence is only average.
- there are around 30 planes type in total IIRC and if you do a survey you will notice most players only use 3-5 types of plane in the campaign which again will affect the players gameplay and totally frustrated with the idea "hmm nice plane lets upgrade and realise you can't use you new bought for the nxt mission wat a bummer" which I think many players will just keep it safe and buy zero kanbaku and kanko

Tanks
- this is another bummer super sensha IIRC all new tanks get replace to fast and if you don't buy them when they avail on that scenario chances are it's no longer avail to purchase in the next mission.
- tank get replace so fast if you chase after the upgrade (no cheap upgrade either) you will run out of RP very fast.
- best part of all if you have played kamikaze diff you really hardly use your new tanks as I remember a big US tank in NZealand took 8 points out of my type 2 Ka Mi, he didn't survive the nxt infantry attack. Even your best tanks get taken out by enemy tanks in kamikaze mode as those strength 13 really dominate hahaha. Better of get an AT.
- starting from N.Caled you will be spending lots of RP if you want the latest tanks which is a bummer if you choose this specialization as it didn't help you but bankrupt you in the end.

All in all I would say this area needs to be look into especially IJ, for US I still find it bearable for their specialization but with that said I still hope for improvement for US side as well but for IJ side it's completely broken atm IMO.

I keep logs and unit stats and upgrade avail timing for the entire campaign when I am doing my last campaign play so I realise IJ hardware and its timing for avail almost make it useless in game wise eg planes and tanks oh also to mention that moving AA truck upgraded 3 times since N.Caled (when it's avail).

There is lots of units avail in game and it makes a lot of tactic challenge for all but honestly the timing of new unit avail is really frustrating either you get unit early and follow to last mission still haven't obsolete eg Kanko, Hamaki or you get those unit that only avail for a mission then next mission puff new unit lol can't even buy another if you love it hahaha another eg is tank Ha Go that unit is avail for sometime which is nice and then you get Chi Ha IIRC that is a very fast obsolete tank.

Lots of unit = great, lots of unit but can't use or being replace too fast = hate the unit hahaha

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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by PanzerTax » Tue Jun 09, 2015 12:39 pm

Myrddraal: thanks for your response. Specializations are certainly an exciting feature.
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Longasc
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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by Longasc » Tue Jun 09, 2015 1:25 pm

I found only 1 Kamikaze sub and it didn't one-shot anything either, it rather did 0 damage. So wondering what supposedly one-shots stuff in the Tokio scenario.

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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by Longasc » Tue Jun 09, 2015 1:31 pm

rezaf wrote:I assumed it had something to do with the message about mines in the bay, but I'm obviously not sure. It's definately not the Kamikaze boats, though.
The mines don't move to attack, so it would have to happen in your turn. But yeah, there are some mines:

SPOILER for those who don't want to know, so don't click if you don't want to see their location:

http://fs2.directupload.net/images/150609/rtn4ef3g.jpg

rezaf
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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by rezaf » Tue Jun 09, 2015 1:44 pm

Yeah, I meant I thought there were "special" mine events unrelated to the actual mines.
Those I uncover with my destroyers, obviously.
_____
rezaf

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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by adherbal » Tue Jun 09, 2015 2:29 pm

Some ideas to make the Specialisations more useful/noticable:

Japan
  • Banzai Charge:
    When used, the opponent is treated as having the "Quick Retreat" trait, meaning it will retreat when expecting casualties >30% of current hitpoints.
  • Bushido Code:
    Additonal effect increases unit attack as its strength decreases, but sacrificing some defense. For example +5% attack and -2% defense for every hitpoint lost. This would mean badly damaged units deal higher damage but take a bit more casualties.
  • Tokyo Express:
    Increase bonus to +2 coastal supply? This would allow DDs to support secondary landings of significant strength.
  • Forced Labour:
    Next to RP from attacking surrounded enemy units, you also receive RP for forcing an enemy unit to retreat.
  • Super Sensha:
    Next to the quicker availability of better tanks, it immediately adds a (random?) new tank type to your core force.
  • Advanced Aircraft Engines:
    Next to the quicker availability of better aircraft, it immediately adds a (random?) new aircraft type to your core force.
  • Wolfpack:
    Adds a unique "Milchkuh" submarine which can repair submarines the same way Supply Ships can.
  • Defensive Doctrine:
    The main issue with this one is the lack of defensive scenarios in the Japanese campaign. Perhaps it should add a more general defensive combat bonus as well?
  • Wunderwaffe:
    Randomly adds either a Nebelwerfer or a Tiger tank to your core force, free of charge.
  • Kamikaze:
    Randomly adds a few kamikaze units of various types, free of charge.
Image

blond_knight_new
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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by blond_knight_new » Tue Jun 09, 2015 3:52 pm

adherbal wrote:Some ideas to make the Specialisations more useful/noticable:

Japan
  • Banzai Charge:
    When used, the opponent is treated as having the "Quick Retreat" trait, meaning it will retreat when expecting casualties >30% of current hitpoints.
Maybe a little OT but Im disappointed theres no sound associated with the Banzai Charge.

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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by stragen » Tue Jun 09, 2015 10:30 pm

adherbal wrote:Some ideas to make the Specialisations more useful/noticable:

Japan
  • Banzai Charge:
    When used, the opponent is treated as having the "Quick Retreat" trait, meaning it will retreat when expecting casualties >30% of current hitpoints.
  • Bushido Code:
    Additonal effect increases unit attack as its strength decreases, but sacrificing some defense. For example +5% attack and -2% defense for every hitpoint lost. This would mean badly damaged units deal higher damage but take a bit more casualties.
  • Tokyo Express:
    Increase bonus to +2 coastal supply? This would allow DDs to support secondary landings of significant strength.
  • Forced Labour:
    Next to RP from attacking surrounded enemy units, you also receive RP for forcing an enemy unit to retreat.
  • Super Sensha:
    Next to the quicker availability of better tanks, it immediately adds a (random?) new tank type to your core force.
  • Advanced Aircraft Engines:
    Next to the quicker availability of better aircraft, it immediately adds a (random?) new aircraft type to your core force.
  • Wolfpack:
    Adds a unique "Milchkuh" submarine which can repair submarines the same way Supply Ships can.
  • Defensive Doctrine:
    The main issue with this one is the lack of defensive scenarios in the Japanese campaign. Perhaps it should add a more general defensive combat bonus as well?
  • Wunderwaffe:
    Randomly adds either a Nebelwerfer or a Tiger tank to your core force, free of charge.
  • Kamikaze:
    Randomly adds a few kamikaze units of various types, free of charge.
Forced Labour: Or it could be changed that you get a small amount for destroying enemies units. This retreat RP's can be easily exploited.

Tank Spec: I am not sold on this super tank with only 2 movement speed. Because when i want tanks it's for mobile Warfare. So all units with speed lower 3 are not very useful in my opinion. I always buy ART and such stuff with transport. Because i don't want to leave half of my troops behind. Suggestion: Maybe tanks earlier available, maybe add a small amount of attack and defense value. OR is you want to keep the super tank increase the speed to 3 and adjust some other stats. He got a better engine but lost on armor or cannon side.

Air Spec: First i would like to see that pioneers can build a airfield. Maybe a small, temporary with supply output for 2 planes. So that you can use other planes then zeros and the 2 tactical bombers in the beginning. And if it's possible make a restriction for only 1 or 2 temporary airfields and a construction time like 3 rounds. If not possible you can give all the planes more range and speed through better engines and fuel efficiency.

simcc
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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by simcc » Wed Jun 10, 2015 3:58 am

First off tank to the developer for listening which is much appreciated. I only hope that you guys (developer) don't rush into the changes but take time to consider how it will impact your future DLC and grand campaign if you guys are planning any.

IMO specialization for early stage should give player different play style and mid should give tactical advantage while late stage should have free stuff and cost advantage. Below list my opinion on suggested changes.

1. Banzai and bushido both are very good to me atm. Banzai is useful for breaching defence particular river defence however adding a sure retreat factor means river breaching is easier. Bushido at first I don't know how to use it but later I tried a different approach I found it very useful. Infantry is 50% of marine cost so for crossing jungle many use marine as red efficiency means instant death for infantry but with bushido it is very very useful and keep those infantry alive and you have a cheaper core army. I found bushido useful starting from Bataan, Java, Guadalcanal and N.Caled, works like magic and I save lots of RP for not buying marine and its replacement.

2. Tokyo express = useful as it is which create a very different tactical gameplay. Force labour that's the specialization I struggle to understand and useful. RP gain for enemy retreat don't really picture force labour and have small tactical gameplay to none in game. I would suggest this specialization lets Engineer to build airstrip (2 plane capacity) and harbor. This would show IRL how they use PoW to build infrastructure like deadly Burma Rail and it also solve the request for engineer ability to build airfield.

3. Sensha and aircraft both offering free unit is not that attractive as you need airfield to deploy plane and again without airstrip building ability it's worth very less. Instead of free unit, should it allow 20-30% cheaper upgrade cost as better technology means cheaper refitting and spare parts. Maybe give a hero instead of free unit? I dunno either or is great. If force labour allow airstrip building then advance aircraft would be a great choice. Also the gameplay and style would have change hence different playing experience. As player using force and advance air will not be so focus on amphibious attack style while using Tokyo and sensha mean land focus style.

4. Wolfpack, this is the specilization I don't think will be usefull in grand campaign style. 2 free unit ain't much even in this game at the near final stage it ain't that useful. Adding repair sub don't help either as many players have already struggle using support ship also I don't see a repair sub helping much in tactical advantage. I would suggest taking wolf = free unit and lower the command cost for deployment for subs from 3 to 2 so encouraging subs lovers to use more of their subs and name Wolfpack hunt in pack means more subs. 6 naval will get you 2 subs but with wolf you get to deploy 3 and 3 is a pack hahahaha. Def doctrine is useful and don't need much changes as I would see this useful for DLC and GC mode. Maybe a bobby trap feature for marine which can only be use on jungle and city hex. Japs like bobby traps a lot IRL.

5. Late game specilization hmmmm, wunderwaffe maybe should have tiger 2 and that rocket truck ( can't remember the name atm) more German tech would be nice. Kamikaze I dunno really out of place maybe should be tier 3 instead of tier 5 maybe swap with Wolfpack? This I really have no idea as its historical and a must to represent Japanese determination but I game either give this to us earlier of remove that from the end. Don't make sense at all.

Thx

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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by simcc » Wed Jun 10, 2015 4:03 am

Maybe Kamikaze should be made a special ability rather than a specialization and free that slot for some other new specialization. Also forget to write down for Wolfpack maybe we can introduce that nasty Japanese super sub that carry 3 bombers can't recall the name atm. I think the final specialization of kamikaze should be replace with those secret Japanese weapons that will exist if they are winning the war like super battleship or carrier or jets or even chemical weapons

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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by kverdon » Wed Jun 10, 2015 9:18 pm

The lack of land airbases certainly reflects history. As documented in "Fire in the SKy", the Japanese lacked a professional engineer corps and certainly nothing approaching the Navy Seabees. Their construction groups were mostly conscript labor and it took them Months to accomplish what the Seabees could do in weeks.

Perhaps, one of the Japanese specializations could be "Construction Batallions" or some such that would allow the Japanese Player to build an Airfield during a scenario.

Thanks,

Kevin

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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by Horst » Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:28 pm

While the British Fleet in Tokyo seems more useful in the long run than too-expensive one-shot Nuclear Bombers, only 50 RPs to repair their gear without income per turn is definitely too mean.

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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by Mojko » Sun Jan 24, 2016 3:27 am

Here are my thoughts:

US:

Field medics

As mentioned earlier, this is useful in the early game, but getting RPs is always good and since it's so easy getting it, I think it's well balanced. The only problem I see here is medical jeep. After some testing I determined that it's used to heal other units, but it costs RPs and it lowers efficiency of both the jeep and the healed unit. I recommend to charge RPs as normal replacement, but remove the efficiency loss completely.

Higgins boat

This specialization is bad, because you don't want to attack on the same turn as you disembarked, because of the lowered efficiency. I recommend changing this effect to reducing (or removing) efficiency loss at disembark.

Jerry can

Effect needs to be completely scrapped. Early game you are starved on RPs, not supply. Later on you have much more supply that you ever need. I recommend changing this effect to land transport and recon units cost 1 less supply.

Flight school

This one is fine, but I would change the experience gain to two stars.

Proximity fuse and Naval radar are fine I think.

Landing craft tank

Same treatment as Higgins boat.

Advanced auronautics

I recommend changing this effect to reduce the RPs required to upgrade an air unit (no effect on discounted upgrades)

British pacific fleet and Manhattan project are fine.

Japan:

Banzai charge

I think this one is too good actually. I would only allow this ability to be used on units with lowered efficiency. To compensate, I would lower the attack gain, but also remove the failure penalty.

Bushido code

This one is really bad. I would change it to "as long as there is an adjacent friendly unit efficiency can't be lowered to 5 or less".

Super sensha and high powered aircraft engines

Same treatment as Advanced auronautics.

Wolfpack

This one is bad. I would change it to something similar to British pacific fleet. For example it could add a small German fleet containing Graff Zeppelin aircraft carrier.

Defensive doctrine is fine.

Wunderwaffe is fine.

Kamikaze is very thematic, but I would never pick it, because the other option is still better. I recommend replacing this with something completely different.
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Re: My Review of the Various Specializations

Post by Ichthyic » Mon May 02, 2016 10:58 pm

ok, so I chose the defensive doctrine to start the invasion of Australia.

but....

-none of my core units actually start entrenched.

-there is no button to create foxhole.

using version 2.38 (US Marines expansion).

any advice?

Edit:

restarting the scenario made the buttons for foxhole/bunker available, but still core troops do not start off entrenched as per the description. Actually... I take that back...ONE did start entrenched, just one: My antiaircraft unit. that's it. none of the other units started out entrenched.

also, it costs not only cash but troop health just to build a foxhole? why? makes no sense.

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