Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Order of Battle is a series of operational WW2 games starting with the Pacific War and then on to Europe!

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adrianoku
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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by adrianoku » Wed Jan 04, 2017 9:47 am

Hi Erik, just finished Lodtz scenery in the campaign, captured Lodtz, destroyed the 3 bunkers south of the town , captured every flag in the map but the mission results not accomplished ... what I have to do?

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Erik2 » Wed Jan 04, 2017 10:10 am

gatto wrote:Hi Erik, just finished Lodtz scenery in the campaign, captured Lodtz, destroyed the 3 bunkers south of the town , captured every flag in the map but the mission results not accomplished ... what I have to do?
I think all objectives must be free of enemy units in a 2-hex radius, sure this is true?

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by adrianoku » Wed Jan 04, 2017 12:50 pm

Yes everything is clear, (used #orbitalcommand ) However the mission capture Lodz is "failed"...
Perhaps there is a "timing" in Lodz conquest? I mean, I left the 3 bunkers alive, conquered Lodz and every other flag in the map, then returned back to bunkers and destroyed them. I'll use %igotnukes to go over...

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Horst » Wed Jan 04, 2017 1:36 pm

The trigger failure here is most likely the Capture VP Event combined with scenario turn-end condition what isn’t working that well. There are no more '2-hex radius without enemies' conditions in Lodz.
These triggers would generally work better if they trigger on Any Event without need to wait for the scenario to end or whatever else specifically should happen. The game automatically declares a victory if all primary objectives are met, major victory if also all secondary ones are completed. I think many players are already used to wait grabbing all primary conditions before completing the secondary ones first. No one really wants to wait until the turn limit if all conditions are already met for a victory earlier. The game rewards all left income/turn points anyway.

What would also look better in the objective screen if unaccomplished objectives are Open (?) instead of Failed (X). Failed is only appropriate for objectives with a time limit or if there is no other possibility left to do them.
Having two checks of flag-ownership for player and AI for an objective is good and already heavily used in this campaign. If you don’t manage to achieve all objectives then it doesn’t really matter if it is failed or open as you can’t see much of the objective screen under the defeat event picture anyway. The blue ? simply looks less alarming than the red bad mojo X during the scenario.

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Erik2 » Wed Jan 04, 2017 6:54 pm

I have removed the last end-scenario-trigger on Lodz itself. Scenario attached and campaign updated.

Not sure when the game chooses to use the red fail vs question mark....
Attachments
4Lodz.zip
(1.4 MiB) Downloaded 64 times

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Erik2 » Wed Jan 04, 2017 7:44 pm

Here's a screenshot from a Sea Lion scenario test.
None of the objectives use any end-of-scenario triggers (only standard hex ownership), all of them look like red cross HQs.
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red cross.jpg
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Horst
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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Horst » Wed Jan 04, 2017 10:53 pm

Such posts rather belong to the scenario forum, but as far as I understand the editor objective state works like this:
If you don't set any state then you get no icon before the objectives.
If you set Open then you get this blue question mark.
If you set Failed then you get this red cross.
If you set Completed then you get the green check.

For example in Norway, you set the Open state for the supply routes as long as they are broken. This is well done that way.
If you choose the ownership of flags the flip-flop way then you often use the Failed state which IMHO looks bad/inappropriate that a player thinks this objective can't be achieved anymore. Flip-flopping between Open (?) and Completed (green check) simply looks better or is less alarming for players. That's what I meant in my previous post.
I would reserve the Failed state for only objectives that require a turn-limit or if you need to intercept certain units before they can exit the map. If an ownership may never switch sides, like defending certain flags then it's obivously fine too that such objective may completely fail forever.

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Erik2 » Thu Jan 05, 2017 8:35 am

Aha, so the open/completed/failed status decides what symbol to use. Didn't know that.
Personally I'd prefer to see the red cross if I have not met that objective, rather than the indecisive '?'

Horst
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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Horst » Thu Jan 05, 2017 9:00 am

Failing is rather what I often do in your untested scenarios because of faulty triggers that prevent me from being victorious in the end. :wink:
You can't fail what you haven't tried yet, can you?
The question mark possibly only gives a hint what to do or expect as rewards for specific objectives if you click on this. If you don't add such objective-text then you possibly get no icon there. My theory above was most likely wrong about Open state. There is only one way to figure anything out for sure: testing on your own!

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Erik2 » Thu Jan 05, 2017 10:21 am

Horst

I usually spend 8-10 hours creating one of these scenarios.
Testing one thoroughly would probably take at least as many hours, meaning less time building them.
That is why I really appreciate detailed feedback like yours :D

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Horst » Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:33 pm

Eric, most people here don’t seem to have played past the third of the scenarios of this campaign so far. Especially after so many maps you should get a mapping-rest and enjoy your creations by playing them too!
Players like me have no clue what should happen during scenarios, like triggered spawns that possibly don’t work at certain turns. Only the creator knows best every detail and can figure things out what to do when things go the wrong way. I don’t count myself as competent enough to know my way around the editor. Especially questions of balancing and such, requires as many players as possible, including the creator who knows best all variables. Balancing requires time, but right now most scenarios can’t even be finished the non-cheated way what is not very motivating players like me. As player, it feels like getting a slap in the face each time you have spend hours too playing each scenario just to figure out in the end that you can’t win it without a victory-cheat. You don’t want to release something that doesn’t work most of the time either, do you?
No sweats, I'm still going to fight my way through the bugs and keep you informed!

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by GiveWarAchance » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:09 pm

Thank you for making new campaigns.

I only have Pacific campaigns Morning Sun and Marines so far (not Blitzkrieg) so can this be played with the base game or do I need Blitzkrieg to run it?

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by bru888 » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:32 pm

You can play any customized campaign or scenario without owning any of the DLC, just the basic game with the latest patch.
- Bru

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by GiveWarAchance » Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:40 pm

ok thanks Bru

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Parallax » Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:52 pm

Just finished first scenario. It looks very promising. But i have a question. My Primary Objective Glogau was captured by enemy and then retaken by me, but in objectives menu this objective is "Objective Failed". Is it normal?

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Erik2 » Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:29 am

Parallax wrote:Just finished first scenario. It looks very promising. But i have a question. My Primary Objective Glogau was captured by enemy and then retaken by me, but in objectives menu this objective is "Objective Failed". Is it normal?
You had captured the objective at the end of the scenario and it still displayed as failed?

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Lodz

Post by Erik2 » Fri Jan 06, 2017 12:42 pm

I have gotten a few posts/emails about the Lodz objective not working. Even with screenshots (althoguh obscuring the objective).
Well, I tested the latest version in hot-seat, moved the Poles out of the way and presto; Lodz works just fine.
And I have the screenshot to prove it :D
Back to Sea Lion!
Attachments
lodz.jpg
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London

Post by Erik2 » Fri Jan 06, 2017 12:57 pm

A little teaser as I'm close to finishing the many scenarios in Sea Lion.
Here's a small part of Greater London as a few German units are dying to try their new tennis gear at Wimbledon.
I'm starting the test drive now. Only 9 more scenarios left :roll:
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London.jpg
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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Parallax » Fri Jan 06, 2017 1:41 pm

Erik wrote:You had captured the objective at the end of the scenario and it still displayed as failed?
Glogau is a bridge-town in far left side of the map. I recapruted it on 4th or 5th turn and for the rest of the mission it was "Objective Failed". I just replayed scenario and forgot to take screenshot

PS: At the start of the second level, in briefing menu i saw text "Because you were not able to cripple the Polish Air Force...", but i was able. I captured 3 airfields in previous mission. I think it just briefing text mistake, because in the mission i saw only 1 polish aircraft

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Re: Fall Weiss+Weserübung+Fall Gelb= Blitzkrieg 1939-40

Post by Erik2 » Fri Jan 06, 2017 2:18 pm

Parallax wrote:
Erik wrote:You had captured the objective at the end of the scenario and it still displayed as failed?
Glogau is a bridge-town in far left side of the map. I recapruted it on 4th or 5th turn and for the rest of the mission it was "Objective Failed". I just replayed scenario and forgot to take screenshot

PS: At the start of the second level, in briefing menu i saw text "Because you were not able to cripple the Polish Air Force...", but i was able. I captured 3 airfields in previous mission. I think it just briefing text mistake, because in the mission i saw only 1 polish aircraft
OK, which scenario is this?

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