New Beta Version this week - changes from 4.06 listed here

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rbodleyscott
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New Beta Version this week - changes from 4.06 listed here

Post by rbodleyscott » Sat Feb 10, 2007 8:41 pm

Changes since V 4.06

JD will be sending out the new beta version this week. I am sorry we have not highlighted all the changes in the rules, but if we did, most of the text would be highlighted!

Therefore please read the following list of major changes, and then the new rules version.

Detailed wording changes are far too numerous to list, and may well modify the rules concerned, but the following important changes have been made. I will certainly have missed something important, for which I apologise. There is no substitute for carefully reading the rules. (As my old friend Phil used to say). :wink:

1) Crossbows

Get the same shooting dice as other bows. Get the following POAs: -1 vs foot, +1 vs elephants, 0 vs other mounted. (whatever the target??™s armour class).

2) Firearms and Artillery use the same shooting factors as crossbows ??“ as above.

3) Naphtha Bombs count as firearms.

4) Points changes

a) Foot crossbows cost 1
b) Mounted crossbows cost 2
c) Drilled cost for Protected foot 1
d) Pikemen cost 0 (In addition to the basic troop cost, before some silly person makes a witty remark)
e) Armoured cavalry ??“ Elite 15, Superior 13
f) Cataphracts ??“ 16, 14, 12, 9
g) Heavily armoured Knights ??“ Elite 22, Average 15
h) Portable defences (stakes) cost 3 points but you only need enough to cover the frontage of half the bases in the battle group. Stakes are generally all/0 in the army lists permitted them.

5) Generals ??“ no longer have to be fighting in the front rank to bolster or affect CT of BG in close combat. If fighting in the front rank in close combat cannot affect CT or CMT of other friendly BGs.

6) LF can no longer give impact phase rear support shooting dice against charging enemy foot ??“ only against mounted. MF can still give rear support shooting effect vs foot as well as mounted. (This is to reduce Mexican stand-offs and in most cases can be rationalised as the LF supported foot BG ???counter-charging??? the enemy foot. Note: They still count as ???stationary??? for POAs!).

7) Fields ??“ Hedges no longer count as defensible obstacles. Enclosed fields become rough going. Open fields remain uneven going.

8 ) Chariots ??“ lancers POA now counts vs chariots except scythed chariots. Heavy chariot impact POA does not count vs lancers. Chariot melee POA corrected to be the same as impact POA.

9) Heavy Artillery go back to having an Effective and Long Range.


10) Exchange moves. Medium or Heavy Foot can do an exchange move with Light Artillery. This can be done in normal movement or as an intercept, so they can prevent enemy from contacting the artillery.

11) Expand and Advance is now a complex move for Drilled troops.

12) Rules for evading have changed significantly ??“ please read.

13) Rout direction clarified.

14) Column adds only 1 MU to movement in terrain.

15) Extra move for LF to pass through friends restricted to +2MUs except when routing or evading.

16) Restricted area changed to 2 MUs. Advanced straight ahead permitted.

17) Broken troops cannot be rallied if there are enemy within 6 MUs.

18 ) There are no mounted foot.

19) Mounted troops can only dismount at deployment and only in certain circumstances ??“ see Appendix 5.

20) Shifts

Full base width shifts only allowed outside 6 MUs of enemy,
Half-base width shifts only allowed if necessary to avoid colliding with terrain or friends.

21) Charging troops can contract by 1 base width if necessary to get past any friends.

22) General cannot influence a CMT after moving in the same phase.

23) Interception charges cannot move further than the BGs ZOI.

24) Contracting: Can move less than 3 MUs and contract in same circumstances as stationary.

25) Shock Troops. Now only have to test if in charge reach. Foot test not to charge charge foot. Mounted test not to charge mounted or foot. Foot must test not to charge LF, and Mounted not to charge LH or LF, unless the skirmishers are blocked from them by intervening troops.

26) War wagons need a CMT to move at all.

27) ORB permitted to all (and only) pikemen and spearmen (not light spears). (Note that the name ORB will probably be changed to hedgehog or something similar to distinguish the long pointy stick version from Roman Orbes)

28 ) Wheels and short moves require a CMT even outside 6 MUs of enemy if there is no general with the BG/BL.

29) Base losses inflicted by pursuers on routers now take place at the end of each pursuit move in which the pursuers end still in contact.

30) Elephants can only be in battle groups of 2 bases each.

31) Flank charges cannot include a wheel unless the charging battle group starts its move with its nearest point at least 1 MU away from the battle group being charged. (To stop ???en passant??? flank charges)

32) Pikes get 4th rank unless FRAGMENTED or SEVERELY DISORDERED.
Last edited by rbodleyscott on Sun Feb 11, 2007 11:46 am, edited 2 times in total.

rbodleyscott
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Post by rbodleyscott » Sat Feb 10, 2007 8:46 pm

For those testers who don't have 4.06, here is a reprint of the list of changes from the previous version to V4.06:
Main changes since previous Beta

The layout of the whole rules has been reorganized. Main rules changes in the forthcoming beta as below:

1) Turning 180 degrees and advancing with skirmishers is a SIMPLE move.

2) LF not disordered in Difficult terrain.

3) Generals move as if light horse.

4) A battle group entirely of Light Foot cannot charge or intercept unbroken non-skirmishers in open terrain (even in the flank or rear).

5) Only pursue if all opponents break (other than those only fought as an overlap).

6) Break-off by mounted ??“ only if more than half their frontal close combat opponents are steady foot.

7) Impact phase ???support shooting??? ??“ using shooting POAs. Not that this is not a simple matter of doing it exactly as per shooting, because the number of dice is different (for crossbowmen if we want them to have 1 dice per base).

8 ) -1 shooting at chargers

9) Cataphracts 1 dice in melee & points cost reduced accordingly.

10) Impact POA: Foot with light spear + unless charging shock mounted

11) -1 cohesion test modifier when losing impact phase combat vs impact foot or lancers. Note that this in the ???any one of??? section, so MF losing impact phase vs HF impact foot in the open will only get one -1.

12) Cost of lancers raised to +2 to adjust to this benefit

13) Cost of HW reduced to 2

14) Impact POA ??“ allow HW to count vs steady pk/sp. ???Heavy weapon + against any foot???

15) Stationary Pikes/Spears in Impact phase only get + if at least 3 or 2 ranks deep.

16) New scouting/initiative/terrain system insert in ???Full Set-Up??? section. (See Appendix 5). Outflanking march cannot be commanded by C-in-C. The full set-up rules will be used at Usk.

17) Last bullet in Cohesion levels and effects table changed to:

???1 base removed for each enemy battle group in contact at the start of each inter-bound. ???

18 ) ???Does not count as STEADY??? added to descriptions of DISORDER and SEVERE DISORDER. ??“ so that disordered spears/pikes don??™t count as steady vs swords.

19) FRAGMENTED troops ??“ simple move ??“ retire from all enemy withing 12 MUs

20) ???A battle group in close combat can only be rallied by a general who is fighting in its front rank (See P.49). He can join the battle group to do so in the Inter-Bound phase, but must then stay fighting in the front rank until the close combat is over.???

21) Rear supporters must be at least half the original strength of supported battle group.

22) Melee: ??? ??? Rear ranks must belong to the same battle group.???

23) Impact POAs:

???Impact foot + If charging non-shock mounted other than elephants???



24) DISORDERED and SEVERELY DISORDERED added POA exceptions where appropriate.

Impact:

???Only in open terrain (See P.91) Extra for 4th rank of pikemen whether charging or not + if STEADY???

???Any spearmen or pikemen if not charging + unless FRAGMENTED or SEVERELY DISORDED or less than 2 ranks of spearmen or 3 ranks of pikemen

Pikemen or offensive spearmen if charging foot or non-shock mounted.
Defensive spearmen if charging defensive spearmen + unless SEVERELY DISORDERED or less than 2 ranks of spearmen or 3 ranks of pikemen???

Melee:
???Spearmen (at least 2 ranks) + unless FRAGMENTED or SEVERELY DISORDERED???

???Pikemen (at least 3 ranks) + unless FRAGMENTED or SEVERELY DISORDERED???

???Extra for 4th rank of Pikemen + if STEADY???

25) BG Destroyed in combat - Test as if it was broken.


War Wagon stuff

1) Definition: ???War Wagons WWg Horse or Ox drawn wagons usually with missile-armed crew on board. Treated as foot. Not very manoeuvrable, so always treated as Undrilled. Treated as if 2 bases side by side when shooting from or in close combat on their long base side, 1 base if shooting from or in close combat on their short base side.???

2) Charging

?????? War wagons cannot charge.???

3) Charging into the Flank or Rear

?????? War wagons and troops in ORB formation (See P.60) never count as being charged in flank or rear, whichever base edge is contacted. War wagons do not turn if contacted on their side or rear base edge.???

4) Moving into Contact with Enemy in the movement phase

???Battle groups can move into contact with enemy in the movement phase, but only if they are joining an existing melee as an overlap only. This is the only situation in which war wagons can move into contact with enemy.???

5) Battle Group Normal Formations

??? ???In a mixed battle group of war wagons and other foot, the other foot can turn 90 degrees to face the war wagons, so that they are supporting the long side of the war wagon bases. However, the battle group can only advance if all bases in the battle group are facing the same direction as the war wagons.???

6) Turning 90 degrees

?????? In a mixed battle group of war wagons and other foot, the other foot can turn 90 degrees to face the war wagons, so that they are supporting the long side of the war wagon bases.???

7) Arc of Fire: ???War Wagons can shoot from any side of their base ??“ chosen by the shooting player. They are treated as if 2 bases side by side when shooting from their long base side, 1 base when shooting from short base side.???

8 ) Shooting Dice: ???Chariots or war wagons 1 dice per front rank base???

9) Shooting POAs: ???War wagons, in cover or behind TF - Any except artillery ???

10) Troops eligible to fight in the Impact phase

??? ???War wagons are treated as if 2 bases side by side when fighting on their long base side, 1 base when fighting on their short base side.???


11) Impact POAs
???Elephants + against heavy or medium foot, war wagons or any mounted???

???Knightly lancers + against any except elephants, chariots, war wagons or non-charging STEADY pikemen/spearmen???

???Other lancers + against any except lancers, elephants, chariots, war wagons or non-charging STEADY pikemen/spearmen???

???Heavy or scythed chariots + against any except skirmishers, elephants, war wagons or non-charging STEADY pikemen/spearmen???

???War wagons or uphill or foot defending field fortifications,
a hedge or a river bank +???

12) Troops eligible to fight in the Melee Phase

??? ???War wagons are treated as if 2 bases side by side when fighting on their long base side, 1 base when fighting on their short base side.???

13) Melee Dice:

Main Rules:

???Artillery 1 dice per front rank base. No dice for rear rank bases of any type.
War wagons 1 dice per front rank base. 1 dice per 2nd rank foot base other than war wagons.???

Ref-Sheet:

???Artillery or war wagons 1 dice per 1st rank base. WWg count 1 dice per other foot in 2nd rank???

14) Melee POAs

War wagon or uphill or foot defending field fortifications, a hedge or a river bank +

???Elephants + against heavy or medium foot, war wagons or any mounted???

petedalby
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Post by petedalby » Sun Feb 11, 2007 11:35 am

Loads of great stuff in here! Thanks.

Look forward to trying them out soon.

Pete

marshalney2000
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Post by marshalney2000 » Sun Feb 11, 2007 10:34 pm

Development of the rules is very encouraging and can be seen to reflect the playing experiences of the testers.
Of now to read the rules from page 1 although the list of changes is useful in this respect,
Must admit have not played for a few weeks due to forthcoming changes and the need to remember how dbm worked before the competition season started but am now up for a another game of aow.
John

plewis66
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Re: New Beta Version this week - changes from 4.06 listed he

Post by plewis66 » Thu Feb 15, 2007 10:24 pm

rbodleyscott wrote:Changes since V 4.06
5) Generals ??“ no longer have to be fighting in the front rank to bolster or affect CT of BG in close combat. If fighting in the front rank in close combat cannot affect CT or CMT of other friendly BGs.
This is contradicted on page 52, para 3 of the rules, and, as previously noted, on the playsheet.

rbodleyscott
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Re: New Beta Version this week - changes from 4.06 listed he

Post by rbodleyscott » Thu Feb 15, 2007 11:19 pm

plewis66 wrote:
rbodleyscott wrote:Changes since V 4.06
5) Generals ??“ no longer have to be fighting in the front rank to bolster or affect CT of BG in close combat. If fighting in the front rank in close combat cannot affect CT or CMT of other friendly BGs.
This is contradicted on page 52, para 3 of the rules, and, as previously noted, on the playsheet.

:oops:

Curses, I distinctly remember deleting that paragraph. Wonder what happened.

It will be corrected in the next version. Till then play the rule as specified in the Cohesion Test chart in the main rules. i.e. If a BG is in close combat, it can only be influenced by a general who is with the BG, but he does not have to be fighting in the front rank.

madaxeman
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Post by madaxeman » Fri Feb 16, 2007 9:18 am

looks like a few things to give generals more of a function ?
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rbodleyscott
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Post by rbodleyscott » Fri Feb 16, 2007 9:22 am

madaxeman wrote:looks like a few things to give generals more of a function ?
Indeed

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Post by neilhammond » Fri Feb 16, 2007 8:29 pm

A good revision version.:D

A couple of minor comments:

p61. Elephant and Camerly Effects. You talk about "less than 1 base width from...". It might be more consistent to go for "within 2MU" as you're generally removing the "1 base width" measurement (I think this is the only place the 1 base width measurement still appears?)

p69. Appendix 4. Bulleted section. The definiton of the Armour classification is missing. Also, the hierarchy for the Melee POA "Better Armour" is still missing from the glossary.

Neil

rbodleyscott
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Post by rbodleyscott » Fri Feb 16, 2007 8:40 pm

neilhammond wrote:p61. Elephant and Camerly Effects. You talk about "less than 1 base width from...". It might be more consistent to go for "within 2MU" as you're generally removing the "1 base width" measurement (I think this is the only place the 1 base width measurement still appears?)
Unfortunately 2MUs does not work as we want. In 15mm it affects the 2nd base away (which is further than we intend). In 25mm it doesn't.

1MU doesn't work because it does not disorder the 2nd rank.

We are stuck with 1 base width if we want 15mm and 25mm to work the same - and we don't want Elephants to be more effective in 15mm.
p69. Appendix 4. Bulleted section. The definiton of the Armour classification is missing. Also, the hierarchy for the Melee POA "Better Armour" is still missing from the glossary.
Fair enough.

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