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rant

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 11:33 am
by grandad
i know ive asked questions that are in the book but i thought the whole idea of this site to ask questions about the rules you don't understand

Re: rant

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:02 pm
by grahambriggs
That's certainly one thing this site does. Bear in mind though, we're also just players of the game posting here to help. It often helps to be told where the rule is because some of the advice you get here may be wrong.

Re: rant

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 1:47 pm
by philqw78
But whay are you ranting? people have answered your question as far as I am aware.

Other people then come up with other questions and yet others come up with spurious comments.

But that is the way of open forums. Unfortunately we haven't seen much porn or Rumanian property for sale in a while though. But lets face it the modelling forum does it for a lot of people on here.

Re: rant

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 4:36 pm
by madaxeman
40 out of the last 90 questions posed in this forum have been posted by you, and almost all of them someone has been able to answer clearly within 1 or 2 posts, whilst only one or two have provoked any further discussion at all. That sort of suggests that that the answers to a lot - but not all - of your questions are easily found and clearly written in the rules.

The whole idea of this site to ask questions about the rules you don't understand even after you have looked them up in the rules first - it's not really here to be a substitute for looking them up.

Re: rant

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:00 pm
by philqw78
But if you have rarely played tabletop games before the ruleset is very daunting Tim. You could read it lots of times and still miss crucial stuff and not completely understand the easy stuff.

I had a boss in the army that told us even the worst recruit could be trained, some just needed more help.

Some we taught in Braille though.

Re: rant

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:00 pm
by Vespasian28
How do we know he hasn't looked them up? He seems to be implying he is asking questions about rules he does not understand.

For all I know he may be a complete newbie to wargaming and there is a lot that needs explaining. Iv'e been wargaming for over 40 years and I read this forum because I sometimes pick up things even after reading the rules and playing games beyond count.

Re: rant

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:42 pm
by kevinj
Personally I'm happier answering questions from someone who's actually trying to learn and play the game, as Grandad is, than some of the other people who sometimes post here.

Re: rant

Posted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:48 pm
by dave_r
grandad wrote:i know ive asked questions that are in the book but i thought the whole idea of this site to ask questions about the rules you don't understand
I'm afraid as rant's go, this one's rather quite poor. Sticks closely to subject matter, doesn't stray into other material, no profanity and no obvious target other than the general community. Completely misses the opportunity to have a pop at somebody specific and doesn't appear to be any real venom either.

Overall, as rant's go I'm afraid I can only give this a 2/10. Must do better.

Re: rant

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:57 am
by rbodleyscott
dave_r wrote:Must do better.
You could use that in your signature, Dave.

Re: rant

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:12 am
by dave_r
rbodleyscott wrote:
dave_r wrote:Must do better.
You could use that in your signature, Dave.
Probably will once i've got bored of the current one.

Re: rant

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 11:13 am
by MatthewP
We're all bored of the current one :D

Re: rant

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:01 pm
by spike
madaxeman wrote:
...
The whole idea of this site to ask questions about the rules you don't understand even after you have looked them up in the rules first - it's not really here to be a substitute for looking them up.
I think you are being a bit unfair Tim, but how many of us have been playing since 2008, and still dont know what it said in V.1 ( it would be cruel to mention "Mr Ruddock" at this point, but I have oops :twisted:)

The forums are there to ask questions, if you dont want to help out, don't answer the post!

Spike

Re: rant

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:24 pm
by dave_r
It was confucious who said

"i hear, i forget.
I read, i remember.
I do, i understand"

Providing the page to read is surely more helpful than some of the comments posted.

Re: rant

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:33 pm
by philqw78
dave_r wrote:.....................

............
Providing the page to read is surely more helpful than some of the comments posted.
dave_r should have wrote:is surely more helpful than some of the comments I posted

Re: rant

Posted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 6:47 pm
by petedalby
I think grandad is a Slitherine mole to increase the traffic on the forum - and what a fine job he is doing.

Re: rant

Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 8:08 am
by madaxeman
dave_r wrote:It was confucious who said
"i hear, i forget.
I read, i remember.
I do, i understand"
Providing the page to read is surely more helpful than some of the comments posted.
Indeed - some of us believe in the principle that if you give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.

Or, give an answer on a forum and you save someone having to look it up themselves, but explain how using a combination of the index and coloured page edges for the sections in the rules have been designed to help players find things more quickly and you may save the internet from collapsing around our ears through over use ... :idea:

Some people even apparently appreciate this sort of approach as well: viewtopic.php?f=107&t=41301 :|

There is of course another angle to this, in that if Slitherine had actually designed the e-book version of FoG so it could have a search capability ............... :roll:

Re: rant

Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 11:10 am
by spike
madaxeman wrote: Some people even apparently appreciate this sort of approach as well: viewtopic.php?f=107&t=41301 :|

There is of course another angle to this, in that if Slitherine had actually designed the e-book version of FoG so it could have a search capability ............... :roll:
Tim,
Sorry that's no excuse, we had v.1 s poor index- Fixed ultimately as we all know by the excellect index in the help pages on the FoG site

In the beginners defence I was talking to another gamer, who is interested in ancients but found when he viewed the rules that they could be too complex to learn- He comes from a Warhammer background, where the rules are designed for 10 year olds to play.
The rulebook for FoG is daunting given it's detail and text density- even if there actually only about 50 pages of rules to read (once you remove the formatting)

As for the e-book, thats is one of the reasons why I voted for and bought a real book! (my other reasons were I also refused to pay the Apple TAX, and there are the power issues of limited battery life with tablets. It would have been better if it were to have been done on an e-reader)

Re: rant

Posted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 11:16 am
by spike
Phil
If youre winding up Ruddock do it properly :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
dave_r should have wrote:is surely more helpful than almost all of the comments I posted

Re: rant

Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:22 pm
by vexillia
grandad wrote:i know ive asked questions that are in the book but i thought the whole idea of this site to ask questions about the rules you don't understand
Saw this posted by user "grandad" on TMP:
got a copy of field of glory ancients not in great condition bit of damage in one corner and a copy of the field of glory renaissance for sell ancient – £10 GBP and £15 GBP for the renaissance book + p&p any one? for both UK only
Same user, coincidence, or cause and effect? Discuss.

Re: rant

Posted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:52 pm
by grahambriggs
vexillia wrote:
grandad wrote:i know ive asked questions that are in the book but i thought the whole idea of this site to ask questions about the rules you don't understand
Saw this posted by user "grandad" on TMP:
got a copy of field of glory ancients not in great condition bit of damage in one corner and a copy of the field of glory renaissance for sell ancient – £10 GBP and £15 GBP for the renaissance book + p&p any one? for both UK only
Same user, coincidence, or cause and effect? Discuss.
I think so - both from near Andover in Hampshire. I think the problem was he didn't have a group of players sufficiently near to be workable for him. And I do think this is a difficult rule set to pick up without more experienced players to talk you through it - as indeed most rule sets of any complexity are. A shame, as we need all the new players we can get.

Unfortunately the initial entry barriers to this hobby (cost, complexity, time for games, painting needed) are high and the learning curve can be steep.