PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

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Retributarr
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Re: PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

Post by Retributarr » Fri Feb 21, 2020 11:30 pm

Sharkyzero wrote:
Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:46 pm
Kerensky wrote:
Thu Feb 06, 2020 11:24 pm
Just for fun and hypothetically speaking....
The fictional campaigns based on things like your referenced Afrika Korps campaign, an American Invasion campaign, etc. were things I was wanting and sorely missed in PzC 1.

Additionally, the utter failure of my historic campaigns despite succeeding in the missions really chapped my ass, too. I was thinking that because I was DEEP into Moscow that I'd be able to conquer Russia and see what happened next...but nope. We had to turn 'er back around for whatever reason and continue this retreat despite my dudes being all xp'ed out, buffed up with replacements, and so on.
"Sharkyzero:"...I feel your 'Pain' regarding...being "Successful" in missions such as 'MOSCAU', yet in the end...forced to not be..."able to conquer Russia and see what happened next!".

Alas!!!...the instigator of this vexing issue...is that we have a...'Historical-Game', where the boundaries are 'Fixed-Tight', where there is no free reign on Gaming-Latitude...to venture forth into the 'Unknown'.

In order to alleviate your frustrations...a reconfiguration/redo of this Game would be necessary to accommodate alternate history paths!. I just don't see that taking place, as already...this Game is complicated enough to develop. However, someday...with changing technologies...this Gaming Concept might yet be realized.

George_Parr
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Re: PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

Post by George_Parr » Sun Feb 23, 2020 4:53 pm

Retributarr wrote:
Fri Feb 21, 2020 11:30 pm
"Sharkyzero:"...I feel your 'Pain' regarding...being "Successful" in missions such as 'MOSCAU', yet in the end...forced to not be..."able to conquer Russia and see what happened next!".

Alas!!!...the instigator of this vexing issue...is that we have a...'Historical-Game', where the boundaries are 'Fixed-Tight', where there is no free reign on Gaming-Latitude...to venture forth into the 'Unknown'.

In order to alleviate your frustrations...a reconfiguration/redo of this Game would be necessary to accommodate alternate history paths!. I just don't see that taking place, as already...this Game is complicated enough to develop. However, someday...with changing technologies...this Gaming Concept might yet be realized.
I don't see why any reconfiguration would be necessary. The original campaign in PC already allowed this stuff. You could do sea lion, you could beat the Soviet Union, you could invade the USA afterwards. All that stuff was already in there.
It was not part of the Grand Campaign, apart from sea lion at the very end, but then again, that wasn't the focus of those campaigns. The main game however did include alternate paths.

What you obviously don't have at any point, is an open simulation of the war in which things can go in a completely different direction, like a stalemate or back-and-forth for quite some time. That is not something that couldn't be portrayed in the game though, it probably could do that just fine. It's just that you would need to add countless fictional scenarios to be prepared for every possible outcome. What you will also not be able to represent is how the entire war shapes up. You are only fighting individual battles, you don't control all frontlines like in a big map of Europe. That's also why your successes in the grand campaign not really leading anywhere isn't all that much of a problem. You might take Moscow, but you don't see what is going on at your flanks. Granted, you probably could have added another layer by linking an attack on Moscow to a follow-up scenario in which you would need to do a fighting-withdrawal to reach your lines again. But that adds another scenario for what is ultimately just a fun bonus for those who did really well.

Bradley62
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Re: PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

Post by Bradley62 » Sun Feb 23, 2020 5:29 pm

Having played OOB Pacific for years, huge YES for PZc 2 title or DLC!

Retributarr
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Re: PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

Post by Retributarr » Sun Feb 23, 2020 8:43 pm

Bradley62 wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 5:29 pm
Having played OOB Pacific for years, huge YES for PZc 2 title or DLC!
I was never a "Naval Battles Player"...yet!...I'm stll very much in favor for it...as obviously this is particularly a NAVAL Game. I personally am leaning toward mostly 'Land Based Efforts' such as in 'China'-Vietnam- and all the way to 'India' and so forth. For the Pacific Naval Arena... yes!...lets definetily include 'Rigorous-Naval-Confrontations'...but at the same time... to be as well equal in effort to Land Based Island Battles. Both situations could work together...'Hand In Hand'... to complement each other.

We could go 'Rigidly-Historical'... on 'NAVAL' situations such as in 'The Battle Of MIDWAY Island'...however what I wouldn't like about that setup...is that which-ever side you choose to represent... you pretty-much will know where your opposition is going to be!. Perhaps at the point of the Scenario-Start...the player can then be given the option to either go... 'Full-Historical'...or have the Start-Up-Positions randomized enough so... such that there is no longer any certainty as to Who is exactly Where...and when approximately they will or will not do certain actions.

Retributarr
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Re: PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

Post by Retributarr » Sun Feb 23, 2020 9:06 pm

Pacific Region After-Thought!:

Maybe it could be a compelling consideration to break-up this 'Pacific-Game' into 2 separate sections. The first selection choice would be for the "Naval-Battles and Pacific Islands Campaign". The Second selection...would be for the "Korea' to 'India' Campaign".

"Wot" Think You All???.

Bradley62
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Re: PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

Post by Bradley62 » Sun Feb 23, 2020 11:47 pm

Retributarr wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 8:43 pm
Bradley62 wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 5:29 pm
Having played OOB Pacific for years, huge YES for PZc 2 title or DLC!
I was never a "Naval Battles Player"...yet!...I'm stll very much in favor for it...as obviously this is particularly a NAVAL Game. I personally am leaning toward mostly 'Land Based Efforts' such as in 'China'-Vietnam- and all the way to 'India' and so forth. For the Pacific Naval Arena... yes!...lets definetily include 'Rigorous-Naval-Confrontations'...but at the same time... to be as well equal in effort to Land Based Island Battles. Both situations could work together...'Hand In Hand'... to complement each other.
Island inf combat is my prime interest also. Naval warfare just adds more immersion.

Retributarr
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Re: PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

Post by Retributarr » Mon Feb 24, 2020 12:16 am

Bradley62 wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 11:47 pm
Retributarr wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 8:43 pm
Bradley62 wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 5:29 pm
Having played OOB Pacific for years, huge YES for PZc 2 title or DLC!
I was never a "Naval Battles Player"...yet!...I'm stll very much in favor for it...as obviously this is particularly a NAVAL Game. I personally am leaning toward mostly 'Land Based Efforts' such as in 'China'-Vietnam- and all the way to 'India' and so forth. For the Pacific Naval Arena... yes!...lets definetily include 'Rigorous-Naval-Confrontations'...but at the same time... to be as well equal in effort to Land Based Island Battles. Both situations could work together...'Hand in Hand'... to complement each other.
Island inf combat is my prime interest also. Naval warfare just adds more immersion.
Thank's so much for the 'Positive-Reply'..."Bradley62." I am of 'Exactacally' the same mind as you!. Yes!!!...the "Island-Battles" are the 'Meat' of the Game...Fierce hand to hand Combat for every foot of the island... and the 'Sea-Battles' are the 'Potatoes' of the Game...which entails a Cat and Mouse Effort to Out-Think and Out-Position the Opponent for the purpose of annihilation!.

Retributarr
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Re: PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

Post by Retributarr » Mon Feb 24, 2020 4:23 am

PACIFIC GENERAL:

That title... "PACIFIC GENERAL" ... may very well finallt be the name given for this game effort. At the same time... I would like to put forward an alternate name description for this game possibility.

As in reality... there was no real actual 'Pacific General' historically, it came to mind to me-self...that perhaps a more correct or proper name description could be devised or introduced as an alternative?.

I am really hard pressed to come up with a name or title that is not 'too lack-luster' or 'too uninteresting', but... I will bravely press on and try to do the best that I can. I would really appreciate anyone's assistance in this matter if your interested or care to help at all!.

Game Name Possibilities:

These given titles are only initial naming attempts, I hope that minds more fertile than mine can put the Icing and cherry on the cake, in other words... put on the final finishing details.
```Japans conquest of the Pacific Rim _ WWII
``` WWII _ Japans New World Order
```Imperial Japan _ WWII_Pacific Rim Conquests

Kerensky
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Re: PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

Post by Kerensky » Mon Feb 24, 2020 4:37 am

What's wrong with Pacific General? Looks right to me.

Image

Perhaps it should be Pacific Admiral... :lol:

Retributarr
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Re: PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

Post by Retributarr » Tue Feb 25, 2020 8:49 am

George_Parr wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 4:53 pm
Retributarr wrote:
Fri Feb 21, 2020 11:30 pm
"Sharkyzero:"...I feel your 'Pain' regarding...being "Successful" in missions such as 'MOSCAU', yet in the end...forced to not be..."able to conquer Russia and see what happened next!".

Retributarr post
Alas!!!...the instigator of this vexing issue...is that we have a...'Historical-Game', where the boundaries are 'Fixed-Tight', where there is no free reign on Gaming-Latitude...to venture forth into the 'Unknown'.
George_Parr post_
What you obviously don't have at any point, is an open simulation of the war in which things can go in a completely different direction, like a stalemate or back-and-forth for quite some time. That is not something that couldn't be portrayed in the game though, it probably could do that just fine. It's just that you would need to add countless fictional scenarios to be prepared for every possible outcome. What you will also not be able to represent is how the entire war shapes up. You are only fighting individual battles, you don't control all frontlines like in a big map of Europe.
George_Parr for some reason somehow I missed seeing your post before ... I'm sorry about that!...I don't know how I managed that?. Anyway...I'm glad that you posted your comment!. Specifically...your comment on...interests me!.

"you would need to add countless fictional scenarios to be prepared for every possible outcome"...

That would indeed make the feasibility of devising such a game into a 'horrendous task'... 'Grotesque-Skus-Maximus'... or a near impossible task!.

So what I would propose is that only say... for instance... that only a half a dozen major possible outcomes with only a very limited number of side or alternate optional directions would be permitted... giving the player various Goodies for the various directions that he goes... or even options to change his pathway all together in the Game to another pathway. I'm trying to make sense of a complexity that I hardly understand myself!... am I making any sense???.

Somehow by these means... we are then trying to limit the complexity or scope of the Gaming pathways. Meaning that... only these specific paths would be all the outcomes that could ever be in this Game. Still too many I think?... but anyhow something along these lines. I didn't have days to try to figure this out... the above natterings... are all in ten to fifteen minutes of on the spot thought!.

After Thought:
What could help in this "mind-bending-conundrum"... is that the direction of the War in other Theatres...will in large part .... be determined by how or what your personal effort manages to accomplish... or not accomplish!.

Retributarr
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Re: PACIFIC GENERAL for PZc 2

Post by Retributarr » Wed Feb 26, 2020 4:13 am

Artificial Intelligence!: _ {The COLOSSUS or The HAL 9000 Computer}

Just mere moments ago... a 'Flash' of inspiration hit me like a 'Tonne of Bricks'. What would that be???... well its to do with 'Artificial Intelligence'.

Perhaps the "Developer Master-Minds" can someday come up with an Artificial Intelligence Program that could manage the task of 'Directing the flow (Cause and Effect... Action and Re-Action) of events during the War!'. By using Real WWII historical political situations as a foundation or basis for "AI" game execution... *(Historical Political: How nations viewed each other as well as their ambitions) as well as actual cause and effect realities that took place during the war... could then form or become the corner-stone 'of/for' the 'reasoning/logic' that the "AI" would then use!.

Translation:
Simply put... this could then mean that the development complexity of the Game could be drastically reduced. You wouldn't need 100,000 lines of programming to make this work!. Each and every Game would be different!. Mind you, some tinkering would likely be required to nudge this 'Beast' into the right direction.

I would like to hear from others who may have some ideas on this topic.

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