Vae Victis II - First Punic War: Concluded

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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by kronenblatt »

batesmotel wrote: Tue Mar 23, 2021 9:13 pm Questions:

"An army having:
lost a battle is removed from its hex and placed (at its player's choice) in a controlled structure along its faction's logistics lines at least 2 hexes away, or in any of its capitals (if controlled). If none of that is possible, the army is irrevocably eliminated.
Notwithstanding the above, an assaulting army that loses only its assault engagement is not removed.
drawn a battle moves 2 hexes away from the armies it fought, in the direction of one of its faction's capitals (whether controlled or not), always without moving within the ZoC of any army from another faction.
Notwithstanding the above, a sieging army that draws in any of its engagements does not retreat."

1) In the case of losing a battle, if the losing army cannot retreat 2 hexes away, I assume that re-appearing in its faction's capital is not affected by enemy zones of control between the hex of the battle and the capital. (I assume this doesn't apply if the capital is under siege unless on a coast and not blockaded?)

2) In the case of a drawn battle, what happens to an army that cannot retreat 2 hexes per above? Does it also have the option of reappearing in the faction's capital?

3) Is there a stacking limit on the map, e.g. can more than one army occupy a hex?

4) Does a road (or river) extending from my army to a friendly city/town constitute a logistic line or does the logistic line end at the nearest town and isn't extended beyond there despite army being on a road (or river) connected to the town?

5) How can a faction have more than one capital (as in "any of its capitals")?

6) I assume "army" includes navies as well for initiative points? If a navy is in a sea zone where it's faction has 0 movement points available, I assume it cannot move or debark. Does is suffer any negative consequences for being forces to remain at sea in the same spot?

Chris
1a. Actually the losing army doesn't retreat two hexes. Instead it's removed from the map and again re-appearing on the map. But you're correct in your assumption that re-appearing (whether to the capital or another structure) is not affected by enemy zones of control between the hex of the battle and the structure in which it's reappearing.
1b. Good question about the capital being under siege. Will probably need to amend that to your suggestion, i.e., not sieged, unless on a coast and not blockaded. Thanks. EDIT: amended rules to this.
2. No, it will simply retreat one hex or stay put.
3. Stacking limit of maximum one army per hex.
4. Lines of logistics do not extend from armies, only from structures (Towns and Cities).
5. A heritage from original Vae Victis rules (in which Gauls had two capitals). In Vae Victis II, each faction only has one capital.
6a. If you're thinking about whether a navy also has 1 Initiative point, the answer is yes. (But it makes no sense to allocate it to the +40 FP bonus, since navies don't fight and it will debark after all battles have been concluded, so it should be allocated to a sea zone).
6b. You're correct to assume that if there are zero naval movement points left, it can neither move nor debark.
6c. The "only" negative consequence is that if it ends its movement in a Sea hex (and not a Coast hex), it will be irrevocably eliminated, not to re-appear again, whether as navy or army.

Did this answer your questions, Chris?
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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by batesmotel »

Thanks, Andreas. I think your answer covers everything.

Chris
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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by batesmotel »

Andreas,

Shouldn't Enna, where my army 4 started, be shown as a Carthaginian controlled structure on the map? Currently apears to be show as uncontrollled.

Chris
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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by kronenblatt »

batesmotel wrote: Wed Mar 24, 2021 11:51 am Andreas,

Shouldn't Enna, where my army 4 started, be shown as a Carthaginian controlled structure on the map? Currently apears to be show as uncontrollled.

Chris
Could be a cut-paste at my end (unfortunately not copy-paste) when granting Carthaginian control over Catania. Will check. Thanks for heads-up.
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Round 2: Order giving - Initiative points

Post by kronenblatt »

Initiative points were allocated to sea zones as follows:
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Round 2: Order giving - Initiative points

Post by kronenblatt »

Initiative points were allocated 100% to sea zones with naval movement points (NMP), as follows:

Image
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Round 2: movement instructions

Post by kronenblatt »

Time has come for round 2's movement instructions, for land as well as naval movement (excluding navies' debarkation of armies into land hexes, but please save enough naval movement points for that in case you want to debark this round).

Please send me your instructions through replying to the PM you received from me, and just as a simple sequence of individual moves (e.g., 2 4 2 6 0 6), with no other symbols in between, only blanks (for easy copy-pasting by the administrator). For details, please check Giving orders, Movement, and Naval movement in the RULES.

Please all do so by Sunday, March 28, midnight (your time) at the latest.

As mentioned earlier, I will not open any of your PMs (other than my Roman team members') until I have received such PMs from everyone and until I have published those of myself and all my team members in a PM to all participants or in this thread.

Any questions? Please ask them here, in the campaign thread, for everyone else to see the question itself and its answer.

Still don't worry: we'll all hold each other's hands to get to know and understand the rules, etc., together. This is for fun, after all! :)

Enjoy!
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Round 2: Movement instructions and execution

Post by kronenblatt »

Image

Some comments:
  • Carthaginian navy #1 and Roman navy #15 have each consumed 13 NMP and will thus bounce in the hex in between them. Both navies will now retreat two hexes in the direction away from each other.
  • Carthaginian army #7 had another 2 among its movement instructions, but the first two hexes cost 6 MP each, why it couldn't be executed.
  • Roman army #11 can not start sieging Alalia since Alalia is within the ZoC of Carthaginian army #3.
Please let me know whether this seems ok, given your movement instructions and intentions as well as your understanding of the rules (not any worse than mine :) ).

Image
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Round 2: retreats?

Post by kronenblatt »

  • Carthaginian navy #1 and Roman navy #15 will each retreat two hexes in the direction away from each other.
    • deeter and kronenblatt: Please provide directions. (deeter: 10 10, kronenblatt: 2 4)
  • Carthaginian army #6 and Roman army #9 are within each other's ZoCs.
    • TomoeGozen and Aetius39: please advise whether you retreat two hexes, and if yes, please provide directions.
    • If none of the two armies retreats, an engagement between the two will be fought!
  • Carthaginian army #4 and Roman army #13 are within each other's ZoCs.
    • batesmotel and TheGrayMouser: please advise whether you retreat two hexes, and if yes, please provide directions.
    • If none of the two armies retreats, an engagement between the two will be fought!

Answer ASAP through replying to my PM please.
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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by batesmotel »

Hi Andreas,

Syracuse is a city with 2 hex ZOC out to sea, correct? It looks to me like Roman navy 10 moved through the ZoC of Syracuse to get where it is. Shouldn't it have had to stop when entering Syracuse's ZoC?

Thanks,
Chris
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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by kronenblatt »

batesmotel wrote: Tue Mar 30, 2021 12:03 am Hi Andreas,

Syracuse is a city with 2 hex ZOC out to sea, correct? It looks to me like Roman navy 10 moved through the ZoC of Syracuse to get where it is. Shouldn't it have had to stop when entering Syracuse's ZoC?

Thanks,
Chris
Its movement instructions were 4 6 4 4, bringing it out to the Sea hexes and moving outside of and around Syracusae's ZoC.
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Round 2: engagements!

Post by kronenblatt »

None of the armies retreat, why we have two engagements (the first in Vae Victis II) to be concluded this round!
  • Battle/engagement 1. TomoeGozen (Carthaginian army #6, 1600 FP) versus Aetius39 (Roman army #9, 1600 FP). Mediterranean Hilly. Aetius39 sets up.
  • Battle/engagement 2. batesmotel (Carthaginian army #4, 1630 FP) versus TheGrayMouser (Roman army #13, 1600 FP). Mediterranean Agricultural. batesmotel sets up.

The engagements to be set up as follows:
  • TT Mod module.
  • Open Battle scenario.
  • Large (40 x 32) map size.
  • Allies can be selected if allowed in accordance with Allies in engagements below.
  • No map re-rolls.
  • The player having spent the fewest MP that round normally sets up the engagement in-game, PM:ing opponent.
  • Engagement is to be concluded within a three-week period.
  • The winner, or the player having incurred the fewest casualties, report the results in this thread.
Allies in engagements
  • Only armies that begin the round not more than 6 MP distance of their factions' lines of logistics are allowed to use allies in their engagements.
  • For armies that fulfil the requirement above, allies are allowed in the following situations:
    • The faction that controls the City of Syracusae at the beginning of the round is allowed to select Greek (Western) 280 - 49 BC as allies, provided that Syracusae no longer controls any Towns or Cities.
    • Carthago is allowed to select Numidian or Moorish 341-56 BC as allies.
  • Using allies is optional for each individual engagement and not at all compulsory, and the players decide for each engagement whether to use allies or not.
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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by batesmotel »

Challenge posted for TheGrayMouser, password vvtgm.

Chris
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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by TheGrayMouser »

batesmotel wrote: Wed Mar 31, 2021 12:11 pm Challenge posted for TheGrayMouser, password vvtgm.

Chris
Will pick it up tonite!!

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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by Aetius39 »

Challenge posted for TomoeGozen.

pw is punic

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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by TomoeGozen »

Challenge accepted. :-)
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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by TomoeGozen »

The battle for Tyndaris has reached its (very!) bloody conclusion.
The Carthaginians under the command of TomoeGozen were victorious although it was very hard to tell ...
The Carthaginians beat the Romans 61 - 55 (and the Carthaginians had 3 units fragged and about to lose combats when the Romans were tipped over 60%!)
Thanks to Aetius39 for a great ,close game.
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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by deeter »

Congratulations on repelling the repellant Romans, TomoeGozen.

Deeter
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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by kronenblatt »

batesmotel wrote: Wed Mar 31, 2021 12:11 pm Challenge posted for TheGrayMouser, password vvtgm.
Chris
TheGrayMouser wrote: Wed Mar 31, 2021 2:01 pm Will pick it up tonite!!
IlleFaelesGriseo
How's this battle progressing?
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Re: Vae Victis II: First Punic War

Post by batesmotel »

I think it will finish with the turn I just sent toTGM. Score at that point was 65-38 in the Carthaginian's favor.

Chris.
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