Updated version coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

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stockwellpete
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Updated version coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

Post by stockwellpete » Thu Sep 02, 2021 4:33 pm

First screenshot of this Northern Crusade battlefield . . .

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Last edited by stockwellpete on Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:20 am, edited 2 times in total.

rbodleyscott
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Re: Coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

Post by rbodleyscott » Sat Sep 04, 2021 5:50 am

Shouldn’t you be using Sword Brethren sideID, banner and knights?
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stockwellpete
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Re: Coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

Post by stockwellpete » Sat Sep 04, 2021 7:28 am

rbodleyscott wrote:
Sat Sep 04, 2021 5:50 am
Shouldn’t you be using Sword Brethren sideID, banner and knights?
Yes, OK. I think I started work on this scenario before we had the Sword Brethren option. :oops: I have changed the 2 Teutonic knights units and the Banners are also changed. The Holstein Crusaders models can stay as they are. :wink:

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Re: Coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

Post by stockwellpete » Sun Sep 05, 2021 1:45 pm

Thanks to Paul59 for providing the scripts for this scenario. :D

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Re: Coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

Post by fogman » Sun Sep 05, 2021 4:32 pm

https://lithuaniatribune.com/the-mythol ... -of-saule/

Looks like the Germans were surrounded in the swamp and trying to fight their way out.

Interesting battle circumstances, I may do a scenario for it for Lords of History when I get to the 13th century.

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Re: Coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

Post by stockwellpete » Sun Sep 05, 2021 6:23 pm

fogman wrote:
Sun Sep 05, 2021 4:32 pm
https://lithuaniatribune.com/the-mythol ... -of-saule/

Looks like the Germans were surrounded in the swamp and trying to fight their way out.

Interesting battle circumstances, I may do a scenario for it for Lords of History when I get to the 13th century.
Interesting, I didn't have that information when I designed the scenario. According to the article, the Pskov and Navahrudak contingents were much smaller than I have them, so maybe the "Baltic levies" should be bigger than a couple of units for the various ethnic groupings (Estonians, Latgallians, Curonians etc)? And the swamp could be more severe than I have it, with the Samogitians actually surrounding the Crusader army by the morning. Certainly more than enough here for a version 2, or "Saulen Alternative" scenario. :wink:

Wikipedia has this on the Livonian Rhymed Chronicle and it has been suggested by one academic that it could have been used for recruitment purposes rather than presenting a reliable historical account of the campaigns. That might explain its derisory attitude towards the Holstein Crusaders . . .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Livonian_Rhymed_Chronicle

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Update for Battle of Saule 1236 coming soon . . .

Post by stockwellpete » Tue Sep 14, 2021 11:07 am

This scenario is in the process of being updated to Version 2 to take into account the information provided by fogman. The Livonian Sword Brothers will start the scenario not knowing where the Samogitians are . . . except that they are very close! The group move facility will not work for some of their units. :wink:

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Re: Updated version coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

Post by stockwellpete » Tue Sep 14, 2021 3:39 pm

Here is a screenshot of the v2 set-up. Not too far off being ready really. Notice the 3x red "Escape" markers, to be used in conjunction with an optional rule i.e. the Livonian Sword Brothers win if they can get one of their 2 mounted knight units, with Volkwin in it, to a track square containing the "Escape" marker. Some did escape the encirclement in the real battle. Eventually those were mostly killed by Semigallians rather than Samogitians, which was obviously preferable in the circumstances. :P

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Re: Updated version coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

Post by stockwellpete » Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:47 am

Just a query here for Richard and Paul. These two screenshots are from the very start of a HotSeat playtest. In the top one it is the first turn of the Livonian Sword Brethren's army and they can see Samogitian cavalry coming through the marsh, but they cannot see Samogitian infantry in the marsh hexes (2 squares away where the cursor is). Is this working OK? Is it the fact that the cavalry are moving that makes them visible, whereas the nearer infantry are stationary?

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And in this different Hot Seat playtest, the Sword Brethren have sent a cavalry unit up the road to scout. They can see a Samogitian cavalry unit in the woods, but none of the Samogitian infantry units in the marsh. This is the very first turn of the game so the Samogitians have not moved.

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I am just wondering if the LOS area co-ordinates you gave me to allow the game to start with the Samogitians out of sight is causing this apparent anomaly?

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Re: Updated version coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

Post by Paul59 » Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:00 pm

I don't think there is anything wrong with these situations. Infantry are just better at hiding in woods/marshes than cavalry. I can't remember the exact rule, but I think cavalry have to be further into terrain to become invisible.
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Re: Updated version coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

Post by rbodleyscott » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:38 pm

Paul59 wrote:
Thu Sep 16, 2021 2:00 pm
I don't think there is anything wrong with these situations. Infantry are just better at hiding in woods/marshes than cavalry. I can't remember the exact rule, but I think cavalry have to be further into terrain to become invisible.
Correct. Cavalry in the outer square of woods and marshes can be seen.
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Re: Updated version coming soon: Battle of Saule 1236

Post by stockwellpete » Fri Sep 17, 2021 10:04 am

OK, thanks very much. I have moved that isolated cavalry unit so it cannot be seen on the Sword Brethren's first turn. :wink:

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