Abbreviation

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Archie
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Abbreviation

Post by Archie » Wed Oct 20, 2010 10:53 pm

Abbreviation

I was wondering if there was a list of combat abbreviations posted anywhere... as at times I struggle to understand what is what.

Don’t think it will improve my play that much, but it certainly may help my understanding as to why I lose so much!

Trust you will not all take this a silly request.

little
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Post by little » Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:53 pm

Aha,

I suffer this at work as well (as I am sure that most people do). The use of management speak , abbreviations or acronyms can quickly change from shorthand to insider talk to keep newcomers feeling daunted or unsure of what is happening. (for example, when did skirmishers become Psiloi?? eh WRG?). This goes doubly so when you are on the computer and can’t just ask someone casually.

Personally I think this is a great idea to list abbreviations (or acronyms) for the game somewhere in clear English to help those either : -

(a) new to ancients
(b) don’t play FOG on table top or have a copy of the rules
(c) new to wargaming (either on the computer or table top)

Overall, it is in all of our interests to make new players feel welcome and part of the community.

CheerfullyInsane
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Post by CheerfullyInsane » Wed Oct 20, 2010 11:56 pm

I don't think there's a complete list anywhere, but here's a few that I've stumbled across.

LF/MF/HF: Light, Medium and Heavy Foot respectively.
LH: Light Horse.
Kn: Knights
Lch/Hch/Sch: Light, Heavy and Scythed chariots respectively.
pacs: Pachyderms (elephants).
cats: Cataphracts (armored cavalry).
TT: Table-top, as in the table-top version of the game played with miniatures.

These are just off the top of my oddly shaped head. Feel free to ask about any specific ones you're wondering about.
And anyone else, chip in to nail the ones I've missed.

EDIT: And Psiloi didn't become skirmishers, they always were. :mrgreen:
If I'm not mistaken it's the term used in the DBA rules.

Lars
I've got two words for ya: Math is hard.

cothyso
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Post by cothyso » Thu Oct 21, 2010 8:58 am

BG - BattleGroup
CiC - Commander in Chief
DM - Double Moves
FW - Fog of War
maks - macedonians

batesmotel
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Old WRG classifications

Post by batesmotel » Thu Oct 21, 2010 5:46 pm

SHI, EHI, HI and MI - Old WRG close order Infantry with Super heavy, extra heavy, heavy or little or no armor. All equivalent to FoG HF with different armor classes. SHI and EHI correspond to heavily armoured, HI to armoured and MI to protected and unprotected.

LMI/LHI - MF equivalents

LI - LF

SHC, EHC, HC, MC - Old WRG equivalents of FoG cavalry but SHC are equivalent to Cataphracts. Armour levels equivalent as for SHI/EHI...

SHK, EHK and HK - Equivalent of FoG knights. HK same as armoured, SHK and EHK equivalent to heavily armoured.

Chris
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Triarii
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Post by Triarii » Thu Oct 21, 2010 7:01 pm

POA?
What are they what do they do?

Morbio
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Post by Morbio » Thu Oct 21, 2010 7:23 pm

Triarius wrote:POA?
What are they what do they do?
Points Of Advantage: In essence the show you where a unit will have an advantage in the die rolling. If your unit has more POA than the enemy then this will reduce the die roll you need to make to score a hit. e.g. With no POA then you may need a 5 or more on the die roll to score a hit (i.e. a 1 in 3 chance). However, if you have a POA (often shown as a +) then you may only need to roll a 4 or more (i.e. a 1 in 2 chance). A typical exampl POA for melee is being uphill... there are lots of things that can give you a POA, some are terrain related, some are weapon related and some are dependant on the opponent you are fighting. Generally a POA you gain is a POA the opponent loses.

deeter
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Post by deeter » Thu Oct 21, 2010 7:51 pm

I suspect Triarius is having a little fun here, but this is a good place to explain POAs to less accomplished players. You can also never gain or lose more than two net POA, so some match ups can be overkill. Next to cohesion the game is all about POAs.
Deeter

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Post by cothyso » Thu Oct 21, 2010 8:12 pm

if we're here, I have a small query: what's the E from the

A[None, POA=1, dierolls=4, E(hits)=2]

?!!

batesmotel
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Post by batesmotel » Thu Oct 21, 2010 8:18 pm

cothyso wrote:if we're here, I have a small query: what's the E from the

A[None, POA=1, dierolls=4, E(hits)=2]

?!!
Expected number of hits, e.g. in the example, 4 rolls with 50% chance to hit so 2 hits is the expected result. Look at the combat mechanism entry in the on line help to see how POAs affect your chance to hit. The chances to hit are different for combat versus missile fire.

Another subtlety of POAs is that in combat your POA plus the opposing BGs sum to 0. So if you are at ++, the opposing BG is at --. For missile fire, you just have a POA based on your weapon and the target type, e.g. bow versus unprotected MF or HF is a + POA.

Chris
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cothyso
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Post by cothyso » Thu Oct 21, 2010 8:24 pm

I thought something like that, but then again.., it doesn't fits with the %chances to win displayed in the charge hover shield.. shouldn't these Expected hits chances being directly reflected in those percents?

batesmotel
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Post by batesmotel » Thu Oct 21, 2010 8:43 pm

cothyso wrote:I thought something like that, but then again.., it doesn't fits with the %chances to win displayed in the charge hover shield.. shouldn't these Expected hits chances being directly reflected in those percents?
To win you need to inflict more hits than the opposing BG does and hence cause the loser to take a cohesion test. So the % chance to win is the probability that you will inflict more hits than the opposing BG. So it isn't just a function of the expected number of hits. If you have 2 rolls with 100% chance to hit with each and your opponent has 4 rolls with a 33% chance to hit, your expected number of hits is more than his but he can score more than your maximum of 2 so has a chance to win, essentially the chance that he would score 3 or 4 hits. (I'm too lazy to do the calculation for that but it's the sort of thing computers are good at.) Your chance to win is the chance that your opponent only scores 1 hit. 100% - his chance plus your chance to win would be the probability that you both score 2 hits. (Note that you never have a 100% chance to hit as far as I know, I just used it for this example to simplify the discussion.)

Chris
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deeter
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Post by deeter » Thu Oct 21, 2010 9:20 pm

Here's another one:

Dice roll: 6, 4, 1(r6), 4 Hits: 4

Or there abouts.

The little r indicates a re-roll for troop quality or being a leader, gaining another hit. Knowing this probably doesn't help you play better but it's fun to watch.

Deeter

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Post by Brigz » Thu Oct 21, 2010 11:21 pm

cothyso wrote:if we're here, I have a small query: what's the E from the

A[None, POA=1, dierolls=4, E(hits)=2]

?!!
Also, what does "None" in front of POA=1 refer to?

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Post by FranzVonG » Fri Oct 22, 2010 7:22 am

How do I see POA and all those info instead of the simple percentage on opponent's bg?

I'm new in FoG, and I've found the lack of a proper manual (the help is not bad but far from exhaustive, it seems) quite a problem to learn the ropes of the game.

cothyso
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Post by cothyso » Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:26 am

here's the online manual

for better understanding of what's going on, FoG rules' wise, you should visit thekeyboard shortcuts page and:
- switch Pre-combat detail display On (P key)
- switch Pre-combat information to Complex (X key)
- turn Summary display On (U key)
- switch Verbose information On (H key)

that's at least how most of us are keeping FoG settings, I guess..

Morbio
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Post by Morbio » Fri Oct 22, 2010 11:53 am

FranzVonG wrote:How do I see POA and all those info instead of the simple percentage on opponent's bg?

I'm new in FoG, and I've found the lack of a proper manual (the help is not bad but far from exhaustive, it seems) quite a problem to learn the ropes of the game.
When you have selected one of your units and hover your mouse over the enemy unit (at which point the sword and target show and you see percentages) then look at the bottom menu bar of your screen. It will show the expected number of attacks (e.g. 4) and the POAs (e.g. ++) and the reasons why (e.g. Uphill, Pikes). It also shows the same details for the enemy too.

cothyso
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Post by cothyso » Fri Oct 22, 2010 11:56 am

Morbio wrote:
FranzVonG wrote:How do I see POA and all those info instead of the simple percentage on opponent's bg?

I'm new in FoG, and I've found the lack of a proper manual (the help is not bad but far from exhaustive, it seems) quite a problem to learn the ropes of the game.
When you have selected one of your units and hover your mouse over the enemy unit (at which point the sword and target show and you see percentages) then look at the bottom menu bar of your screen. It will show the expected number of attacks (e.g. 4) and the POAs (e.g. ++) and the reasons why (e.g. Uphill, Pikes). It also shows the same details for the enemy too.
but only if you have the Pre-combat detail display set On (P key), otherwise it will display only the number of dices for attacker (sword) and defender (shield).

cothyso
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Post by cothyso » Fri Oct 22, 2010 3:12 pm

Also, as Brigz asked, what's with the none in front of the PoA info? I've just quickly checked into a saved game and it seems it's always a None in there..

CheerfullyInsane
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Post by CheerfullyInsane » Sat Oct 23, 2010 11:41 pm

cothyso wrote:Also, as Brigz asked, what's with the none in front of the PoA info? I've just quickly checked into a saved game and it seems it's always a None in there..
It signifies the presence of the HexHam Invisible Fighting Goats.
Unfortunately, since they're invisible, it'll always state "None", so overall it seems a little superfluous. :wink:

Lars
I've got two words for ya: Math is hard.

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