The Dustbin

[stockwellpete]

Ok, quite understandable. It isn't mentioned in the rules section though, maybe it should be mentioned there? Currently the only tiebreakers listed are number of wins and the result of the head-to-head match, there is no mentioning of number of matches being a tie-breaker.

No need really, as the final tables are the key ones. The tiebreakers only become effective when all the matches are completed.

[Swuul]

No need really, as the final tables are the key ones. The tiebreakers only become effective when all the matches are completed.

Of course. I hope Bluefin notes he is not safe though, and needs to grab a point from one of his remaining matches in case Mike Marchant goes and grabs 5 points from his last 4 matches It would suck for Bluefin if he thought he was safe already, and didn't put enough effort in his last matches.

[ianiow]

To be honest one of the things that I love about Pike & Shot are the melees being conducted between player turns in a random order. My dream would be that FOG2 and Pike & Shot would conduct all combat between player turns. When you launch an impact attack it doesn't resolve until all movement is finished and you end the turn. It would completely alleviate this current hot topic and make planning essential to success. I also like the idea you can't exploit openings on turns you impact which would encourage players to place a reserve to plug previous turn impact results and failed melees.

Intriguing. Both of these ideas would revolutionize play.

[CONSTANTINIX]

Division B

ConstantinIX - Arab Conquest 638-684 AD beat desertedfox – Viking, Ireland 900-1049 AD with Scots 851-1051 AD allies 45 %- 16 %

Arab army attacked massively on its right flank with speamen supported by bowmen (light and medium) repelling cavalry and gaining some flanking opportunity on the overwhelmed infantry. Soon, right flank was dismantled and a counter offensive by the viking on my left was too late to change the fate of the battle.
Thanks for the game.

[pantherboy]

Yeah it completely eliminates the concern of redoing turns and encourages the use of a tactical reserve. For me it also makes you feel like a commander who needs to make tough choices based on imperfect information. Do I delay one turn an assault to see if the current turn plays out as hoped or hold back in case something goes wrong. Currently I can conduct a rear charge before deciding whether to commit a LH in the hope of auto routing someone that was fragmented by forcing them to take a cohesion test which then may lead me to performing a further series of chained actions. If all results are determined between turns then the aforementioned scenario may become risky as there is no guarantee that the LH won't conduct their impact charge before the rear assaulting unit. The idea of being forced to delay attacks to guarantee shock troops go in first softening up the enemy appeals to me. But I also like the consequence of gambling and charging three units at an enemy in a single turn due to desperation or needing to pin someone down. It opens up a mountain of dilemmas for each match.

[stockwellpete]

As someone who voted large, I'd say medium would still be better for the default. As much as I feel that large battles aren't much more burdensome than medium, it seems a lot of people do, and I agree with the sentiment that most people who prefer large will be more okay with playing medium than people who prefer medium would like to play large battles.

I (personally) think the best idea is to leave the default at medium for now. See how many players choose each size and how many medium vs large matches we end up with. Perhaps if we want to keep some variation once/if this gets rolled out across the entire league, some divisions could default to medium and some to large, similar to the different sizes we have now.

One thing I could do from Season 10 (February 2021) onwards is have the main league sections with the default set at 1200pts (we may also have Later Medieval by then as well) and switch the Themed Event to default 1600pts to try and encourage a few more to join it. I could even offer a 1600pt/2000pt choice as the schedule for the Themed Event is much looser now with the quarter-finals taken out and only 12 players per pool. Players now have to complete just 4 group stage matches in the first 5 weeks of the tournament and possibly 4 KO matches in the second 5 weeks of the season, so there is plenty of time for a slightly longer game in that section.

[stockwellpete]

In major league baseball players are expunged from the hall of fame for such behavior; maybe we add an astrick to the record books.

He will be removed from the records and medal tables, apart from his overall playing record which will have a note attached to it. The old league tables from previous seasons will be left as they are as I think it is fairly pointless altering them now.

[sarmation]

Division C

sarmation (phokian) won against rs2excelsior (carthaginians) 70-49

a very hard battle against a strong mate

[sarmation]

division c
sarmation phokian challenge MikeMarchant greek asiatic
pm sent

[rs2excelsior]

One thing I could do from Season 10 (February 2021) onwards is have the main league sections with the default set at 1200pts (we may also have Later Medieval by then as well) and switch the Themed Event to default 1600pts to try and encourage a few more to join it. I could even offer a 1600pt/2000pt choice as the schedule for the Themed Event is much looser now with the quarter-finals taken out and only 12 players per pool. Players now have to complete just 4 group stage matches in the first 5 weeks of the tournament and possibly 4 KO matches in the second 5 weeks of the season, so there is plenty of time for a slightly longer game in that section.

For me, the reason I didn't come back to the themed event this time around (besides wanting to try out the EMA section) was that everyone's in one pool. Got beat hard by two Div A players right out of the gate last time, decided to stick with the main sections until I get a bit better, haha. (although I think I did manage a point out of one or two of the matches)

[DanZanzibar]

Congrats ConstantinIX! I was just thinking to myself how much I would love to hear a tip or two from you on using that Byzantine list... so I started a thread in the main FOG2 forum where I'm hoping divisional winners will take a minute to write a quick tip or two (or ten if you feel like it) on the army they just won with. As a winner of a much lower division I will throw something in a well... but we are all probably much more interested to hear what you might say!

No pressure whatsoever to do this but I thought I might ask!

[MikeMarchant]

In my experience, far more people threaten to quit than do actually quit.


Best Wishes

Mike

[ianiow]

Division A

ianiow (Kushite) defeated Xlegione (Babylonian) 65 vs 54

Two bloodied punch-drunk armies inching their way towards 60 points. Luckily the boys from Kush got over the line first.
Special commendation to a unit of Babylonian Guard Infantry hunted down by a pack of Kushite archer units, withstood 305 casualties from their 499 strong unit before being destroyed on the very last turn of the battle!

(3-1)

[Nosy_Rat]

Well done, nice to see Byzantines getting some love.

[Macedonczyk]

For me it also makes you feel like a commander who needs to make tough choices based on imperfect information.

First I played P&S. Then I started to play FOG2 but played like a P&S (I didn't solve mele by hand). And in the first multiplayer game I looked at the replay and something was wrong. How the opponent's units can move after the mele phase. When I discovered how to do it I liked that I have more control but I thought that now I'm more of a god and not a commander (who really had even less control than in P&S).

And I'd like to play a game similar to Combat Mission only for antiquity. Does anyone know such a game (a separate phase of planning moves without executing them and a separate phase played by the computer when it simultaneously executes the orders of both opponents)?

EDIT:
After rethinking again what Pantherboy wrote, I think it would be worth to introduce at least a mod that blocks the manual mele into FOG2 (mele would be played only by the computer after pressing end turn). Impact would stay as it is now. There would be less excitement but more real command (and much less possibilities to cheat).

[devoncop]

I, for one, would definitely not play in divisions with 1600 pt defaults.

Whereas I intend to take the opposite approach. I have already decided to only enter the 1600 pts default Divisions next season having seen how this season has gone despite them not being my preferred eras.

Horses for courses I guess.

[devoncop]

To be honest I think someone who prefers playing large battles is more likely to acquiesce with being required to play mid size rather than vice versa. Setting large as the default would probably cause some player attrition while medium would not. Also for players that perceive the size of the battle as taking noticeably more additional time that fact may limit their involvement in how many Divisions they sign up for.

+1

i understand that the vote is influencing the consideration. Those that like larger battles have played at the 1200 point level. no one has said they didn't play because of the medium size, but many have warned they dont want to play larger.

Edit: note, I voted for large.

Not true.

That is exactly my position going forward.

[ianiow]

I played ConstantinIX in the Slitherine automated tournament a while ago and knew then he was destined for Greatness! Well done Sir.

[Captainwaltersavage]

Thanks for dealing with this. Its no fun to discover someone has cheated to beat you. I hope there is a quick solution to this. Simply the fact that these incidences of save scumming are recorded on the system should make any other candidates think twice before trying it. There is a clear skill to this game and I would hate to see peoples abilities doubted on the basis that some other people have been foolish. I like the RNG factor as it much more closely conveys the risk of battle when you are never quite sure what is going to happen. Also when I lose I can always blame my bad luck rather than my inevitable ineptitude.

Please point me in the direction of anyone I should speak with if another voice would help. I have been thoroughly impressed by the almost universal goodwill within this community and the generous guidance I have received from numerous veterans of the game.

[blobka]

225 times -I nearly choked on my cocoa! I'd prefer rather 'a shot in the head' than watching all the replays, about that amount of times, that is due, thanks, -I haven't gotten that 'vice', in that big of a scale at least for sure, but some people are like that, some more -some less, sadly, not even funny(slightly ), try not to judge -much, this is over the top, over the roof, 'weeooo-weeooo' -gamble stuff, not just simple cheating, apparently! The game is worthy to lose one's head over, no doubts, like a fine lady or a fine wine! I hope they will find so needed rest from -now! I blame, of course, the netcode design flaw that allows such in the first place.

Good work from the investigation team. From now on -all will be aware of being watched. Are we going into the era of mutual suspicion and false accusations after this? Let's hope -no!

regards dog