Free France Campaign

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ColonelY
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

bru888 wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 3:50 pm [...] Good. For continuity, no structural changes to the map, though, other than climate, and the forts and VPs changing hands. And if that "modestly sized scenario" is about Belfort, Mulhouse, or Colmar, kindly forget it. I have no desire to deal with that, as I stated some time ago.
I looked for (and found) a way to use the map already available for Operation Nordwind on the Strasbourg side. :D

For the rest, I reassure you, it's not Belfort, Mulhouse or Colmar. :lol: :wink:

It will really be something somehow "new", BUT related to Operation Nordwind. I will be able to tell you more (relatively) soon.

By the way, there will also be a lot of historical information to complete the whole thing... you'll get some reading. 8) But I think (and hope) you'll enjoy it and find it useful. :D
bru888
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by bru888 »

ColonelY wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 4:06 pm ... you'll get some reading. 8) But I think (and hope) you'll enjoy it and find it useful. :D
First part: Yes, always.
Second part: Usually, but not always. :wink:

Fire away, sir. Meanwhile, I believe Strasbourg will be ready either later today (U.S. EST) or tomorrow.
- Bru
ColonelY
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

So, I studied the battle of Operation Nordwind, as a whole, trying to see how the map we have now (the Strasbourg scenario) could be used.

By mid-January, the Allies had retreated towards Strasbourg... not quite enough to appear on the map, but still. So it would be quite plausible that they simply retreated a bit more, which would be very convenient for us. This gives an idea of the date, but also an overview... :wink:

:arrow: However, I had a question in mind: it won't be the famous 2nd armored division of Leclerc that will take care of the defense of Strasbourg or its surroundings during Operation Nordwind. But then, WHERE was this division? :?: Would it have done something interesting on its side?

It wasn't easy, but I found out and the answer is: yes, indeed! :D
ColonelY
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

8) In Moselle, in the Northern Vosges... at the beginning of Operation Nordwind, an SS division managed to break through the Allied lines. Until it met Leclerc's men. Then an attempt to encircle and eliminate these elite fighters. It is a question of pushing them back quickly, before the Germans can push their advantage and exploit their opportunity to the full!

:arrow: And that's why it's new: a critical situation in a relatively small sector of the front (there are only 2 villages!), the enemy has made a breakthrough, we must catch up! :D

Here’s a map where one can see the northern action, as well as both Saverne and Strasbourg: https://www.google.ch/imgres?imgurl=htt ... gJegQIARBK

Translated quote from here: https://www.fenschmilitaria.com/2021/04 ... -mai-1945/
In 1945, Nordwind was the last German offensive on French territory. In East Moselle, the military operations ran out of steam after a few days, but for many inexperienced American soldiers, who had recently landed in Europe, it was a terrible baptism of fire.
Elements of General Leclerc's 2nd Armored Division, engaged at their side, were to be confronted with a very determined adversary. At the end of the engagements, the inhabitants of the villages affected by the fighting saw a desolate sight: houses blown up by explosions, livestock decimated...


We could have a little scenario. The enemy? :| Some SS fanatics… The action lasted from January 3rd to 5th...

(From the French website of one village : Gros-Réderching… https://www.gros-rederching.fr/histoire.html )
On December 31, 1944, around 11:30 p.m., the grenadiers of the 17th S.S. regiment "Goetz von Berlichingen" attacked the American positions established on the heights between Bliesbrück and Rimling. Without any artillery preparation in order to take advantage of the surprise effect, the Germans, doped up by the generously distributed alcohol, were to attack in a suicidal manner to break through the American lines. The battle raged all night and most of the day of 1945 on the heights of Obergailbach and around the farms of Morainville and Brandelfing; the men of the 37th Panzer Grenadier Regiment suffered terrible losses and the whole sector was strewn with dead. It was only when the American infantrymen retreated in the face of the relentless attacks that the American artillery began to fire deadly barrage.
In the village, once again in great haste, many inhabitants, not all of them, fled on January 1 and 2 in the direction of Achen and Etting; this departure took place in the worst conditions: animals harnessed to overloaded carts moved painfully through the snow and icy roads in the midst of the retreating troops.
On the morning of January 2, 1945, the Germans had reached the Sarreguemines-Bitche railroad near the Brandelfing farm. Despite tenacious resistance, the Americans were no longer able to resist a serious attack and withdrew to a defense line located further south.
In the meantime, the 2nd Battalion, attached to General Patch's 7th Army, left Alsace on the night of 31 December and arrived in the region on the morning of the same day in appalling weather conditions. The Langlade Battle Group took up positions in a sector stretching from Kalhausen to Oermingen and from Butten to Rahling. The Minjonnet sub-group was to take up position on the heights of Oermingen, while Massu's sub-group was to go to Rahling. While the deployment of the French troops ended in the evening, General Leclerc had arrived in Diemeringen to take command of the sector.
The American withdrawal on 2 January 1945 created gaps that were used by the men of Major Kaiser's 38th Panzer Grenadier Regiment. During the night of 2 to 3 January 1945, an assault group consisting of 3 battalions, a group of self-propelled guns and flame-throwing tanks broke through the American lines, seized Gros-Réderching and also reached Achen further south in the morning. Leclerc, informed, decided to react and from 9 o'clock in the morning, instructions were given to the s/groupement Minjonnet to counterattack at Achen. It was only in the middle of the day that Major Gribius took over the town with two platoons of tanks and American infantry from Wittring; violent street fighting took place mainly near the church crossroads and in the northern and north-eastern part of Achen. At nightfall, the cannonade weakened and taking advantage of the darkness, groups of Germans withdrew in the direction of Gros-Réderching.
While the fighting was raging in Achen, General Langlade gave the order to Lieutenant Colonel Massu to take back Gros-Réderching from the east. The sub-group left Rahling at around 2 p.m., and progressed through the Altkirch valley in the middle of a snowstorm. It did not arrive until 4 p.m., when the infantry and tanks entered the village from the south and the east after a fierce battle near the cemetery and on the southern edges. At the head of the 2nd platoon of the 12th R.C.A., Lieutenant Rives Henrys, who was in charge of the main action, was seriously wounded by a bullet in the back of the neck in the turret of the "Maurienne" tank. The cleaning of the village was undertaken by two sections of the 6th Company of the 2nd R.M.T. under Captain Langlois, who took prisoners but did not manage to take complete control of the place. In fact, Langlois was captured in the evening by an enemy group on his way to one of his support points.
Numerous pockets of resistance remained and were continually reinforced by elements retreating from Achen. For this reason, General Langlade insisted that the Americans of the 44th Infantry Division relieve the Massu sub-group as quickly as possible, as their infantry was not large enough to hold the village for long.
In fact, the general staff of the 17th Panzer Grenadier Division, knowing that its troops were blocked, had already planned to launch an attack on the evening of 3 January, with the aim of preventing the Americans from relieving the French on the one hand, and breaking the encirclement at Gros-Réderching and Achen on the other.
Around 1 a.m. on January 4, 1945, an SS combat group, following the route planned by the Americans, arrived at the northern entrance, taking advantage of the surprise effect and the darkness. Blinding the crews of the French tanks with flares, it opened fire and put out of action, one after the other, the "Languedoc, Iseran, Savoie 2 and Maurienne" tanks. The infantry of the 6th company, alerted by the fire, rushed out of the cellars and tried to react by firing in all directions; but machine-gunned at point-blank range by the Germans who had followed the enemy tank, it could hardly resist, besides, how could it be recognized in the dark night?
The rest of the battle was extremely confusing and the Germans, taking advantage of their advantage, quickly took control of Gros-Réderching and recovered their elements scattered in the village. At about 3 a.m., faced with a more than compromised situation, Massu ordered all his men to withdraw to Dehlingen at the same time as a deluge of iron and fire fell on the village to cover the French retreat. The German troops, having forced the encirclement, did not insist, and their successful coup de main quickly evacuated the village in the morning in the direction of their lines.
During the whole day of January 4, the village was empty of troops, each side remaining on its positions, and it was only the following day that a squadron of the 12th R.C.A. supported by the 253rd U.S. Infantry Regiment finally took back the village. This second liberation unfortunately required a new civilian victim: that of the young KREMER Marcel born on July 14, 1934 and killed on January 5, 1945 by a shrapnel.
Gros-Réderching was definitively liberated this time and although the front line was only a few kilometers away, the Americans settled there until mid-March 1945, date of the great offensive which led them to the heart of the German Reich.
The losses were heavy for all the belligerents and the report of Lieutenant Colonel Massu, passing through Gros-Réderching on January 6th, mentions 10 killed and 15 wounded on the French side. A commemorative plaque affixed to the wall of the parish church in their memory was inaugurated in November 1953 by Mme la Maréchale Leclerc.
Since these tragic events, the 2nd D.B. is part of the collective memory of our commune and is always welcomed with fervor by the population during patriotic events.
The fighters of the 26th and 44th U.S. Infantry Divisions paid a heavy price for the liberation of our region, let us not forget them during the celebrations of this sixtieth anniversary of the liberation battles
.”

Relatively a very small scenario, compared to what we’ve already seen: 2 villages, several battalions mostly… but some good action! :D

(Much more info here, easy to copy-paste in some translation tool, in this already presented link: https://www.fenschmilitaria.com/2021/04 ... -mai-1945/ )

There came the idea: ok, the 2nd Armored division did something as well. 8)
ColonelY
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

So, it could be a first little scenario about this part (from the 3rd to the 5th January 1945, on a little new map) and then the bigger scenario using the same map than for the liberation of Strasbourg (from at the earliest on 16th January to the 25th January 1945).

:idea: OperationNordwind01 – Leclerc: (or something similar)

… Well, you’ve got the idea. So, what about this? :?:
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

8) OperationNordwind02 – Strasbourg: (using the map already at disposal, with snow covering all grounds of course! :wink: )

We’ve already these maps as references:
Map 1: (northern parf of Strasbourg) https://www.google.ch/imgres?imgurl=htt ... gJegQIARBK
Map 2: (a bigger view, again on the northern part)
https://www.google.ch/imgres?imgurl=htt ... gMegQIARBQ
Map 3: (bigger again, a view from the southern part too)
https://www.google.ch/imgres?imgurl=htt ... egUIARCfAQ
Map 4: (the southern part, battalions of the French 1re DFL - map near perhaps the middle of the webpage)
http://histoiredevalff.fr/histoire/xxem ... reviennent

We’ve an order of battle here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_ ... n_Nordwind
But, watch out, this one isn’t fully precise enough about the French divisions. Or, at least, it contains one mistake, as we’ve seen that the 3rd Algerian Infantry Division has been sent to the North of Strasbourg!

Now, the point is that the scenarios map doesn’t go enough both North and South to depict exactly historically the Operation Nordwind around Strasbourg… Now, is it a real problem? No, as one could move the frontlines more towards Strasbourg itself, which would be plausible from an historical point of view.
*******
Divisions involved?

We’ve the Strasbourg’s map from the scenario already. First, let’s focus on the N or NE part of it, shall we?

Now, let’s look at map 1 and the battlefront at the 24th January:

We should push this frontline southward (otherwise most of the action won’t be represented during this scenario, which won’t of course be a brilliant idea). Why not, by the way, the Allies made the choice to get back a little, they could have done it a little more as easily.

And if we wish to put our fortresses to use, the battle shouldn’t be too far away either!

Anyway, if we do this, what shall be the new battlefront? Something logical considering our Strasbourg’s map?

First point: Saverne and Strasbourg must be defended, that’s obvious.
Second point: We’ve several US infantry division and one French infantry division at disposal… Now, the divisions between Saverne and Strasbourg, the divisions to be put on the plain, that is… will they be just North or just South of the river (the one which passes south from Saverne and go into the Rhine)? Because we need to have enough room to deploy the various German divisions & because the Allies have chosen anyway some line with some defensive bonuses, then they should deploy SOUTH of this river. This one, even frozen, they have better having it between them and the incoming enemy instead of the frozen river on their own back.
Third point: Now, south of this river, we’ve sectors delimited by roads… I count 3 of them starting NW from Strasbourg and going W towards Saverne.
*******
How many Allied divisions do we have?
Let’s deploy them like this:
1. The 3e DIA just NW of Strasbourg (just south of the river, in this sector delimited by roads).
2. The US 36th Inf Div just W of this French division (idem!)
3. The US 79th Inf Div just W of the 36th (idem!)
4. The US 103rd Inf Div just a little NW of this 79th, and the 103rd tasked with the defense of Saverne (so deployed there and a little as well in the mountainous hexes just north of Saverne).

Like this it should already look like a battleline or something:
From East to West, Strasbourg with its forts and some garrison then 4 Allied divisions more or less in a row until the Vosges mountains and the defended town of Saverne.

No entrenchement, though, or a very light one, as this position is supposed to be quite recent, quite new…

Now, about the Vosges mountains north of Saverne… yes, this little portion of mountains that stands on the very North of this Strasbourg’s map…

To avoid giving a feeling of emptiness related to the NW of the map, one should rather give the feeling that the battleline goes on (as it were anyway, because it’s part of a bigger battle), like this:
5. A part of the US 45th Inf Div (a third to the half, perhaps) deployed on the mountains, only in the western part of these peaks… (so these units + some of the 103rd Div will make a continuous front there as well).

And which division to put facing the South of the map?
6. Well, let’s go for the well-known 1re DFL! (Proof: see map 4!) Where to deploy this last division? Well, do you see the southern limit of the city of Strasbourg? From there, there is a road, an “horizontal” road with 3 flags between the city and the Vosges… there, along this road, near and at these three little villages or town, there they could put a stand!
I think that will nicely complete the Allied defensive land system!

Advantages for the designer (in addition to have a map already done): the OoB for both French divisions is already known (from the Operation Dragoon, the landing in Provence). And the other divisions should have a more or less “standard” OoB (just names of regiments, and so on, to adapt)…
*******
What about the German land troops then?

A) German divisions launching assault on the North, from East to West (again, mostly based on map 1 and on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_ ... n_Nordwind ):

553rd VgD
21st PzD
10th SS PzD (“Frundsberg”)
7th Prcht Div (mostly paratroopers!)
25th PzGD
47th Inf Div
36th VgD
6th SS Mtn Div (“Nord”, mostly Gebirgsjäger!)
-> maybe only a part of this one, and already or partly starting on the mountains, facing the US 45th Inf Div (same principle!)

So, in the North, that’s about 4,5 Allied divisions (+ the forts and a few garrisons units here and there) against 7,5 German divisions…
Yes, it should be a tough battle, but I’m not too worried despite apparent odds:
1. Our forts should prove to be tremendously effective and, thus, shall definitely count on the balance.
2. Maybe 2 of the German divisions could start the scenario like “reserves”, near the frontline, that is, but on a static defensive stance for the first part of the battle. And only after the first maybe 10 turns or something have been played, these two will charge aggressively too… It may make initial turns last less long because that should be less things to process for the computers as well. Gain of time, that is cool.
3. We may even let another division appear, as reinforcement, around the middle of the battle or something, well once the German offensive begin to lack some power, some steam, that is…. See just below: one could consider the 245th VgD as a candidate for this purpose!

*******
From another source: ( http://www.lignemaginot.com/ligne/esch/combats/nord.htm )
The German attack group "Alsace" consisted of the 39th Army Corps with:
-245th "Volksgrenadier-Division" => Another extra division that may be present as reserve OR, rather, that could appear as German reinforcement in the NE as some point, when the German offensive begin to lack some steam… (Or to garrison Kehl, but not working, as this div is from an “attack” group!)
-25th "Panzergrenadier-Division”
-21st “Panzer-Division”
-7th "Fallschirmjäger-Division” => Another indication of the presence of this unit! (Paratroopers, even on land, offer a good variation!)
But there were more “groups” as well, so…
*******
In the South, we’ve one Allied divisions (together with again a few of the forts) to cover the sector… so, to attack from south straight northwards, as units coming from the Colmar pocket, I suggest 1,5 to rather 2 German divisions!

What could we find out? Well, we’ve map 4 to help… but would it be enough?

A little research gives me:

198th Inf Div
In January 1945, the division, in partnership with the 106. Panzer-Brigade Feldherrnhalle, took part in […] an unsuccessful attack on Strasbourg launched from the Colmar pocket. After escaping from he Colmar pocket by crossing the Rhine, the remnants of the division surrendered to the Americans at Weilheim in April 1945.” (translated from https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/198e_divi ... Allemagne) ; more info here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/198th_Inf ... Wehrmacht) )
OoB (from the French version of the Wiki page):
Grenadier-Regiment 305
Grenadier-Regiment 308
Grenadier-Regiment 326
Füsilier-Bataillon 198
Feldersatz-Bataillon 235
Artillerie-Regiment 235
Panzerjäger-Abteilung 235
Pionier-Bataillon 235
Nachrichten-Abteilung 235
Versorgungseinheiten 235

106. Panzer-Brigade “Feldherrnhalle”
(Source: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/106e_Panz ... herrnhalle ; no English equivalent at all this time!!! So, translated part of the French webpage:)
The 106th Armored Brigade Feldherrnhalle was mainly equipped with tanks of the "Panther" type and was composed of the following units:
Panzer Abteilung 2106 (4 companies)
Panzergrenadier Battalion 2106 (5 companies, one of which was equipped with the Jagdpanzer IV tank fighter)
Brigade Einheiten 2106 (brigade units) (including one engineer company)

=> So, this time there will be some nasty Jagdpanzer unit again on the battlefield (and this time facing a French division WITH tanks, so that’s fully meaningful)… :twisted:

And just like this we have our 1,5 German division in the South…

:arrow: On overall, this should already be a huge and very intense battle. And we haven’t talked yet about the air component! :wink:

:D NOW TELL ME, DOES THIS LAND OOB SOUNDS PLAUSIBLE AND GOOD ENOUGH? :?:
Last edited by ColonelY on Fri Jun 04, 2021 6:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
ColonelY
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

About air component, now: :P

On the same day that the German Army launched Operation Nordwind, the Luftwaffe (German Air Force) committed almost 1,000 aircraft in support. This attempt to cripple the Allied air forces based in northwestern Europe was known as Operation Bodenplatte, which failed without having achieved any of its key objectives.” ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation ... ind_(1944) )

Without having achieved any of its key objectives!? :? Well, it may depend a little bit on sources, if we consider (from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Bodenplatte ):
"Results of raid
The results of the raid are difficult to judge given the confusion over loss records. It is likely more aircraft were destroyed than listed. The Americans failed to keep a proper record of their losses and it appears the U.S. 8th Air Force losses were not included in loss totals. When these estimates and figures are added to the losses listed in the table below, it is likely that the correct figures are 232 destroyed (143 single-engine, 74 twin-engine and 15 four-engine) and 156 damaged (139 single-engine, 12 twin-engine and five four-engine). Researching individual squadron records confirms the destruction of even more USAAF aircraft. This suggests at least a further 16 B-17s, 14 B-24s, eight P-51s, and at least two P-47s were destroyed on top of that total. A total of 290 destroyed and 180 damaged seems a more realistic summation than the conservative figures given by the USAAF, RAF, and RCAF. Including the 15 Allied aircraft shot down and 10 damaged in aerial combat, 305 destroyed and 190 damaged is the sum total of the attack.

And if we consider the summary table of the attacked areas, more than 40% of them have been/are seriously damaged. (Near the end of the same webpage about Operation Bodenplatte.)
*******
The Allies should have on overall the air superiority, but the Luftwaffe was still able to engage between 900 to 1’000 airplanes (plus the possible use of many V-2 as well), included several dozens of jets in the mix! :shock:

Example, from the “Mémoires de guerre” of De Gaulle:
"[...] and that General Eisenhower ordered him to withdraw to the Vosges to shorten his front. This decision was made more precise because of an impressive air operation carried out by the enemy. On that very day [January 1, 1945], dozens of jets - the first in the world - had appeared in the Ardennes sky under the sign of the swastika, swept away the American fighters and destroyed many aircraft at their bases. However episodic it may have been, the incident led the general headquarters to a pessimism that was likely to affect Alsace. It was time for me to intervene."

It's well-known that the German were the first to fly in the skies during the Battle of the Bulge once the weather became more clear…
=> For the scenario, :idea: the German should have a clear air superiority (including several units of Me 262 jet :twisted: ) versus only a handful of US fighters. Then should own the sky (despite the weather that may be a little snowy from time to time) from start and, probably a good third or half of the scenario… let’s make the player want to receive some supporting Allied fighters, let’s make him feel this need! :wink:
Then, a bunch of aerial reinforcement should join the fray on the player’s side!
That should increase the difficulty of this scenario and add another dimension to it, and a good one! :D

For example: “On January 23, German jets dropped bombs on Gries, Weitbruch and Kaltenhouse.” ( https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Op%C3%A9ration_Nordwind ) => So, towards the end of the scenario (Operation Nordwind lasted until the 25th of January, historically), there should be another wave of several units of jet!

And THEN we could add something very unique to this scenario, very new… :idea: the JET DUEL! :shock: :lol: :D
:arrow: If we look at the British roster, we see that the have their own model of jet, the Meteor, available from the 20th January 1945. And few days later, we know for sure that there were still some German Schwalbe jets flying over these skies…
So, several units of German jets (perhaps 3) spawning near the end of the scenario. On the opposite side of the battlefield, a few of these brand-new British jets (perhaps 2 – yes, less on purpose! – we should have other kind of air units, dogfighters and so on, by the way, towards the end, including perhaps some cool models: US Black Widow, British Hurricane IID, British Tempest, etc.)
This together with an event when the Meteor do spawn. And, then, no possibility this time of Early Victory… it’s a defensive scenario, we may have to survive long enough. We don’t wand an Early Ending happening BEFORE these jets may have encountered, do we? :wink:
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

January 25, at 11 p.m., according to Hitler's order, the Nordwind operation was stopped.

The reason? The advancement of the Soviet armies on the Weichsel river stop line forced the high command to withdraw, without further delay, the best forces from the western front in order to launch them on the eastern front where the danger was becoming more and more menacing.

The result?
The 25th Panzergrenadier-Division retreated to Wissembourg, then headed for Germersheim, to board trains for Kustrin an der Oder.

(One can imagine the state of disillusionment of the German units and soldiers who were involved in the fighting, often endured in ice and snow, and who had pushed the enemy back towards Strasbourg. All their efforts were destroyed in one fell swoop).

=> If units of the German 25th PzGD are still on the battlefield (if they have not already all died, that is!), then they should withdraw...

If Kehl hasn’t been captured at this time by the player, that should give him some extra steam…
*******
Look at here, at the page 25/36: http://www.france-libre.net/site/wp-con ... e-2014.pdf

There is a telegram of congratulations from General Leclerc to General Garbay dated January 14, 1945

"BRAVO MY OLD MAN - STOP - IN SHORT THE 1ST D.F.L. WILL PROBABLY HAVE SAVED STRASBOURG AFTER THE 2ND D.B. TOOK IT - STOP - I HOPE IT DID NOT COST YOU TOO MUCH - STOP - CONGRATULATIONS FROM ALL OF US "

« BRAVO MON VIEUX – STOP – EN SOMME LA 1E D.F.L. AURA PROBABLEMENT SAUVE STRASBOURG APRES QUE LA 2E D.B. L’A PRISE – STOP – J’ESPERE QUE CELA NE T’A PAS COUTE TROP CHER – STOP – FEICITE TOUT LE MONDE DE NOTRE PART »
ColonelY
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

Between the two scenarios or elements for the briefing or introduction of the second scenario?
( http://www.lignemaginot.com/ligne/esch/combats/nord.htm )
The unexpected American withdrawal:

At the very moment when the two armies began to confront each other, a strategic decision by the American high command would momentarily change the course of the battle.

As the Germans attacked, the American command decided to reorganize the Alsatian front and to abandon Strasbourg. Why was this done?

General Eisenhower, who commanded the invasion forces from his headquarters in Versailles, was a very cautious man. Already during the German offensive on the Ardennes, he had reserved the American 6th Corps for the Haguenau sector, so that he could withdraw it in case of danger.

When the Germans gained ground with their "Nordwind" offensive between Sarreguemines and Bitche on January 1st, 1945, he ordered the 7th US Army to withdraw gradually, until January 5th, the 6th US Corps on the Vosges ridge, and to leave the Strasbourg area.

Following this order, Generals Eisenhower and de Gaulle, (the latter being the head of the Free French government), argued. Strasbourg, which had just been taken back from the Germans by General Leclerc's troops, would therefore be abandoned to them again? This would have been an outrage to France, which is why de Gaulle categorically refused. He protested violently against the abandonment of the city. Churchill came expressly from Paris to negotiate. Eisenhower agreed, albeit reluctantly, that Strasbourg should not be abandoned, and he could not refrain from telling de Gaulle that their situation would be less serious if the French First Army, which was then under the command of General de Lattre de Tassigny, had eliminated the German bridgehead near Colmar. [But we saw already that there was a problem with the air support and ammunition given to the first French army by the Americans...]

De Gaulle replied, he would defend Strasbourg, no matter what, even if the French forces were to operate independently of Eisenhower's orders.

On this, Ike (Eisenhower) retorted that if de Gaulle went that way, the French troops would get neither ammunition nor gasoline, not even a liter! Whereupon, de Gaulle apparently replied that he would prevent the Allies from using the French railroads and all radio frequencies. [We’ll see just a little later what De Gaulle himself has written about this point!]

In the end, each of the men remained on their positions, but in fact, the withdrawal of the American troops was compensated by the installation of the 3rd Algerian infantry division, under the orders of General Guillaume
.”
ColonelY
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

8) De Gaulle how did he live this period?

Again a few (translated) extracts from the “Mémoires de guerre” of De Gaulle (up to the famous meeting between Eisenhower, Churchill and de Gaulle about the fate of Strasbourg!)… :D
Context: At first, just after having inspected the city of Strasbourg despite the German artillery fire, as well as several French divisions, notably towards the Colmar pocket:

"On my way back to Paris, I take stock of my impressions. The army was solid but weary. Alsace was loyal but worried. I concluded that, in the case of an unfortunate event, I would have to intervene immediately and vigorously to prevent serious consequences.

But here is that, precisely, the untoward event occurs. Following the German breakthrough in the Ardennes, the allied commanders decided to evacuate Alsace by withdrawing the Patch army and the de Lattre army to the Vosges. [...]

The evacuation of Alsace, and especially of its capital, might seem logical from the point of view of allied strategy. But France could not accept it. [...] I obviously do not agree to it. The pretext that resignation could draw from the fact that the allied command bears responsibility for military operations has, in this case, no value. For, if the French government can entrust its forces to the command of a foreign leader, it is on the formal condition that the use made of them is in the interest of the country. In the contrary case, it has the duty to take them back. This is what I decided to do, with all the less scruples that the Grand Quartermaster General did not consider it appropriate to warn me of an affair that affects France most deeply.

To tell the truth, despite the silence observed towards me by the allied command, various indications had alerted me. [...] It was necessary to act. ...] to hold the passages of the Meuse, towards Givet, Mézières and Sedan, so that in the event of a sudden retreat of the American forces operating in the vicinity, the French territory would nevertheless be defended. Elements supplied by the interior, summarily armed, it is true, but totaling 50,000 men, were sent to this end immediately to Dody.

[...] That Strasbourg was defended. It is that, first of all, that I had to obtain. To be sure that it would be done, I had no other way than to order it myself to the 1st French army. This army should therefore contravene the instructions of the Allied Command and, in addition, extend its zone of action northward to include Strasbourg, which belonged to the sector of the 7th American Army. If, as I wished, Eisenhower wanted to maintain the military unity of the coalition under his command, he would only have to adopt the change in the measures he had prescribed. On the afternoon of January 1, I sent my orders to General de Lattre. [...]

At the same time, I sent an explicit letter to General Eisenhower. [...] "Whatever happens," I wrote in conclusion, "the French will defend Strasbourg. On the other hand, I telegraphed Roosevelt and Churchill to inform them of the views of the high command as to the evacuation of Alsace, to draw their attention to the very serious consequences that would result for France and to let them know that I did not consent. [...] I then asked Juin to confirm to Eisenhower that France would defend Alsace alone with the means at its disposal. On the other hand, Juin was to announce my visit the next day to the Grand Quartier.

I knew, as well as anyone, that the mission I had set for General de Lattre involved very great risks. [...] However, he would be led to recognize that, in this conflict of duties, the duty to serve France directly, in other words to obey me, far outweighed the other.

Besides, he had prepared himself mentally in advance to do what I prescribed. [...] Also, when de Lattre received, on January 2, my letter that set out his mission, he saw in it nothing but conformity with his own feelings. But he still had the imperative order from Devers to withdraw to the Vosges and to be in the line of battle by the morning of January 5.

General de Lattre answered me on January 3. He communicated to me the text of the retreat order that Devers had given him. He informed me of his intention to bring the 3rd North African Division to Strasbourg, which the 10th Division would relieve on its current positions. However, he seemed to think that the execution of what I had prescribed should be suspended until the Allied high command had given its agreement, alleging "the need to be covered on its left by the 7th American Army" and, also, "the pivotal role that the 1st French Army played in the Allied system".

I was, of course, very anxious that Eisenhower should agree with me. But, whether he was led to do so or not, I intended the French army to do what I had prescribed. A new letter, telegraphed by me to General de Lattre on the morning of the 3rd, clearly stated what had to be done. "I did not appreciate," I wrote, "your last communication... You and the 1st Army are part of the Allied force for the sole reason that the French government has ordered it and only until it decides otherwise... If you had been induced, or if you were induced, to evacuate Alsace, the government could not admit that it would be without a great battle, even - and I repeat - if your left had been, or was, discovered by the withdrawal of your neighbors." At the same time, I wrote to Eisenhower to confirm my decision.

With the responsibilities of the government thus assumed and his will notified, de Lattre at once set about accomplishing what I expected of him. He was going to do it with all his heart and all his ability. [...]

During the afternoon of the 3rd, I went to Versailles. June was at my side. Mr. Churchill had thought he should come, too, alerted by my message and willing, presumably, to use his good offices. General Eisenhower explained the situation, which was certainly serious. He did not hide the fact that the magnitude and vigor of the German offensive in the Ardennes and the sudden appearance of new weapons on the part of the enemy: jet planes, "Panther" tanks, etc., had morally shaken the Allied forces, not without surprising him. Now," he said, "the greatest danger seems to have passed. But we must regain the lost ground and then regain the initiative. I must therefore reconstitute reserves. In Alsace, where the enemy had been extending his attack for two days, the Colmar pocket made the position precarious. This is why I ordered to occupy another one, further back and shorter.

- If we were in the Kriegspiel," I told Eisenhower, "I could prove you right. But I am obliged to look at the matter from another angle. The retreat into Alsace would deliver French land to the enemy. In strategic terms, it would be a mere maneuver. But, for France, it would be a national disaster. For Alsace is sacred to her. As, on the other hand, the Germans claim that this province belongs to them, they will not fail, if they take it back, to take revenge for the patriotism of which the inhabitants have given ample proof. The French government does not want to let the enemy return. For the moment, it is a question of Strasbourg. I gave the 1st French army the order to defend the city. It will do so, anyway. But it would be deplorable if, on this occasion, the allied forces were to be dispersed, perhaps even breaking the system of command practiced by the coalition. That is why I ask you to reconsider your plan and to prescribe yourself to General Devers to hold firm in Alsace."

The Commander-in-Chief seemed impressed. He felt he had to make a principled objection. For me to change my military orders," said this excellent soldier, "you invoke political reasons. - The armies, I answered him, are made to serve the policy of the States. Nobody, moreover, knows better than you that the strategy must embrace, not only the data of the military technique, but also the moral elements. Now, for the French people and soldiers, the fate of Strasbourg is of extreme moral importance. "
On this point, Mr. Churchill agreed. All my life," he observed, "I have been able to see what place Alsace holds in French sentiment. I believe, therefore, like General de Gaulle, that this fact must enter into the game. "
Before coming to my point, General Eisenhower asked me to consider what the situation would be for the 1st French Army if it were to operate independently of the Allied armies. He went so far as to suggest that, in that case, the Americans could stop supplying it with fuel and ammunition. I invited him, for my part, to consider carefully that by allowing the enemy to crush the French troops in isolation, the high command would cause a rupture in the balance of forces that might be irreparable, and that by depriving our troops of the means to fight, he himself would be exposing himself to the risk of seeing the French people withdraw, in their fury, the use of the railways and the transmissions that were indispensable to operations. Rather than imagine such prospects, I thought I should trust General Eisenhower's strategic value and his dedication to the service of the coalition, of which France was a part.
In the end, the Commander-in-Chief agreed with me. He did so with the frankness that was one of the best sides of his sympathetic character, telephoning General Devers that the retreat was to be suspended at once and that new orders would be sent to him. These orders would be brought to him the next day by General Bedell Smith. I agreed with Eisenhower that June would accompany Bedell Smith, which would be an additional guarantee for me and, for the executors, proof that the agreement had been made.
As we sat down to a familiar tea after this heated discussion, Eisenhower told me how complicated his task was, at the height of the crisis facing the armies, by the demands of the various coalition governments, by the shady claims of the different categories of forces: armies, navies, air forces, belonging to several countries, by the personal susceptibilities of his principal lieutenants. At this very moment," he told me, "I am encountering many difficulties on the side of Montgomery, a general of high value, but a sharp critic and a distrustful subordinate. - Glory must be paid for," I replied. But you will be victorious. "On the threshold of the Trianon Hotel, we left each other as good friends.
" :D
ColonelY
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

8) There is here a nice video about Operation Nordwind… well, it’s in French, but there are some very good pictures as candidates for events (printsceen). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmD0m1-590E

If you wish me to translate some part of this video, if it could help, just ask.

:arrow: According to me, here are the main “new” points from this video:
- Thanks to the battle of Metz, the Germans were able to withdraw many of their soldiers and reorganize themselves...
- There were also the movements of civilians trying to leave the areas that the Germans were going to attack... some left in their shirts in the freezing night and the snow... having walked several tens of kilometers… many died...
- The whole area north or northeast of Strasbourg (west of the Rhine anyway) is composed of a plain... no natural obstacle directly... that's why the Germans will arrive there with their Panzers during Operation Nordwind!
- After about 9' of video, there is an inhabitant of Strasbourg who speaks... saying in substance "to have had 6 weeks of freedom after 3 years of continuous pressure and continuous fear, and to believe once again that they are going to come back, it was beyond my strength, it was a panic, a real fear like I have never known before, neither the bombings nor anything, but to know that they are going to come back..."
- The Germans were probably drunk or doped with pervitin (!), the SS fanatics of the potential tiny extra scenario… It is the French who stop them. Ironically, in this sector, it is the Americans who hold the fortifications of the Maginot Line (French base) against the Germans...
- [Around Strasbourg:] ... This was without counting on the determination of the French forces in the area. [...] fight with rage, some groups are even surrounded and sacrifice themselves to slow down the Germans. For the record, the French forces were even reinforced by the gendarmes of Strasbourg to the north. Thanks to the fighting spirit of the French forces [...]
- The Germans sacrificed their last reserves in what was to be the last chance offensive.
- The losses are difficult to evaluate...
- One of the only campaigns of the war that took place on the plain, in the forest, in the mountains and on a major river... a unique geographical dimension and a high number of losses, for a strategic result that was almost nil for the attackers, apart from a few territorial gains... an example of total war that spared neither civilians nor soldiers...
ColonelY
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

Well, I think that's about it for now... 8)

bru888 wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 4:38 pm [...] Fire away, sir. [...]
Phew, done! :D
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

By the way, about the Meteor jets, rather than directly announcing the color of "duel of jets" (as event title or something), one can also play it more subtle: :idea: they indulge in their two main activities which could be to hunt flying V-1s (yes, I know, just outside the area covered by the scenario map :lol: :wink: ) and/or as support for ground strikes ... so they found themselves flying over this battlefield and, oh, what a coincidence :roll: , there are precisely German jets! :twisted: :wink:

(These British jets were flying much sooner than the 20th January 1945, official date of availability in OoB, because they destroyed two flying V-1 the 4th August 1944 already...)
bru888
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by bru888 »

ColonelY wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 6:43 pm Phew, done! :D
Colonel, you know that I appreciate your efforts. Rest now.

Here's the decision on an additional scenario: No. I don't see the value in putting a small scenario in between Strasbourg and Operation Nordwind based on the source material that you provided. Two scenarios in this region are enough.

Here's the decision on the maps: Same map for both Strasbourg and Operation Nordwind. Using the online maps that you linked to, know that my map includes the territory from the green line south to below Strasbourg:

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Also, my map will provide for the smaller attack that comes from the Colmar Pocket (the green oval):

notated south map.jpg
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Here's the decision on the OoB: If I don't put a clamp on it, this scenario will exceed Operation Diadem in the number of units involved. Therefore,
1) Operation Nordwind goes back up to regiment level. Reason: Not only the number of units, but there is not enough space on the map for all of these divisions on a battalion level.
2) As far as the divisions to be included, only those that could have plausibly appeared on this map. Anybody north of U.S. 45th Inf / 6th SS Mtn Div will not be included. Use the maps below for location names:

ALLIED
1. The 3e DIA just NW of Strasbourg (let's say, "near Strasbourg")
2. The US 36th Inf Div just W of this French division
3. The US 79th Inf Div just W of the 36th
4. The US 103rd Inf Div just a little NW of this 79th, and the 103rd tasked with the defense of Saverne
5. 45th US Division tasked with the defense of Phalsbourg
6. And which division to put facing the South of the map? 1re DFL!
7. The 2e DB defending Strasbourg itself. It may not be strictly historical (Oddly, I'm not in possession of any knowledge that pinpoints their whereabouts at this time), but I want to finish up with them in this scenario. It seems like a nice ending for this division.

Note: In the north, the Allied line of defense will be the Saverne Gap, then the Rhine-Marne Canal to the Zorn River, then along that river to Gambsheim. In the south, the Allied line of defense will string from (lightly defended) Mollkirch to Molsheim to Duttlenheim to Strasbourg.

GERMAN (from north)
1. 553rd VGD at Gambsheim (having crossed the Rhine downstream, off map)
2. 21st Panzer south of Bischwiller
3. 10th SS Panzer south of Haguenau
4. 7th Prcht at Brumath
5. 25th PzG between Brumath and Hotchfelden
6. 47th VgD between Hotchfelden and Dettwiller, targeting ?
7. 36th VgD between Dettwiller and Saverne, targeting Saverne
8. 6th SS Mtn in mountains, targeting Phalsbourg and points west of Vosges

GERMAN (from south - special thanks for digging these up)
9. 198th Infantry at Obernai and Uttenheim, targeting Strasbourg
10. 106th Armored Brigade along the Rhine, targeting Strasbourg

Note: Numbers 1 through 5 will target Strasbourg. Number 6 may go for Saverne and then go south. All others targeting as shown.

To see location names, right-click and save these images, then view them full-screen in an image viewer:

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Screenshot 4.jpg
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Here's the decision on German air strength: Yes, it will be considerable and I will mention Operation Bodenplatte as the German's last gasp in the air. This will be a big air battle as well as on land. And yes, the Germans will enjoy air superiority at first, with Allies getting reinforcements periodically.

Here's the decision on a jet duel: No. Including the British faction just for the sake of having Gloucester Meteors in the air over Strasbourg is phony. "The Meteor was initially used to counter the V-1 flying bomb threat" over England. "... the RAF was forbidden to fly the Meteor on combat missions over German-held territory for fear of an aircraft being shot down and salvaged by the Germans." "Judging the Meteor F.3s were ready for combat over Europe, the RAF finally decided to deploy them on the continent. On 20 January 1945, four Meteors from 616 Squadron were moved to Melsbroek in Belgium" which is a long way from Strasbourg and near the end of Operation Nordwind. However, several Me 262s will appear, versus the very latest Allied prop jobs.

Here's the decision on various micro-management and micro-details: As I said for Liberation of Paris, some of the nuances, like withdrawing the 25th PzGD on 25 January and Germans probably drunk or doped with pervitin, will go unused due to designing decisions.

Here's the decision on the fight over the proposed abandonment of Strasbourg: It's already in here as a campaign message between Strasbourg and Operation Nordwind.
- Bru
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by bru888 »

bru888 wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 11:06 pmThe 2e DB defending Strasbourg itself. It may not be strictly historical (Oddly, I'm not in possession of any knowledge that pinpoints their whereabouts at this time), but I want to finish up with them in this scenario. It seems like a nice ending for this division.
The accounts sort of agree that they were in Alsace until February, then they crossed France to Royan on the Atlantic coast, then they re-crossed France and drove into Germany, ending up in Berchtesgaden!

Image0486.jpg
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Image0487.jpg
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All of which I could also do a mini-scenario on, like your action in Moselle, and these would at least have the added benefit of a change in scenery, but I choose not to do so. The campaign is about Free France, not the 2e DB, and it is long enough already.

So, even if we find information to the contrary, we will wind up the 2e DB with them in Operation Nordwind defending Strasbourg from German invasion. A suitable ending for Monsieur Leclerc et compagnie.
- Bru
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by terminator »

Sigmaringen, this could be a good scenario for the future :idea:

Capture.JPG
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The Sigmaringen enclave was the exiled remnant of France's Nazi-sympathizing Vichy government which had to flee to Germany during the Liberation of France near the end of World War II in order to avoid capture by the advancing Allied Powers of World War II. They were allocated the requisitioned Sigmaringen Castle as the seat of their government-in-exile.

The puppet government occupied the castle for seven months with nothing to govern, Philippe Pétain, the head of Vichy France, keeping to himself, while the others wined and dined on unlimited food and drink, and local residents faced wartime rationing.

Document_2021-06-05_091210.jpg
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by bru888 »

terminator wrote: Sat Jun 05, 2021 7:16 am Sigmaringen, this could be a good scenario for the future :idea:
Reminds me of my Castle Itter! :)

Not enough of a battle, I am afraid, but certainly worthy of a wrap-up campaign message toward the end. Will include this, thanks. "Whatever happened to Petain and the Vichy government?" Now we will know.
- Bru
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

Sigmaringen? Very nice, thanks for the information. :D

Not enough fighting? :| To be seen... :wink: In addition to their various divisions, the Germans should have had there as well their Siegfried Line to protect them... ( https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ligne_Sie ... stwall.png )

Well, I like that idea. Personally, :idea: I would see Sigmaringen as a secondary objective in a larger scale scenario. :wink:

:arrow: Finally, we don't have for the moment any scenario on the German territory... :? it would be nice to have at least one (even the last scenario, Authion, is still in France and not in Germany).

Besides, there is plenty of material, even with a victory qualified as forgotten :shock: (forgotten, precisely! :cry: )... See for this purpose the article "1945 - From the Rhine to the Danube with the first French Army, a forgotten victory", from which I will just quote the following passage:
"General de Lattre de Tassigny and his 1st Army had also been part of the success with his brilliant ride during the month of April from the Rhine of Germersheim to the Danube of Ulm and to the passes of the Voralberg. [...]

Once Colmar was liberated and Alsace reconquered, it was a duty for France to enter Germany in force, where its prisoners and deportees were waiting to be freed from the Nazi yoke. Absent at Yalta from the division of the world, our country had to assert itself at all costs, not only as a belligerent country, but also as a victorious nation
."
Source? This is: https://www.anocr.org/1945-du-rhin-au-d ... e-oubliee/

The first French army earned the nickname "Rhine and Danube" because of this. :wink: There are two good maps (source https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/1re_arm%C ... 1944-1945) ) here, in maximum resolution (just click on these pictures!): :D

:arrow: First part(s): https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... uselang=fr

:arrow: Second part(s): https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... uselang=fr

:!: At the beginning, there are relatively few German divisions (though :wink: ) because they have the support of their defensive line. We see that afterwards, new German divisions join them (once the Siegfried Line is broken through, that is)... :D on the whole, this should be enough to offer a very good challenge! :P :wink:
(The Rhine, no longer frozen, was then very difficult to cross... and Allied divisions could very well be deployed, or spawned later during the scenario, ONLY if we're about to really use them, because they were historically involved.)

This is supported by the following map (a little blurred, of course :roll: ) on page 3/11: https://le-souvenir-francais.fr/wp-cont ... horgue.pdf ... where we can see as well Lecerc's famous 2nd armored division in its race towards Hitler's Berchtesgaden - it is one of the three allied units to claim that some of its elements arrived there first!

:arrow: There is certainly something to be done with this southern Germany and perhaps Austria... :idea: and Sigmaringen could very well represent an excellent and immersive secondary objective. :D
Last edited by ColonelY on Sat Jun 05, 2021 12:02 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by ColonelY »

:arrow: It's something to think about, I believe... but there's no hurry :wink: as, for the moment, we're busy with the two Strasbourg-related scenarios! :P :D
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Re: Free France Campaign

Post by bru888 »

24BlackForest

Approximate Black Forest scenario map.jpg
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- Bru
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