Leaders and Generals in their Seventies

Field of Glory: Empires is a grand strategy game in which you will have to move in an intricate and living tapestry of nations and tribes, each one with their distinctive culture.
Set in Europe and in the Mediterranean Area during the Classical Age, experience what truly means to manage an Empire.

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Kerenos
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
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Leaders and Generals in their Seventies

Post by Kerenos » Sun May 02, 2021 11:36 pm

Hello,

Great game by the way. These are just my observations. I noticed that many leaders and generals live well into their seventies. Is this realistic during that age? Reducing it might make it less frustrating in getting rid of bad leaders and generals. For example, in one of my current multiplayer campaigns, as the Romans, my current leader, which I've had for 35 years, has 3 negative traits. He's 60 and in average health. I'll probably have him for another 15 years. In 75 years, I've had a positive trait leader for 3 years or 4% of the time. Reducing the life expectancy and/or how fast their health deteriorates might be something to look at. On an aside, I'm wondering if the chance of getting a positive or negative trait is 50%, as I started another multiplayer campaign where my Roman leader only has negative traits. Is the percentage the same for all factions? I see that other major factions automatically start with leaders with positive traits. Could this also be implemented for the Romans, so that they start on a level playing field with the other factions?

Thanks

Pocus
Ageod
Ageod
Posts: 2812
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:05 pm

Re: Leaders and Generals in their Seventies

Post by Pocus » Mon May 03, 2021 8:05 am

Hello,

Forget about 'average life expectancy', and look more into the old ages reached by many upper class Roman (famous names abound to check that). A quote:
So no, someone at 35 wouldn’t have been seen as an “old person.” “From around the first century B.C. onwards, the age of 60 or 65 was commonly mentioned as the threshold of old age,” writes Karen Cokayne in her book Experiencing Old Age in Ancient Rome. That’s also the age when you got out of previous public obligations, like jury duty (yay!). And if everyone was dead in their 30s, how would justice ever have been served? Exactly.
AGEOD Team - Makers of Empires, ACW2, WON, EAW, PON, AJE, RUS, ROP, WIA.

Pocus
Ageod
Ageod
Posts: 2812
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:05 pm

Re: Leaders and Generals in their Seventies

Post by Pocus » Mon May 03, 2021 8:06 am

That's by the way a quite fascinating subject and I would not be surprised to learn that the wealthy in Rome had a LE near the one we have in our civilization, given we continuously get exposed to chemical substances, too much processed food full of sugar and bad fat, etc.
AGEOD Team - Makers of Empires, ACW2, WON, EAW, PON, AJE, RUS, ROP, WIA.

Kerenos
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Corporal - 5 cm Pak 38
Posts: 35
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Re: Leaders and Generals in their Seventies

Post by Kerenos » Mon May 03, 2021 1:32 pm

Thank you for the quick reply. I am aware of certain individuals living to an advanced age during Roman times. My point is whether the percentage of individuals attaining that age is too high. By turn 100, the majority of my generals will be in their seventies. I know that they were part of the noble class, and therefore would have a better lifestyle, but being on military campaigns for years, should reduce this probability somewhat. Your knowledge in these matters is far greater than mine, but I did find this related to Roman emperors from a discussion at the following link. This game may be emulating the following numbers. I have not looked at the coding. My observations are based on my limited play experience...Thanks

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthre ... oman-class

Here's the list of Roman Emperors that were not assassinated or killed in some way. Info's off wiki, with name, age at death, and cause of death when available. Remember this is not just a "rich Roman" but the EXTREME TOP of the society. So you have to decide for yourself how many years to take away for a general "rich Roman". On top of that, this is also sort of life expectancy of people who survived long enough to actually become emperor... (so I say take a few more years for a general class of society)

Augustus - Age 75
Tiberus - Age 77 (possibily assassinated)
Claudius - Age 63 (possibly assassinated)
Vespesian - Age 69 Intestinal inflammation which led to excessive diarrhea
Titus - Age 41 Illness
Nerva - Age 67 Stroke
Trajan - Age 63 Edema
Hadrian - Age 62 Heart Disease?
Antoninus Pius - Age 74
Lucius Verus - Age 39 Food poisoning/plague/smallpox
Marcus Aurelius - Age 58
Septimius Severus - Age 65 Illness
Gordian III - Age 19 (possibly unnatural causes)
Hostilian - Age 21~ Plague (possibily smallpox)
Valerian - Age 60 (died while in captivity)
Claudius Gothicus - Age 56 Plague (possibily smallpox)
Marcus Claudius Tacitus - Age 76 (possibly assassinated)
Carus - Age 56 death by lightning?
Diocletian - Age 66
Constantius Chlorus - Age 56
Galerius - Age 51 Disease
Constantine I - Age 65 Illness
Constantius II - Age 44 Illness
Jovian – Age 32 (Carbon monoxide poisoning)
Valentinian I - Age 54 Burst blood vessel in the skull while angrily yelling at people
Theodosius I - Age 48 due to Edema
Arcadius - Age 31
Honorius - Age 38 Edema
Theodosius II - Age 49 Riding accident
Constantius III - unknown (birthdate not known)
Marcian - Age 60 Disease (possibily gangrene)
Olybrius - Age 41 Edema
Romulus Augustus - unknown (birthdate not known)
Leo I - Age 73 Dysentery
Zeno - Age 66
Anastasius I - Age 88
Justin I - Age 77
Justinian I - Age 81 (got the plague but survived)
Justin II - Age 58

Total: 39 (unknown age 2, known 37)
Cause of Death
Disease excluding edema and “falling ill” after age 60: 9 or 10 (23~25.6%)
Edema: 4 (10.2%)
Not listed: 10 (25%)

Average life span out of 37 = 57.2 years
Standard Deviation = 16.3
Average life span excluding longest surviving 4 and shortest surviving 4 = 58.4 years

Having 1/4 to 1/3 of natural deaths resulting from some form of disease sounds about right for pre-modern times (did someone say they had great medicine and health care systems back then?).

Pocus
Ageod
Ageod
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Re: Leaders and Generals in their Seventies

Post by Pocus » Tue May 04, 2021 8:22 am

Very detailed, thanks! Age is skewed by non natural death outcome for Emperors. Generals a bit less.

That's partially emulated in the game with increased fate rolls for rulers if your nation is decadent. For leaders, I believe the regions they are in plays a role.
AGEOD Team - Makers of Empires, ACW2, WON, EAW, PON, AJE, RUS, ROP, WIA.

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