Opfire again.

[hidde]

It also looks at chance to kill. If you can;t hurt it you dont fire. The threshold for a kill chance drops as the range decreases. At range 2 or less they always fire if they are able to.

It also looks at enemy chance to hurt you. If the target has a high chance to kill you, you open fire anyway whether you can hurt them or not. No point in saving shots if you are going to be destroyed...

The chance to kill is more influential than the threat from the enemy I gather.
I'm not sure it's the best way. One Hellcat of mine opened fire three times at a Sdkfz (never hit) that is no threat to it. After the Hellcat had wasted all three rounds a Puma could move up and destroy it. One round may be ok but surely it would be wise to spare a round or two in case a real threat show up?

I feel I must take this up once more. Op-fire is better now, no doubt about it but the threat assessment is dubious in my view.
In a game I had two tanks and a gun waiting with three shots each. A Sdkfz moves in sight and all of them opens fire. It took them at least 7 shots to destroy it. It might have been 8 or 9, I can't remember exactly.
Needless to say, the half dozen or so enemy tanks that followed had a field day.

[IainMcNeil]

The issue is what should it do? Ignore the half track because it missed the first 2/3 times? What if there are infantry or AT guns on board and they offload somewhere critical.

We could make it stop firing once the target is suppressed. The issue here is there is still a bit of freedom of movement for suppressed vehicles. We might have to make a unit that becomes suppressed during its move retreat the full extent of its remaining move so you cannot move it again.

[junk2drive]

I still think a dice roll chance for a unit without opfire remaining, to get another shot, would help.

[IainMcNeil]

I dont think this is good plan as it leads to confusion about why units fire sometimes and not others.

[PirateJock_Wargamer]

I like the idea of stopping opfire once target is suppressed - that should limit number of shots it soaks up. If it's hard to suppress there's a good chance it's big and mean (high threat) and you are most likely want it gone/neutralised so put as many shots as it takes into it. If it's easy to suppress (low threat) should take a reduced number of shots to suppress. Though do want to make sure that random chance has a relatively small impact on final result.

Unless you want to include a decision point after each opfire shot - how would that be done? - I can't think of another option; morale is the only indicator we have for unit status - which is good thing when trying to think these things through

Not sure you need to make it retreat automatically as it gives you a chance to finish it off in your turn if it stays put; risking target suppressed opfire at 50% chance reduction.

[IainMcNeil]

There is no way to add decision points as it would completely break multiplayer.

[PirateJock_Wargamer]

There is no way to add decision points as it would completely break multiplayer.

Exactly

[cptkremmen]

I like it the way it is

[hidde]

The issue is what should it do? Ignore the half track because it missed the first 2/3 times? What if there are infantry or AT guns on board and they offload somewhere critical.

We could make it stop firing once the target is suppressed. The issue here is there is still a bit of freedom of movement for suppressed vehicles. We might have to make a unit that becomes suppressed during its move retreat the full extent of its remaining move so you cannot move it again.

Yes, I appreciate it must be difficult to make the balance perfect for every situation...probably impossible. Had to vent a little, is all
But I think you might be on to something with what you suggest about stop firing when target gets supressed. Worth a try...maybe.
Another thing, it seems to me that whatever is riding in a destroyed transport doesn't take a hit to moral. I don't think Ive ever seen infantry do.
Shoulden't there be a chance that they suffer casualties or at least a drop in moral?

[IainMcNeil]

We decided against damaging loaded ssquads as we felt it could hurt the AI too much if it does not disembark early enough. Its very hard for the AI to know when it should jump off as this is very much a look and feel decision for the player and we dont want to over penalise them. We could make it that the AI doesnt suffer these penalties but not too keen on having one rule for them and one for you but it might be ok.

I'll add the suppression stuff to the wish list. I think it would make sense but requires changes to the rules about what a vehicle can do when suppressed.