Strategy for very hard

[anguille]

Hi fellow gamers,

The gap between hard and very hard is HUGE...while i haven't too many problems with the hard setting (but well entertained), very hard is giving me serious headaches. So my question is what is you strategy for that setting?

Cheers

[Redpossum]

I chose "Other"

I don't play on Very Hard, that's my solution

[tex]

Is there a particular battle or battles that give you problems?

[anguille]

Well...various battles are tought on very hard...i am still at the beginning of the campaign...as i said somewhere, i am not sure if i'll keep on that level as it hurts (fighting and losing more than 20 times the same battle can be disastrous for it's own morale )

[tex]

One thing it is easy to overlook (well I often do) is that the ground (rocky / flat/ trees) can have quite an effect on how well units perform. Also it is good to have all your units together with the leader and pick off the enemy units one at a time.

I usually (I have gone through the very hard level several times) disband some units at the start (to get some money back in order to recruit other units) and start with two units of scouts or skirmishers.

After that it is a case of what (and when) you attack and the upgrades and units you purchase. There are certain things I usually do but maybe that is helping too far anad would make the game less enjoyable to you.

I do not claim my approach is the best but it does work (up to the fire devils).

Tex

[couqi]

the only way i know how to play completely throught the very hard level, including Mirthras, is to be very observant and constanly correct for the stupidity of your units, especially the leader/general. otherwise, i can't think of how it would be possible to play through with a large, but weak army. the first time i did it was with ten very strong units. if anyone has made it through with a large, weak army, please inform us.

[sum1won]

the only way i know how to play completely throught the very hard level, including Mirthras, is to be very observant and constanly correct for the stupidity of your units, especially the leader/general. otherwise, i can't think of how it would be possible to play through with a large, but weak army. the first time i did it was with ten very strong units. if anyone has made it through with a large, weak army, please inform us.

Try a combination of strong and weak units. And a lot of very touch-and-go work with the disengage function (usually heavy cavalry). Weak units alone doesn't work, but a combination does.

[honvedseg]

I used two units of Auxilia early on, then added a unit of Aux Cav as soon finances allowed. After adding two more Auxilia and another Cav, I then focused on getting a solid line of 4 Principes. Archers were the next step, followed by more Principes. Except for extra Pila and better bows and arrows, I spent nothing on equipment until I had a solid force of around 10 quality units. I ended up with around 20 units, but a number of those were added right at the end when I had nothing better to spend my Denarii on. 12 units is the limit for many of the scenarios, although it is good to have a unit or two extra for tailoring your force mix to the current map.

The Auxilia are the equal of anything in the early game, and will even chew up and spit out Heavy Spearmen in the open, to say nothing of what they do to them in the rough. Sadly, they gain NO experience against the weak opponents in the first couple of battles. Auxiliary Cavalry are once again superior to the scout and noble cavalry they will face, and I found that a minimum of 2, preferably 4, would suffice to either overwhelm or at least neutralize the opposing mounted units in most cases. Principes give you more "bang for the buck" than the weaker Hastati or the marginally better but much pricier Triarii. These were the core of my army, and pretty much steamrolled everything in their path, except for a rare Spartan or other elite Hoplite or Phalanx unit, which needed to be "prepped" before meeting my line. Archers can easily dominate many of the later scenarios, and I used four of them in concentration against the feared naked Berserkers and other elite units which would otherwise have inflicted high casualties on my own units. Many of the best opposing units never even reached my line. In the absence of a time limit, I was able to draw individual units out of line with archery, then crush them piecemeal with the Principes.

Aside from a few of the "time constrained" scenarios, I had very little difficulty in winning the later battles on the highest setting. The mid-game seemed to be the toughest point. This was definitely a "quality vs quantity" campaign for me, and when my own numbers finally rose to match the opponents', the game got almost too easy, even at "Very Hard".

[couqi]

thank you sum1won and honvedseg for the reasoned and detailed advise. certainly playing the roman campaign with a larger, but weaker per unit army, will work and is more fun than using a small, but stonger per unit army. i am wondering how it would be possible to get thru CoM with a large, but weaker army. the ghost leagions and shadow warriors just chew me up with that type of set-up.

[sum1won]

thank you sum1won and honvedseg for the reasoned and detailed advise. certainly playing the roman campaign with a larger, but weaker per unit army, will work and is more fun than using a small, but stonger per unit army. i am wondering how it would be possible to get thru CoM with a large, but weaker army. the ghost leagions and shadow warriors just chew me up with that type of set-up.

Cavalry are pretty solid against both, especially ghosts, who, if I recall correctly, are rather weak against trample. And there are several tricks for exploiting cavalry, most of which possum has seen in multiplayer.


And if I remember right, shadow warriors have a severe weakness to missle fire., though I could be thinking of a different unit.

[Redpossum]

Man, Shadow Warriors have no weakness at all. They can be hit by missile fire, unlike Ghosts.

Like I was ranting about in that other thread, I am stuck at 2nd Jupiter (IIRC), with an army that contains

3x Aux Cav - L27, L17, and L15
and
4x Aux Archer - L23, L21, L16, L15
(plus a bunch of other stuff I won't detail here)

Even focusing all 4 archers on one unit of Shadow Warriors, the effects were minimal. Not enough to stop them from shredding my Auxilia in under 30 seconds.

and the Ghosts didn't seem very impressed with my Cavalry, either.

I know the cavalry tricks you're referring to, at least I think I know most of them. But they all require some time and room. The Mithras scenarios just don't give you much, if any, of either to work with. Generally the enemies are all over your ass from the very start.

[sum1won]

Man, Shadow Warriors have no weakness at all. They can be hit by missile fire, unlike Ghosts.

Like I was ranting about in that other thread, I am stuck at 2nd Jupiter (IIRC), with an army that contains

3x Aux Cav - L27, L17, and L15
and
4x Aux Archer - L23, L21, L16, L15
(plus a bunch of other stuff I won't detail here)

Even focusing all 4 archers on one unit of Shadow Warriors, the effects were minimal. Not enough to stop them from shredding my Auxilia in under 30 seconds.

and the Ghosts didn't seem very impressed with my Cavalry, either.

I know the cavalry tricks you're referring to, at least I think I know most of them. But they all require some time and room. The Mithras scenarios just don't give you much, if any, of either to work with. Generally the enemies are all over your ass from the very start.

I found some more, which are far nastier, and could be considered exploits, whereas the other ones were simply dirty tricks. Ive seen them rout full units in a charge using this.

[antipasta]

I have (eventually) managed to complete CoM on Very Hard using a Celtic Army once and a Roman Army the 2nd time but basically with a similar army composition

2-3 Units of Light Troops (Auxilia/Warriors)
2-3 Units of Heavy Infantry (Legionaires/Veterans)
2-3 Units of Heavy Cavalry (Auxiliary Cavalry/Celtic Nobles)

6 Units of Archers (Auxiliary Archers/Archers)

I spent NO Denari on my Leader, NONE on the Archers apart from Missile-Specific equipment and ALL on the Melee Units.

750 Upgrades bought were ...
Odysseus Bow for Archers
Ajax Banner, Achilles Armour, Sarmatian Cavalry Armour, Teutonic Horses for all Melee Units (where appropriate).

[Redpossum]

Wait, there's a Mithras campaign at the end of the Celtic campaign too?

Wouldn't that be way harder, since you only have 41 scenarios to develop your army, rather than the 70-some of the roman campaign?

[antipasta]

Is there? I thought that the Mithras Campaign was only an extension to the Roman Campaign. The Mithras Campaign for the Celts allows you to select all available units but it still stops at scenario 41 - at least it did when I played it and after that scenario I was returned to the initial campaign selection screen.

ps
I have just looked onto the web site and on the Cult Of Mithras page ...
"Cult of Mithras bolts on to the end of the Roman campaign."

A pity: will just have to wait for Arcane Legions for a new challenge!

[Redpossum]

Is there? I thought that the Mithras Campaign was only an extension to the Roman Campaign. The Mithras Campaign for the Celts allows you to select all available units but it still stops at scenario 41 - at least it did when I played it and after that scenario I was returned to the initial campaign selection screen.

ps
I have just looked onto the web site and on the Cult Of Mithras page ...
"Cult of Mithras bolts on to the end of the Roman campaign."

A pity: will just have to wait for Arcane Legions for a new challenge!

antipasta, you said above you'd completed CoM with a Celtic army...

[antipasta]

Yes, I played the full Mithras Roman Campaign but with a Celtic Army - I only recruited Warriors, Veterans, Celtic Cavalry and Archers.

I have often selected a DBA composition army at random ( www.dbaol.com or www.fanaticus.org ) and seen how far I can get with them in a particular campaign. Because you are limited to the Squad types available in LA/CoM you have to be a little inventive! For instance if I wanted to play a campaign with a 100 Years War English Army then I would probably recruit Veterans or Triarii as dismounted men-at-arms, Celtic Cavalry as Knights and Auxiliary Archers for my Longbowmen.

There are a number of Armies that are not suitable - mainly "Biblical Era" armies such as Egyptians and Assyrians with their use of Chariots. And you are not going to get very far with the following ...

4a. Early Libyan 3000BC-1250BC
Enemies:2, 3, 8a
Army Composition: 1x3Wb, 11x2Ps

Of course what we all want is for those fine people at Slitherine to add a few hundred more troop types to Legion Arena - Macedonian Hypaspists, Ancient British Chariots, Persian Immortals, Swiss Pikemen, Genoese Crossbowmen, Aztec Warriors and on and on ....

[perry]

Hi - need some feedback on Rome Campaign, at VeryHard settings.


For Heavy Inf, I have bought Triariis. I thought them to be more cost effective than Legionaries (650D instead of 800D).

Now, I wonder if they will last the distance though...What's your thoughts? What's your choice for Heavy Inf at Very Hard?


Cheers

[antipasta]

I had tried very many combinations of units for Roman Armies but the only one that I was able to complete the entire Roman/CoM campaign on Very Hard was ...

Order Unit LevelReached
1 Auxilia 34
2 Auxilia 34
3 Auxiliary Cavalry 37
4 Auxiliary Cavalry 37
5 Legionnaires 30
6 Legionnaires 32
7 Auxiliary Archers 30
8 Auxiliary Archers 29
9 Auxiliary Archers 28
10 Auxiliary Archers 25
11 Auxiliary Archers 24
12 Auxiliary Archers 24

Good luck!

[kongming]

Cavalry are pretty solid against both, especially ghosts, who, if I recall correctly, are rather weak against trample. And there are several tricks for exploiting cavalry, most of which possum has seen in multiplayer.

Like Possum, I have not seen ghost legions be especially impressed with cavalry. There is no cloud of horseshoes when the cavalry charges in. Anyone have definitive info here?