Question about DLC's

MartyWard · Post by **MartyWard** » Wed Nov 09, 2011 2:04 am

Is there any chance the DLC's will be packaged so that you could buy them all in one download?

Post by **admin** » Wed Nov 09, 2011 2:18 am

It is unlikely because there are 7 coming with the initial plan. The permutations would be enormous. There is also no way to deliver a different file - only one file can be delivered per product. It is just the way the system works.

MartyWard · Post by **MartyWard** » Wed Nov 09, 2011 2:28 am

Thanks.

Fimconte · Post by **Fimconte** » Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:09 am

I'm sure it's possible to package all 7(? 1939-1945, that's 6... Oh my...) in one convenient installer as a single "All-in-One" DLC package, so I see this probable once all 7 are released.

rezaf · Post by **rezaf** » Wed Nov 09, 2011 8:33 am

Fimconte wrote:I'm sure it's possible to package all 7(? 1939-1945, that's 6... Oh my...) in one convenient installer as a single "All-in-One" DLC package, so I see this probable once all 7 are released.

Thing is that Slitherine thinks they are smarter than all the other kids on the yard and have come up with this odd system of coupling their patches with the DLC content that no other developer on the planet uses, making what should be a 5MB download a 200MB download.
Yeah, my internet can handle that, and storage isn't much of an issue for me, but it's still worth a facepalm.
It's this system that probably prevents bundling in the future somehow - who knows how this insanity looks in detail...
_____
rezaf

Post by **IainMcNeil** » Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:04 am

We know your view rezaf and we disagree. 20 years of doing this has taught us how things need to be done to avoid issues. We have used your suggested approach in the past and it causes all sorts of issues.

No other publishers are releasing as many uipdates for their back catalogue as we do so they probably dont care about these issues. Many also dont care about customer support at all.

MartyWard · Post by **MartyWard** » Wed Nov 09, 2011 12:52 pm

Fimconte wrote:I'm sure it's possible to package all 7(? 1939-1945, that's 6... Oh my...) in one convenient installer as a single "All-in-One" DLC package, so I see this probable once all 7 are released.

That was sort of what I was thinking, one big expansion pack for $35-$40.

rezaf · Post by **rezaf** » Wed Nov 09, 2011 1:04 pm

iainmcneil wrote:We know your view rezaf and we disagree. 20 years of doing this has taught us how things need to be done to avoid issues. We have used your suggested approach in the past and it causes all sorts of issues.

No other publishers are releasing as many uipdates for their back catalogue as we do so they probably dont care about these issues. Many also dont care about customer support at all.

20 years of being a gamer has taught me how other developers handle this - and there are some that provide extensive patches AND DLC.
The easiest solution is to write an installer that checks the game version and downloads the appropriate patch if a internet connection can be opened and prompts the user if it can't - there you go, 5MB installer and no download if the game is already running a supported version. Terribly hard, huh?
And guess what - loads of developers/publishers do it that way. Guess these guys haven't been in business for 20 years.

But like I wrote, I don't really care all that much, nor do I have strong feelings about the issue. It's just like that old slapstick - I try to warn you not to take seat on the freshly painted white park bench, but you tell me that 20 years of dealing with freshly painted park benches has taught you to always wear a dress with horizontal white stripes when visiting the park. Fair enough, I guess.
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rezaf

Post by **IainMcNeil** » Wed Nov 09, 2011 1:37 pm

It just wont work. Someone buys the game in a box, tries to install it. It needs a patch. They dont have interenet access.

VPaulus · Post by **VPaulus** » Wed Nov 09, 2011 1:45 pm

Still, don't see why are we debating about this.
Slitherine wants to ensure that the DLC also patches the game to the last update, in order that the gamers have less problems when playing.
I'm sure there can be better systems that could be implemented. But probably this is the easiest way to ensure that things are properly updated. This reduces the number of steps for installing and playing the DLC in the case the game is not properly updated. We've to remind that most people just prefers the effortless way.

I personally would prefer that the update should only have those files which were changed or added new and not the entire game.
But I fail to see this an issue for most of us, only for those who might have limited downloads.

rezaf · Post by **rezaf** » Wed Nov 09, 2011 2:07 pm

iainmcneil wrote:They dont have interenet access.

Ah, I can see how your experience from 20 years ago let's you see things this way...

If they'd purchase on CD ... ever see how stuff like DirectX is packaged along on disc in a redist directory? That's how you handle those situations.

Seriously though, we agree to disagree, you think you're right, and it's your call. Not really anything worth arguing about.
Unlike the modding stuff, I roll my eyes when I see the installers with 95% wasted space, click next and forget about it...
_____
rezaf

Fimconte · Post by **Fimconte** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 11:27 am

iainmcneil wrote:It just wont work. Someone buys the game in a box, tries to install it. It needs a patch. They dont have interenet access.

Tries to install what?
The DLCs? How would they get them without internet access?

Unless they were bundled in the box?
And sure, having 6 300mb+(DLC & patch in one file) files on a 4.5gb DVD isn't a issue,
but I don't see how having 1 300mb+(stand-alone patch) file and 6 5mb+(stand-alone DLC) files would be a any different,
with the exception of possibly one (or maybe three, which is still irrelevant when in a sequence of 20-30 clicks) more clicks?

As for people with internet access,
I'm believe it's not hard to make a installer that checks the gameversion and if it's not upto date,
downloads the patch, installs it, then continues with the DLC install.

Kerensky · Post by **Kerensky** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 12:05 pm

I am planning to go on vacation with my laptop. I buy a boxed copy of Panzer Corps and I buy the DLC.
During my vacation, as inevitably happens, I'm bored in my hotel room in the middle of some third world country with no wifi.

How do I download a patch?

That example is a little far fetched, but not impossible. Maybe... someone is deployed in another country as part of military service. I happen to know at least two people who fit in this category. These people have down time and leisure time, can you expect them to always have internet access?

Fimconte · Post by **Fimconte** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 1:44 pm

Kerensky wrote:I am planning to go on vacation with my laptop. I buy a boxed copy of Panzer Corps and I buy the DLC.
During my vacation, as inevitably happens, I'm bored in my hotel room in the middle of some third world country with no wifi.

How do I download a patch?

That example is a little far fetched, but not impossible. Maybe... someone is deployed in another country as part of military service. I happen to know at least two people who fit in this category. These people have down time and leisure time, can you expect them to always have internet access?

Sounds like... You were not Prepared!

In all seriousness,
if you buy the DLC, the download page should have huge red text in bold saying: "Requires patch BlahBlah.BlahOhBlah",
with the patch download link right above/next to/below the DLC download link.

A similar fringe case I can imagine is:
I buy a boxed copy of Panzer Corps and I buy the DLC.
I download and install the first DLC.
Go on my trip, during which I finish the '39 DLC and want to download the '40 DLC, only to discover the hotel has a 50kbps line divide among 20 rooms and that '40 DLC requires 300mb+ of downloading.

Also if you're deployed overseas, and want to download the DLCs while you have limited time and bandwidth access?
Downloading 6x 300mb+ on a 50kbps line when you're limited to 2-4 hours of online time a day?

Obviously military lines are usually quite "wide" and you'll probably be able to download those six files at speeds that hit a cap on the Slitherine side.

VPaulus · Post by **VPaulus** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 1:59 pm

Slitherine is not the only one.
All DLC from ArmA2 come with the updates included in the DLC.
The community around ArmA is 100x bigger than ours. Never read anyone complaining about this in their forums.
This is just the safest way, with the less steps involved, to install and insure that the DLC runs properly.
Aren't we just neatpicking?

Kerensky · Post by **Kerensky** » Fri Nov 11, 2011 5:37 am

Fimconte wrote: Sounds like... You were not Prepared!

I still have my Skull of Gul'dan. Amazing graphic effect on that trinket, no way I'd ever be able to get rid of it.

Seriously though, Slitherine seems to have made up their minds on this, so we're just going to have to accept their decision. Maybe in the future they will provide alternatives, that wouldn't be so bad.

Xitax · Post by **Xitax** » Sun Nov 20, 2011 7:36 pm

Hmm, what if we were offered two packages, one with the patch and one without?

In 3 years when I format/reload, I'm going to install the main game, the current patch, and then the DLCs. How will these installers work when I try to install the DLC when the current game version is higher than the DLC patch version? Does the DLC installer check to see that the current game version is older than the DLC patch version? If not there's going to be a problem.

Post by **IainMcNeil** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 9:33 am

We are only able to supply one file per purchase with the current system. If we can offer more options later this may be possible.

axlroselm · Post by **axlroselm** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:32 pm

i have a slow and limited connection. so downloading a 600mb instead of 10mb is a pain for me. u can put the patch exclusively for the boxed version. but digitalers only get that sexy 10mb DLC.

axlroselm · Post by **axlroselm** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:35 pm

i have another question. why PzC patches are too big. i mean the game is only 600 mb or so! absolutely consider it a noob question, because i dont know the technicalities of patching.