I've been consumed with re-basing for FoGN and decided I needed to play a few games to relearn the rules. With E&E out and my 1806 Prussians ready to go, I decided to play an 800 points game with a Prussian army versus an 1805-07 French infantry corps. The French corps wouldn't exactly be Davout's III Corps but would be similar in that there would be no French heavy cavalry or Imperial Guard.
Armies for the first two games:
Prussian:
Corps Commander - Competent
Advance Guard Division - Skilled
1 small Fusilier unit
1 small musketeer unit + artillery + rifles
1 small average veteran hussar unit + officer
Inf Div #1 - Competent
1 small musketeer unit + artillery
1 small musketeer unit + rifles
1 small average veteran grenadier unit
Inf Div #2 - Competent
1 small musketeer unit
1 small superior drilled grenadier unit
1 small medium artillery unit
Heavy Cavalry Division - Skilled + charismatic
2 small superior veteran cuirassier units
1 small horse arillery unit
French:
Corps - Skilled + charismatic
Inf Div #1 - Competent
1 small average veteran line infantry
1 small average drilled line infantry + artillery
1 small average veteran light infantry
[Bonus unit for winning initiative by 3 points = 1 small average drilled line infantry]
Inf Div #2 - Competent
1 small average veteran line infantry
1 small average drilled line infantry + artillery
1 small average drilled light infantry
1 small superior drilled medium artillery
Mixed Division - Skilled + Charismatic
1 small average veteran line infantry
1 small average veteran light infantry
1 small superior drilled hussars
1 small superior drilled chasseurs
The French won initiative both times. The Prussians deployed with their infantry in the centre, the heavy cavalry to one flank and the advance guard to the other flank. With the advantage of initiative, the French refused the flank facing the Prussian heavy cavalry and massed against the advance guard division. With a 2:1 advantage over the Prussian hussars, the French cavalry could easily suppress Prussian skirmishers giving the French infantry the advantage of numbers and skirmishers on that flank. The game was over before the Prussian heavy cavalry could intervene.
In the Spirit of Auerstadt
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Re: In the Spirit of Auerstadt
So...I re-thought the corps compositions:
Prussians - fewer divisions, fewer infantry, load up the remaining infantry with attachments and more heavy cavalry:
Corps - Competent
Advance Guard Division - Competent
1 small fusilier unit
2 small musketeer units, each with rifles + artillery
1 small average veteran hussar + officer
Infantry Division - Competent
1 small musketeer unit + skirmishers
2 small musketeer units
1 average veteran grenadier unit
1 small medium artillery unit
Heavy Cavalry Division - Skilled
1 small superior veteran cuirassier + officer
1 small superior veteran cuirassier
1 small average veteran dragoons
1 small horse artillery
French - Not a lot of change here except to correct the oversight of only having 2 medium artillery bases instead of the required 4, plus I decided on a proper cavalry division
Corps - Skilled
Infantry Division #1 - Competent
1 small average veteran line infantry
1 small average drilled line infantry + skirmisher
1 small average veteran light infantry
1 small average veteran medium artillery + 1 howitzer
[Bonus unit for winning initiative by 3 = 1 small average drilled line infantry]
Infantry Division #2 - Competent
1 small average veteran line infantry
1 small average drilled line infantry + skirmisher
1 small average veteran light infantry
1 small average veteran medium artillery + 1 howitzer
Light Cavalry Division - Skilled + Charismatic
1 small superior veteran hussar + officer
1 small superior drilled chasseur + artillery
1 small average veteran Polish lancer
The Prussians deployment was similar - advance guard on the left, infantry in the middle and heavy cavalry on the right. The French massed their infantry - and both their artillery units - against the advance guard while the light cavalry was deployed to delay the Prussian heavy cavalry.
On the Prussian let flank the concentrated firepower of the French infantry and "grand battery" annihilated the Prussian advance guard division. On their right flank the Prussian heavy cavalry did get into the fight, but the French light cavalry had the advantage of being uphill. After the first round of combat, the 2nd von Beeren Cuirassiers had been driven back wavering by the successful (disordered) 3rd Hussars but the Prussian Garde du Corps defeated the Polish lancers (both sides were wavering). Taking advantage of the confusion in the ranks of the Garde du Corps, the 16th Chasseurs charged and broke the Prussians. With the loss of their Advance Guard division and the Garde du Corps, the Prussians were defeated....again.
Some pictures at the end of this last game:
The Prussian left flank - except for the Hussars the Advance Guard division is no more, leaving the hussars and a faltering infantry division to hold the line.
The Prussian right flank - the cuirassiers have been driven back, disordering their dragoons and horse artillery:
The surprised victors (notice the Dutch Guard lancers pretending to be Polish lancers):
Prussians - fewer divisions, fewer infantry, load up the remaining infantry with attachments and more heavy cavalry:
Corps - Competent
Advance Guard Division - Competent
1 small fusilier unit
2 small musketeer units, each with rifles + artillery
1 small average veteran hussar + officer
Infantry Division - Competent
1 small musketeer unit + skirmishers
2 small musketeer units
1 average veteran grenadier unit
1 small medium artillery unit
Heavy Cavalry Division - Skilled
1 small superior veteran cuirassier + officer
1 small superior veteran cuirassier
1 small average veteran dragoons
1 small horse artillery
French - Not a lot of change here except to correct the oversight of only having 2 medium artillery bases instead of the required 4, plus I decided on a proper cavalry division
Corps - Skilled
Infantry Division #1 - Competent
1 small average veteran line infantry
1 small average drilled line infantry + skirmisher
1 small average veteran light infantry
1 small average veteran medium artillery + 1 howitzer
[Bonus unit for winning initiative by 3 = 1 small average drilled line infantry]
Infantry Division #2 - Competent
1 small average veteran line infantry
1 small average drilled line infantry + skirmisher
1 small average veteran light infantry
1 small average veteran medium artillery + 1 howitzer
Light Cavalry Division - Skilled + Charismatic
1 small superior veteran hussar + officer
1 small superior drilled chasseur + artillery
1 small average veteran Polish lancer
The Prussians deployment was similar - advance guard on the left, infantry in the middle and heavy cavalry on the right. The French massed their infantry - and both their artillery units - against the advance guard while the light cavalry was deployed to delay the Prussian heavy cavalry.
On the Prussian let flank the concentrated firepower of the French infantry and "grand battery" annihilated the Prussian advance guard division. On their right flank the Prussian heavy cavalry did get into the fight, but the French light cavalry had the advantage of being uphill. After the first round of combat, the 2nd von Beeren Cuirassiers had been driven back wavering by the successful (disordered) 3rd Hussars but the Prussian Garde du Corps defeated the Polish lancers (both sides were wavering). Taking advantage of the confusion in the ranks of the Garde du Corps, the 16th Chasseurs charged and broke the Prussians. With the loss of their Advance Guard division and the Garde du Corps, the Prussians were defeated....again.
Some pictures at the end of this last game:
The Prussian left flank - except for the Hussars the Advance Guard division is no more, leaving the hussars and a faltering infantry division to hold the line.
The Prussian right flank - the cuirassiers have been driven back, disordering their dragoons and horse artillery:
The surprised victors (notice the Dutch Guard lancers pretending to be Polish lancers):
Last edited by shadowdragon on Fri Nov 23, 2012 1:08 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: In the Spirit of Auerstadt
I have found with my Austrians that it takes a fair bit of practise to get the best out of unreformed troops - but it is possible for these armies to do well.
Looking at your reports, it seems like in both battles that the Prussians virtually lost the battle based on being the defender, and their initial deployment.
Perhaps Hohenlohe could try:
1. Deploy back a little, rather than as far forward as possible;
2. Start off with LC and LI in skirmish formation, and rush these forward in the first turn to limit the double moves of the French, before falling back again; and
3. Rather than deploy the divisions linearly across the table, start the cavalry division on your base line in the middle of the table then move to counter whichever flank the French move against. If you have 4 divisions, you could also deploy one of the infantry formations in march column on your table edge as reserves (or perhaps even as an off table reserve?)
Clausewitz wrote a letter to the Prussian crown Prince in 1812 which includes advice on deploying in defence and is well worth a read. See his "General Principals for Defence' at http://www.clausewitz.com/readings/Principles/.
And don't give up, unreformed armies are cool.
Cheers
Brett
Looking at your reports, it seems like in both battles that the Prussians virtually lost the battle based on being the defender, and their initial deployment.
Perhaps Hohenlohe could try:
1. Deploy back a little, rather than as far forward as possible;
2. Start off with LC and LI in skirmish formation, and rush these forward in the first turn to limit the double moves of the French, before falling back again; and
3. Rather than deploy the divisions linearly across the table, start the cavalry division on your base line in the middle of the table then move to counter whichever flank the French move against. If you have 4 divisions, you could also deploy one of the infantry formations in march column on your table edge as reserves (or perhaps even as an off table reserve?)
Clausewitz wrote a letter to the Prussian crown Prince in 1812 which includes advice on deploying in defence and is well worth a read. See his "General Principals for Defence' at http://www.clausewitz.com/readings/Principles/.
And don't give up, unreformed armies are cool.
Cheers
Brett
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Re: In the Spirit of Auerstadt
Thanks for your comments, Brett... the Prussians were deployed back in all games, but I had forgotten that defender's skirmishers can move forward out of their deployment zone. Doh! That makes a difference. Prior to these games my games had been scenario games and had ignored the "Points-based Game" rules.BrettPT wrote:I have found with my Austrians that it takes a fair bit of practise to get the best out of unreformed troops - but it is possible for these armies to do well.
Looking at your reports, it seems like in both battles that the Prussians virtually lost the battle based on being the defender, and their initial deployment.
Perhaps Hohenlohe could try:
1. Deploy back a little, rather than as far forward as possible;
2. Start off with LC and LI in skirmish formation, and rush these forward in the first turn to limit the double moves of the French, before falling back again; and
3. Rather than deploy the divisions linearly across the table, start the cavalry division on your base line in the middle of the table then move to counter whichever flank the French move against. If you have 4 divisions, you could also deploy one of the infantry formations in march column on your table edge as reserves (or perhaps even as an off table reserve?) Clausewitz wrote a letter to the Prussian crown Prince in 1812 which is well worth a read. See his "General Principals for Defence' at http://www.clausewitz.com/readings/Principles/.
And don't give up, unreformed armies are cool.
Cheers
Brett
In defence of the Prussian heavy cavalry, they had a little bit of bad luck against the French lights. They probably shouldn't have gone after them uphill either....but, hey, I was just trying things out to see what would be the outcome of the combat.
I won't give up on the Prussians....I have too many of them and even when they lose their excellent cuirassiers give the French pause for thought.