Allies, who you going to play first?

[Zhivago]

Well the American forces should be a little "green" in comparison. After all the war entry was late and the main combat in european mainland started fro them at a time when british and german and other involved nations had been fighting for years already. So it would be unrealistic for US troops to reach 5 stars with ease when it took the German forces they face 4 years of eastern front to get to that level of experience. So having a little esperience malus compared to British or the opposed germans and italians is something that should be part of such a campaign I think.

I'm not arguing with that--it's just a fact of the Allied Corps game. That's why my core in beta testing was 75% UK, 25% US.

[DeathMutant]

Are there any plans for the Pacific theatre? It could be an interesting mix including some new nationalities (specifically Japanese), with more emphasis on naval involvement and, possibly new terrain types (jungle? shoal? hidden bunker?)

[jaggy]

We have a separate Soviet Corps game still on the planning, The Russians in our eyes deserve their own chapter within the Panzer Corps family, but current Allied is about War on the Western Front, as it is clearly stated in the game descriptions, in the shops, on the websites and in all announcements.

And please, mind your language we like to keep up the level of decency on our forums.

lordzimoa, perhaps umimatsu stated it a little strongly, but based on your previous post in the poll, it was stated that after Allied Corps, it was let's see, no promises, etc. Now, at least, you are a little forthcoming regarding the intention of Soviet Corps. Before, based on the very vague language, one was left with the impression that Soviet Corps was not on the cards.

[PanzerG]

I started with the Brits, and I love it so far

Could not stop till I had won Crete on Fieldmarshall. (Coming from someone who never liked to play the Allies in the old game )
no "Triumph" yet, working on that

Btw: I got an SE Spitfire Mk V after Crete, but, regardless of how often I tried in the previous scenarios, I never got an SE unit.
Is there any info out already on the SE unit limit/availability ?

[Aloo]

Ive got an SE Spitfire after Taranto.

[Zhivago]

I started with the Brits, and I love it so far

Could not stop till I had won Crete on Fieldmarshall. (Coming from someone who never liked to play the Allies in the old game )
no "Triumph" yet, working on that

Btw: I got an SE Spitfire Mk V after Crete, but, regardless of how often I tried in the previous scenarios, I never got an SE unit.
Is there any info out already on the SE unit limit/availability ?

Since there are only about 30 scenarios in Allied Corps, the SE units are dealt out a lot more infrequently. The SE units awarded also tend to be fighter units in my experience (although I did get an SAS troop once). The most SE units I have had in a game thus far is about 3 or 4. Perhaps if Allied Corps gets the DLC treatment and a campaign is possible that way, presumably there would be more SE units awarded.

[danhanegan]

British. {snip} I hope to find more Commonwealth troops in there. The "minor" nations are usually very neglected, despite the fact that the commonwealth nations contributed a lot. {more snipped}

Playing Afrika Korps, I have been struck by the preponderance of commonwealth troops. It took me a while to figure out what all the little flags stood for, someone really ought to post a list for the historically curious. There's still a tri-color flag I am not completely certain of but think is supposed to represent South African troops. Its a little unusual to see an actual union jack marking an objective in the sea of commonwealth flagged objectives. Based on the unit names, mostly the commonwealth troops are infantry, with British troops providing artillery, armor, and air units.

As far as what I'd like to play in Allied Corps, I'd probably want to play American for variety's sake since I've seen so many British in Afrika Korps. Though I'd sure hope to get some British armor (Fireflies!) in my core before D-day.

Can the British in Allied Corps get American tanks at all before US entry? As I recall the Brits had been lend-leased hundreds of stuarts and grants before the Pearl Harbor attack, and quite a few shermans before the Torch invasion set sail.

Its a bit sad we think of shermans as the sucky tanks overmatched by panthers and tigers after D-day. When they were first used in North Africa they were excellent tanks, better armored than the panzer IIIs and IVs that the Germans were using, and making anything the Italians had look truly pathetic.

[Zhivago]

British. {snip} I hope to find more Commonwealth troops in there. The "minor" nations are usually very neglected, despite the fact that the commonwealth nations contributed a lot. {more snipped}

Playing Afrika Korps, I have been struck by the preponderance of commonwealth troops. It took me a while to figure out what all the little flags stood for, someone really ought to post a list for the historically curious. There's still a tri-color flag I am not completely certain of but think is supposed to represent South African troops. Its a little unusual to see an actual union jack marking an objective in the sea of commonwealth flagged objectives. Based on the unit names, mostly the commonwealth troops are infantry, with British troops providing artillery, armor, and air units.

As far as what I'd like to play in Allied Corps, I'd probably want to play American for variety's sake since I've seen so many British in Afrika Korps. Though I'd sure hope to get some British armor (Fireflies!) in my core before D-day.

Can the British in Allied Corps get American tanks at all before US entry? As I recall the Brits had been lend-leased hundreds of stuarts and grants before the Pearl Harbor attack, and quite a few shermans before the Torch invasion set sail.

Its a bit sad we think of shermans as the sucky tanks overmatched by panthers and tigers after D-day. When they were first used in North Africa they were excellent tanks, better armored than the panzer IIIs and IVs that the Germans were using, and making anything the Italians had look truly pathetic.

I believe there are a few smaller US tanks (the M3, M5, base Sherman) that might be available. However, pound for pound, I found myself upgrading in the campaign from the Vickers to the Crusier Mk-1, then Cruiser Mk-4, then Matilda II, then Churchill II, and then Churchill IV. When the Crocodile comes out, then I upgrade the Churchills to Crocodiles. The Crocs don't have the hard-attack punch against armor, but they are absolutely devastating against soft targets like infantry and artillery. Sherman Fireflies are nice too, but have a mediocre soft-target attack. By the time I got to D-Day, I usually had cores with Crocodiles, and maybe one or two Sherman Fireflies, but I also had the US M-18 Hellcat, which is an excellent anti-armor weapon. After that, in later 44 you get access to the M36 Jackson, which is the premier US mobile anti-tank vehicle. Unfortunately the heavy US and UK armor does not become available until very late in 1944 or early 1945. This game really illustrates the historical fact of how inferior Allied armor was for most of the war against the German armor (and Soviet too). The Western Allies were always behind the 8-ball with armor throughout the war until the final months, but by then it was air-power that was the game changer on the battlefield.

Unfortunately, historically the Sherman was a good utility vehicle, but it did not have a powerful enough main gun to penetrate heavy German armor. The German armor could knock out a Sherman tank at three or four times the range that the Sherman's gun had a chance to be effective at. Coupled with its light armor and propensity to blow up after one hit, the Sherman came to be nicknamed the "Ronson lighter", or rolling coffins. The UK had the right idea with heavy armor early in the war with the Matilda, and Churchills/Crocodiles. However, it was not until mid-1944 with the Sherman Firefly that the UK fielded a tank with a hard anti-armor punch. After that, you have to look to the Comet and Tortise tanks, which saw service very late in the war, just like the US M26 Pershing. It would have been interesting if these heavy armor Allied tanks would have been available in 1943. It would have been more of a fair fight. For the most part you have to use strategic bombers on the heavy german armor and then surround them so they cannot resupply, or catch them in a forest, hedgerow, or hill/mountain/city hex with a heavy weapons infantry unit to knock them out.

[KeldorKatarn]

Soviet Corps is, to me at least, a logic last episode on the current engine and series and to be frank after Allied it itches to start soon, but we have so much work, but let us do one step a time. Today Allied Corps is the star, you will enjoy it for sure, and The Russians will get their proper attention in the future.

Glad to read that it is still not the end of PzC 1!

I think there's a lot more that can be done with it

[Zhivago]

Soviet Corps is, to me at least, a logic last episode on the current engine and series and to be frank after Allied it itches to start soon, but we have so much work, but let us do one step a time. Today Allied Corps is the star, you will enjoy it for sure, and The Russians will get their proper attention in the future.

Glad to read that it is still not the end of PzC 1!

I think there's a lot more that can be done with it

Sounds like there will be no Pacific Corps (judging by the arrangement of icons on the opening screen there is space for one more icon (the Red Star) below the Allied (west) icon.

[KeldorKatarn]

Sounds like there will be no Pacific Corps (judging by the arrangement of icons on the opening screen there is space for one more icon (the Red Star) below the Allied (west) icon.

Well THAT would be the easiest problem to solve. But I guess you're right. It's probably the last main campaign. Maybe we'll see some more DLC but from what I remember the devs said that a pacific scenario is definitely an option but better suited for a followup product because it needs certain adjustment in the game mechanics to support better naval combat especially regarding aircraft carriers.

So I guess the pacific theater will have to wait for Panzer Corps II hehe. But I'm hoping we'll maybe see some DLC or other stuff aside from main campaigns for Panzer Corps. Another Grand Campaign, this time from allied perspective or other stuff would be cool. And of course there's still user created content to try out Once Soviet Corps is out this game will have so many scenarios to play it's ridiculous already anyway

[Zhivago]

Sounds like there will be no Pacific Corps (judging by the arrangement of icons on the opening screen there is space for one more icon (the Red Star) below the Allied (west) icon.

Well THAT would be the easiest problem to solve. But I guess you're right. It's probably the last main campaign. Maybe we'll see some more DLC but from what I remember the devs said that a pacific scenario is definitely an option but better suited for a followup product because it needs certain adjustment in the game mechanics to support better naval combat especially regarding aircraft carriers.

So I guess the pacific theater will have to wait for Panzer Corps II hehe. But I'm hoping we'll maybe see some DLC or other stuff aside from main campaigns for Panzer Corps. Another Grand Campaign, this time from allied perspective or other stuff would be cool. And of course there's still user created content to try out Once Soviet Corps is out this game will have so many scenarios to play it's ridiculous already anyway

Agreed...but one solution I have always thought viable for the aircraft carrier is that it have the same properties as a land-based air-strip (meaning that it can re-fuel aircraft on all of its adjacent hexes, and can repair aircraft on the actual aircraft carrier/air-strip hex. It does not seem to be very big obstacle to overcome. Then again, I am not a computer programmer, so I do not know how hard this would be to do.

As far as the DLC treatment for Allied Corps, or Soviet Corps, that is a question whose answer I would like to know. I think it certainly deserves the DLC treatment, but I'm not sure that the devs have the patience to pump them out. Sounds like they are already looking at Panzer Corps 2. However, with all follow-ups, be it in the movies, or music, or anything, there is always the question of whether the follow-up will be as good as the original. I think they have magic in a bottle with this engine. They should be expanding the engine into other historical conflicts...World War I, the Korean War...Vietnam....the Middle East....the US Civil War...etc. I think most Panzer Corps followers (myself included) would buy stuff like that all day long.

[KeldorKatarn]

I think this engine should go good for quite some time to come actually. Yeah Korea might be a nice setting, even vietnam would probably be possible with a few adjustments. WW1 might be difficult but the spanish civil war is a possibility, then there's the Russian Civil war (still a bit difficult because too early). The Winter war which MIGHT have enough for a small campaign. Maybe the Middle east with Israeli forces (although probably not hitting a big audience there). There's certainly stuff that could be done. I dunno. Of course WW2 is a much more marketable setting but I'd say at this point Panzer Corps should have a solid enough player base who's interested in further content even if that content is not in a main stream setting since most of the players are probably fans of historical settings and would find other wars even a refreshing thing. Dunno. Maybe even a complete fresh thing like a remake of Fantasy general maybe? Dunno since that thing probably wasnt very successful but... I'm sure there's more that could be done. Might be called "milking" by some people but I for one would welcome it if this engine was milked a little longer, because with all the upgrades and the new rules and stuff in the editors and scripting, I'm sure there's a lot of cool stuff that could still be done. This engine seems to be very much alive and kicking

[brettz123]

Well the Sherman Firefly is my favorite allied tank so I am starting with the British!

[kbrowne]

I've enjoyed the PzC series immensely so far, but I think the designers really missed it with Allied Corps. My experience has been similar to Zhivago's:

By the time I got to D-Day, I usually had cores with Crocodiles, and maybe one or two Sherman Fireflies, but I also had the US M-18 Hellcat, which is an excellent anti-armor weapon. After that, in later 44 you get access to the M36 Jackson, which is the premier US mobile anti-tank vehicle. Unfortunately the heavy US and UK armor does not become available until very late in 1944 or early 1945. This game really illustrates the historical fact of how inferior Allied armor was for most of the war against the German armor (and Soviet too). The Western Allies were always behind the 8-ball with armor throughout the war until the final months, but by then it was air-power that was the game changer on the battlefield.

I too am using a force that is two-thirds British and rely heavily on Churchills and Mosquitos. I can accept the historical reality that design and doctrine (bifurcation into tank and TD units) limited the usefulness of American armor until very late in the war. It's also the case that many "regular" US infantry units performed poorly (though airborne, Ranger, and select divisions like 1st, 4th, 30th, 80th, etc. performed as well as any Allied formation).

Where I think this expansion gets it way wrong is in how US air power is modeled, and how the unit caps limit the main American advantage vs. the Wehrmacht - the endless supply of fresh/rested divisions. The histories are full of stories about the Wehrmacht literally not moving during the day for fear of the "Jabos" (P47's) tearing up the column. In Allied Corps, the P47 is just slightly less potent than a newborn kitten! As well, American artillery was so plentiful and well-supplied that the stereotype of the US Army was that even the latrine details didn't move until fire support missions commenced. To more accurately model US performance, the game should either raise the unit cap by adding 5 dedicated arty and 5 dedicated air units, and/or automatically restore US unit strength to 10 at the start of each Allied turn.

[Zhivago]

I've enjoyed the PzC series immensely so far, but I think the designers really missed it with Allied Corps. My experience has been similar to Zhivago's:

By the time I got to D-Day, I usually had cores with Crocodiles, and maybe one or two Sherman Fireflies, but I also had the US M-18 Hellcat, which is an excellent anti-armor weapon. After that, in later 44 you get access to the M36 Jackson, which is the premier US mobile anti-tank vehicle. Unfortunately the heavy US and UK armor does not become available until very late in 1944 or early 1945. This game really illustrates the historical fact of how inferior Allied armor was for most of the war against the German armor (and Soviet too). The Western Allies were always behind the 8-ball with armor throughout the war until the final months, but by then it was air-power that was the game changer on the battlefield.

I too am using a force that is two-thirds British and rely heavily on Churchills and Mosquitos. I can accept the historical reality that design and doctrine (bifurcation into tank and TD units) limited the usefulness of American armor until very late in the war. It's also the case that many "regular" US infantry units performed poorly (though airborne, Ranger, and select divisions like 1st, 4th, 30th, 80th, etc. performed as well as any Allied formation).

Where I think this expansion gets it way wrong is in how US air power is modeled, and how the unit caps limit the main American advantage vs. the Wehrmacht - the endless supply of fresh/rested divisions. The histories are full of stories about the Wehrmacht literally not moving during the day for fear of the "Jabos" (P47's) tearing up the column. In Allied Corps, the P47 is just slightly less potent than a newborn kitten! As well, American artillery was so plentiful and well-supplied that the stereotype of the US Army was that even the latrine details didn't move until fire support missions commenced. To more accurately model US performance, the game should either raise the unit cap by adding 5 dedicated arty and 5 dedicated air units, and/or automatically restore US unit strength to 10 at the start of each Allied turn.

I agree with the US airpower needing some tweaking. The P47, also known as the "Jug", was more ferocious as a tactical bomber. The A-10 Thunderbolt took its name in honor of the P-47, and the role it had in WW2. This was how the P-47 was modeled in the original Panzer General too.

Also, the P51 Mustang is relegated to a second-tier fighter, which seems to be at odds with what I know about the Mustang. I would like to see the P-51 pumped up, and the P-47 turned into a tactical bomber

[kbrowne]

The P47 and P51 changes would be a good start, but there is more I would like to see. Allied Corps should portray the epic contest between Germany's qualitative advantage in tanks and infantry and American numbers, planes, and artillery. Fixing the units stats is important, but unit caps and recuperative abilities are equally so.

By summer 1944, Monty was very constrained by the knowledge that he couldn't sustain casualties and while equipment got better, he wasn't going to get many more new divisions. By contrast, the Americans added 40-50 more divisions to Ike's TO&E between Cobra and VE Day, while quickly restoring battered formations to full strength. Despite huge losses of their inferior M4 tanks, American Armored Divisions and Independent Battalions never faced shortages like those their German counterparts faced (Panzer divisions routinely fought at 50% or less of establishment strength). The prestige, unit upgrade, and unit strength/overstrength systems work well in portraying German and Brit forces. To model American (and possibly Soviet) performance, I think they need new systems to suit the history! This expansion could be soooo much better!

[Resolute]

I have to admit that this expansion is not living up to my hopes but that's more due the inherited flaws about the prestige system. When you have a limited number of core slots available you usually aim to get the strongest units which pretty much exludes any units with a low armor rating especially since the German units are so much better. Sure you can use Shermans but they just get wrecked not only costing prestige (which I can live with) but constantly reducing their effectiveness further by losing experience (unless you constantly elite reinforce which is not viable).
There had been a few discussion in the past, where people suggested having certain units take up more core slots or less. I think something like that would have helped to get a more accurate model but I guess that is probably not possible without a complete overhaul of the game engine.

[KeldorKatarn]

Well the new prestige rules should make up for it a little bit no? And also this game still needs to be playable for the average joe, not just for the veterans in this forum. Sometimes I think people here consider themselver the majority and the average skill level in here, the total average. And I think that is far from the truth. Sure it would be cool to have certain options but I think for most people the system is perfectly fine...

[Resolute]

That has nothing to do about making the game harder, it's about giving players more choices. If I could either take one heavy tank or say two mediums ones I might go for the medium ones. Right now you just take usually what's best for the number of core slots you have which comes down to maximum armor rating and even the new prestige system is right step forward, at least in the Allied campaign I do not notice much of a difference in being much limited overstrenthing units.
The game has so many cool units, AT are one my favourite ones e.g., but the game in its current incarnation just does not offer enough in order to really strive for a balanced force. I mean how many player actually have been using a Hetzer in their core force? This just an example but I hope you know what I am getting at.
Sure you can beat the game with a historical force or play useing a mod which does model that in a better way but I'd rater have that as a core functionality.