Stalingrad question.

[AgentTBC]

I'm starting the Storming Stalingrad scenario and the objectives confuse me a little. Decisive Victory says "Capture all Objectives" while Marginal Victory says "Capture at least six Objectives". But I only count six objectives in enemy control at the start of the battle. Is the marginal victory requirement actually fewer than six, or is the scenario designed so that the only two results possible are decisive victory or loss?

Also: this map is craziness.

[deducter]

You control three objectives at the start. The three Italian airfields.

If you think that area is safe from attack, however, you will be in for a shock...

Also: this map is craziness.

My thoughts too.

[Kerensky]

The minor victory condition includes your currently controlled victory hexes.

The reason for this is the abundance of Soviet counter-attacks, which if you aren't careful, can actually take some of your starting victory hexes away!

[AgentTBC]

Ah, I thought since the marginal requirements said "capture" six objectives rather than "control" six objectives it meant I had to take away six from the enemy. Thanks for the clarification.

I do see some tricksy Russians hiding in a few places to the west but I have diverted some forces to deal with them. The Italians are not very effective but they do make fine cannon fodder for this process.

[Casaubon]

this scenario is pretty hard, how should I deal with that many russian MP infantry units? I tried to leavy most of my tanks in the core and use pioneers + artillery avoiding open terrain, still it doesnt seem to do the job.

[deducter]

Keep in mind SMG infantry have a CD of 4, but a GD of 6. This means that once fully or nearly fully suppressed, Panzers (especially with +attack heroes) do very well against them. Suppress them with artillery, then hit them with panzers and it can work very well. Also, if you can force some SMG infantry to retreat into the streets (clear hexes), they become very vulnerable. The one drawback with this is that attacking with panzers as opposed to infantry has a higher chance of rugged defense triggering, so they may not inflict as much damage as you might like. Never attack with panzers into unsuppressed infantry in city hexes.

Fallschirmjager are also a good choice, as they have a SA of 6 and an initiative of 4, although they run out of ammo quickly.

[DrkCon]

Fallschirmjager are also a good choice, as they have a SA of 6 and an initiative of 4, although they run out of ammo quickly.

I agree with this as well. I use 4 fallschirmjager units with 2 Grenadier units and Plenty of Arty support. (I just group them into 3 "assault" clusters ) The panzers are broken into groups to support those clusters and can obviously move more quickly if needed to support breaches or prevent breakthru's by the never ending supply of deathwish russians.

[Casaubon]

do you use the italian aux for defending the airfields or what do you use them for?

[AgentTBC]

I used the Italian aux to clear out the Russian partisans around the airfields, with significant air and some artillery support of course. They did manage to truck into the city for some fighting afterwards.

I snarfed a marginal victory and have been greeted by ANOTHER BLOODY STALINGRAD MAP. Oh god. I am forced to use my panzers on city hexes. It's a good thing the AI doesn't know to suppress my artillery support rather than firing at the tanks with their arty or it would be really, really bad.

[Aloo]

In Stalingrad I'm experimenting with the PZIIIN tank and it looks like its doing well:
- it can stand some armor attacks
- it has high soft attack
- it has a close defense of 4

I have 3 of those in my core right now (Stalingrad Docks) 2 of them SE units.

[Casaubon]

I thought of maybe I should use excessive strategic bombing with 5 level bombers. gonna try that tonight. the Panzer IIIN is a nice idea too.

[Anfield]

I agree, I found the PzIIIN useful here too, it seemed to fair much better than other tanks, when I had to use it in a city hex. Its been great support for my infantry in other battles to while the bigger tanks are off fighting other armor units.

[Kerensky]

Yup, this is exactly how the Panzer IIIn had it stats re-designed.
And was that not it's historical role? A well protected, close support tank.

[AgentTBC]

I've only got 1 P3N and don't want to spend the prestige when I've got to prioritize between upgrading to FW190s and saving for Tigers, so it's tough slogging. I'm playing on Rommel for now so I don't have the $$$ to do everything. The P3N I do have is performing nicely, yeah.

[Lamont]

Just out of curiosity, do most people upgrade to heavier/best type of equipment or do most go for the best equipment for the job in general (if one can afford it of course) ? Personally I try to have a big pletora of different Pz's , infantry, artillery and so on and not only go for the best brutes all the time. I find it more interesting that way and sometimes I pay for it but hey, its part of the choice one make. A real sucker for trying out most equipment in games like this, I love it.
There is always a few gems hidden around wich is fun.

Although I still find that StuG's and the Hertzer isnt at all what I expected a dissapontment for sure.

[Casaubon]

I play the exact same style as you & keep cheap stuff in a big reserve and use only partially the most advanced equipment. for example 2 of my SE are plain Wehrmacht inf. this way I could train a core of 80 units (with about 70 heroes) throughout the GC until mid 42. now as it gets tougher my reserves are down to 65 units, many experienced did not leave stalingrad alive.

[deducter]

Just out of curiosity, do most people upgrade to heavier/best type of equipment or do most go for the best equipment for the job in general (if one can afford it of course) ? Personally I try to have a big pletora of different Pz's , infantry, artillery and so on and not only go for the best brutes all the time. I find it more interesting that way and sometimes I pay for it but hey, its part of the choice one make. A real sucker for trying out most equipment in games like this, I love it.
There is always a few gems hidden around wich is fun.

Although I still find that StuG's and the Hertzer isnt at all what I expected a dissapontment for sure.

I too find it more enjoyable to play with a variety of units.

The StuG series is great, I'm certainly pleased with them. The StuG IIIB is great at suppressive fire, while the StuG IIIF and especially StuG IIIG are awesome AT weapons.

[MartyWard]

Just out of curiosity, do most people upgrade to heavier/best type of equipment or do most go for the best equipment for the job in general (if one can afford it of course) ? Personally I try to have a big pletora of different Pz's , infantry, artillery and so on and not only go for the best brutes all the time. I find it more interesting that way and sometimes I pay for it but hey, its part of the choice one make. A real sucker for trying out most equipment in games like this, I love it.
There is always a few gems hidden around wich is fun.

Although I still find that StuG's and the Hertzer isnt at all what I expected a dissapontment for sure.

I too find it more enjoyable to play with a variety of units.

The StuG series is great, I'm certainly pleased with them. The StuG IIIB is great at suppressive fire, while the StuG IIIF and especially StuG IIIG are awesome AT weapons.

[brettz123]

Just out of curiosity, do most people upgrade to heavier/best type of equipment or do most go for the best equipment for the job in general (if one can afford it of course) ? Personally I try to have a big pletora of different Pz's , infantry, artillery and so on and not only go for the best brutes all the time. I find it more interesting that way and sometimes I pay for it but hey, its part of the choice one make. A real sucker for trying out most equipment in games like this, I love it.
There is always a few gems hidden around wich is fun.

Although I still find that StuG's and the Hertzer isnt at all what I expected a dissapontment for sure.

I haven't found that this play style is worth doing. I find that the best vehicles are usually pretty obvious. Pz-IV f2 then Tigers and Panthers. For instance I don't see any real advantage to having a PZ-III N over a PZ-IV f2. The only unit I take now that I didn't before is the Wurfrahmen 41 though with an SA of 20 it isn't much of a hidden gem . I tried STuGs and thought they were horrible compared to a panzer (of any kind really).

[brettz123]

I play the exact same style as you & keep cheap stuff in a big reserve and use only partially the most advanced equipment. for example 2 of my SE are plain Wehrmacht inf. this way I could train a core of 80 units (with about 70 heroes) throughout the GC until mid 42. now as it gets tougher my reserves are down to 65 units, many experienced did not leave stalingrad alive.

From a pure effeciency point of view having too many units in your CORE is a bad idea. This is because heroes are given out based on the number of kills your unit has. So you are eligible for your first hero at 100 kills, second her at 400 kills, and your third and final hero after 1000 kills. By having 70+ units in your CORE you will end up having less heroes in the long run. It also dilutes your experience.

I find that having some extra units is a very good idea. For instance at the end of my first run through of DLC 41 I still had maybe 10 units extra in my CORE but never anything close to 80. So I ended up with a two strategic bombers, around five or six extra tanks, and two other airplanes that I could swap in and out depending on the scenario. By 42 with the ability to upgrade to the PZ-IV f2 these extra tanks became obsolete. For instance your captured matildas, KV-2s, char-b1s, and T-34s are no longer better than your PZ-IV f2s so it becomes less important to keep them around.

Basically the problem you will have is that your CORE will never be better than someone elses CORE if you keep swapping units in and out. No I'm not saying you can not win like that but I have a feeling you will run into some problems in the later years when it really helps to have high experience units with two or three heroes. Now I do plan on adding more units once the ones I have now get their third hero. At that point I will just max out their experience and then let them sit out every once in a while so I can get another unit the experience.