Soviet Corps questions

[Longasc]

I just finished the "Winter War" scenario in Finland and realized, Allied Generals was according to Moby Games released in 1995. So I played that 21 years ago already... I felt impressed and old at the same time.

I like the scenarios and balance so far, some kickass scenario design, I hope but am quite sure this trend will continue.

The Winter War map was apparently 100% lifted from Allied General, but balance wise it felt easier. Was it the 1.20 rules, me having gained some experience in 20 years of PG mechancis, or was the scenario reduced in difficulty?
I like it more as it is, I remember cursing a lot when playing the Finland scenario in PG.

Some more questions:
1. Ski Infantry. Just flavor or special movement capabilities?
2. Should I bother getting an airforce early on? Cannot deploy them in the first turns of the next scenario, and I now what is to come historically.
3. Are there SE units in Soviet Corps? How many can be got? Got none so far.
4. Are units hidden in towns like in the Grand Campaign DLCs?
5. Any nasty future surprises you want to tell me about?

Thank you!

[RVallant]

1. No idea didn't notice - I basically went for a minor victory on that and didn't even push the line. Double/quadruple artillery was flat out ridiculous and I wasn't going to waste my men's lives. >_>

2. Eh, I would be extra selective on the air force early on. I'd say, maybe one TAC bomber for early on but the majority should be fighter planes. As you already know, Finland is mostly snowing, so the air force is a bit pointless there. The mission after, you're on the defence and need the air war to be won, it doesn't really allow for the use of STR bombers at that mission because it's a wide-open field. TAC bombers maybe, but then you have to justify spending money on them, when a nice tank would do the world of good defending out in the open like that. And a tank+AA = a suitable, cheaper combination early on.

3. I hear there is, but I haven't gotten far yet.

4. As above.

5. No.

[terje439]

2. Should I bother getting an airforce early on? Cannot deploy them in the first turns of the next scenario, and I now what is to come historically.
3. Are there SE units in Soviet Corps? How many can be got? Got none so far.
5. Any nasty future surprises you want to tell me about?

Thank you!

2. It seems that the concept is "do not get attached to your units" I think fighters+AD units should do you good. Wish I bought some AD atleast. Your fighters and bombers are chewed up by the 109F the Germans will field later on, and they do not shoot down alot while being chewed at. ADs on the other hand deal some 2-4dmg to the Fritz.

3. Just got my first one (after the mission after Finland). An infantry unit. Sadly the USSR infantry at this time is meh at best

5. Yeah, remember how you feared the USSR T34s in the original game? Or the KVs? Yeah...And keep your tanks WELL away from those 88s ^^

[sinbuster]

Here's a question for someone who might now:

I completed the Silver Fox scenario and received some train units as reserves for the next, Moscow mission. What's exactly the purpose of these? Do they have units in them or something?

[Schotte]

You can use the train units only for blocking the germans. So you can better concentrate your other troops to stop the german assault. They are very helpful

[sinbuster]

That's rather cheeky

Never used them for the Moscow mission - I much prefer a KV1. I think they're still in my reserves list so maybe I'll use them for some kamikaze scouting or some such.

Edit: Just curious, what happens when you take out the camouflaged reconnaissance unit on the preceding mission (Smolensk)? I didn't have any AA units and my MiGs never stood a chance against that 15-strength escort BF109.

[okiemcguire]

Using the trains as a blocking is a good idea. However, I would rather deploy other combat units when given the opportunity. In my case, I disbanded them for the prestige.

The escorted Stuka can be worth nearly 3000pp. Use three fighters. The first fighter (only) will be fired on by the escort fighter and then you can attack the Stuka with the remaining units. (PS.. this was a lesson I learned from another user)

[terje439]

The trains did absolutely nothing, but they did not cost any deployment points either...

[Kevin2k]

1. Ski Infantry. Just flavor or special movement capabilities?

There is a new entry for "Ski" in movement.pzdat.

[nikivdd]

I just finished the "Winter War" scenario in Finland and realized, Allied Generals was according to Moby Games released in 1995. So I played that 21 years ago already... I felt impressed and old at the same time.

I like the scenarios and balance so far, some kickass scenario design, I hope but am quite sure this trend will continue.

The Winter War map was apparently 100% lifted from Allied General, but balance wise it felt easier. Was it the 1.20 rules, me having gained some experience in 20 years of PG mechancis, or was the scenario reduced in difficulty?
I like it more as it is, I remember cursing a lot when playing the Finland scenario in PG.

Some more questions:
1. Ski Infantry. Just flavor or special movement capabilities?
2. Should I bother getting an airforce early on? Cannot deploy them in the first turns of the next scenario, and I now what is to come historically.
3. Are there SE units in Soviet Corps? How many can be got? Got none so far.
4. Are units hidden in towns like in the Grand Campaign DLCs?
5. Any nasty future surprises you want to tell me about?

Thank you!

1. I think that has already been covered
2. Yes, a couple of fighters and bombers will make a difference when Tigers and Panthers appear and the even better Luftwaffe fighters. The first year of the war is the toughest to keep your airforce alive.
3. If i recall, 3-4 SE units
4. No, but that doesn't mean you won't be able to "snatch" something
5. German panzers can be devastating if you don't scout properly. The most nasty surprise i encountered were those battle-hardened panzers in the Kursk scenario.

Good luck playing Soviet Corps

[RVallant]

I just finished the "Winter War" scenario in Finland and realized, Allied Generals was according to Moby Games released in 1995. So I played that 21 years ago already... I felt impressed and old at the same time.

I like the scenarios and balance so far, some kickass scenario design, I hope but am quite sure this trend will continue.

The Winter War map was apparently 100% lifted from Allied General, but balance wise it felt easier. Was it the 1.20 rules, me having gained some experience in 20 years of PG mechancis, or was the scenario reduced in difficulty?
I like it more as it is, I remember cursing a lot when playing the Finland scenario in PG.

Some more questions:
1. Ski Infantry. Just flavor or special movement capabilities?
2. Should I bother getting an airforce early on? Cannot deploy them in the first turns of the next scenario, and I now what is to come historically.
3. Are there SE units in Soviet Corps? How many can be got? Got none so far.
4. Are units hidden in towns like in the Grand Campaign DLCs?
5. Any nasty future surprises you want to tell me about?

Thank you!

1. I think that has already been covered
2. Yes, a couple of fighters and bombers will make a difference when Tigers and Panthers appear and the even better Luftwaffe fighters. The first year of the war is the toughest to keep your airforce alive.
3. If i recall, 3-4 SE units
4. No, but that doesn't mean you won't be able to "snatch" something
5. German panzers can be devastating if you don't scout properly. The most nasty surprise i encountered were those battle-hardened panzers in the Kursk scenario.

Good luck playing Soviet Corps

RE: point 2.

I felt kinda cheesed off in the pocket mission. "You may deploy your airforce now" = 3 units only. >_>

And they get shafted 1-3 in the numbers games (MiGs - best ones in terms of initiative). Really horrid. However, the ground war is hilarious! Soviet tanks > ze Germans. All those days suffering at the hands of the Soviets, and now I get to use their fancy tools. /sigh. (Their infantry is absolute turd though...)

[Rayrard]

Just finished Smolensk, which was tricky and I had to restart as I had little on the southern front and the Germans flooded through and overwhelmed the southern units.

You have to use the airforce sparingly and I have not deployed a bomber since Finland (unit slots are too precious). I have 3 fighters at 2 star and 12 strength now and they can hold out against 2 109 attacks now (3 would be lucky). I have 2 85mm AD and the self-propelled 75mm gun. They are very useful and the former can double as ground defense.

I am at Silver Fox and haven't been offered a SE unit yet, and have not captured a unit.

Biggest surprise so far is the amount of idle German units at the end of scenarios. They don't use a good portion on their troops it seems. Smolensk had over 20 units left, including 4 pzIII's in the rear completely immobile. This might sound like a good thing, but they will prey on any unit you send out to outlier cities in search of prestige!

[Longasc]

I can confirm you can get SE units. Even a SE KV-2 with 5 shots. I didn't get it though, just wanted to know what come after Bialystok... erm sorry. Never could write the name properly. The scenario after Winter War, the town near Minsk...

I replayed the scenario mentioned above. I am out of practice and it isn't too easy, unless you don't mind taking quite some losses.

My personal advice: GET FLAK. And shoot the fighters. The Stukas can take a Flak beating, the fighters not. Their fighters are superior to yours, but your fighters are more than good enough to kill the Stukas. So my plan was to destroy the fighters with flak so that my fighters stay alive to kill their Stukas. Shooting at the Stukas often resulted in zero damage to the Stukas.

[Longasc]

BTW, what are your thoughts on KV-1, KV-2 vs T34/40 early on.

The upgrade path of the KV-1 isn't clear to me, the KV-2 is afaik a dead end. The T34 seems to have the most future upgrade potential, but I found the KV-1 to be very much superior so far.

[nikivdd]

BTW, what are your thoughts on KV-1, KV-2 vs T34/40 early on.

The upgrade path of the KV-1 isn't clear to me, the KV-2 is afaik a dead end. The T34 seems to have the most future upgrade potential, but I found the KV-1 to be very much superior so far.

After Minsk i have 4 KV-1s, the rest are T-34s. T-34 have decent upgrades throughout the campaign, and are much cheaper. The KV-1s are upgraded to IS-1 as soon as it is available. KV-1s are superior and good in defensive missions and breaking through the frontline (especially the mission where we have to save the paratroopers) but after Stalingrad, they served most of their usefulness as German panzers become superior. T-34s are much more interesting in offensive missions since they are much more maneuverable than the KV-1C and KV-2. It is also worth exploring the self-propelled AT-1s, i have a couple in my core and are much more capable than its German counterpart, the Pzjäger. In the later years of the war, the AT-1s can be upgraded to formidable panzer killers.

[McGuba]

3. Are there SE units in Soviet Corps? How many can be got? Got none so far.

The first can be added in the Smolensk scenario. Later on you can get more and more. By the Battle of Debrecen (Hungary) in late 1944 you can have four and that is the maximum number of SE units you can get in this campaign.

BTW, what are your thoughts on KV-1, KV-2 vs T34/40 early on.

The upgrade path of the KV-1 isn't clear to me, the KV-2 is afaik a dead end. The T34 seems to have the most future upgrade potential, but I found the KV-1 to be very much superior so far.

As it stands now, all the T-34 and all the KV-1 suptypes are in the same upgrade family so can keep them up to date cheaper by always upgrading to the latest. The KV-1 is stronger early on, but it will slowly get outdated as the war goes on. Especially its main gun (attack value). Also, when you go to the offensive the superior speed of the T-34 might get handy. So in the end the KV-1 will be a dead end, too. But still, you will need a few of them to win the early- midwar scenarios.

Unfortunately, the KV-1 and its historical replacement, the IS-1/2 are not in the same upgrade family, so you will have to pay a full price when you will want to upgrade to them. To make it even worse, currently even the KV-85 is in a different upgrade path than the KV-1. I do believe that the KV-1/KV-2/KV-85/IS-1/IS-2 should all be in the same upgrade path, as it would make some sense, but they are not, unless you edit the equipment file.

[Longasc]

Thanks for your input, guys.

McGuba, might just be an oversight? I quite agree that at least the KV1,KV2 and KV85 should be in an upgrade path. The IS-tanks actually, too. Successors in all but name. Funnily what I appreciate about the KV-1s (11 ammo!) is absolutely not there in the IS-series (3,4,5 or so ammo. Mixing up Panzer Corps and Panzer General in my memory right now!).

Now reading up about the Battle of Smolensk, actually my plan was NOT to replay any battle, but I am just not that good anymore. My 2nd run of Bialystok turned out much better

[Rayrard]

That's odd. If the T-34/85 is in the same path as the other T-34's, I'd assume the KV-85 would be with the KV-1.

Tried a stand-alone scenario to check out the late war equipment. The "trick" at the end of the Western Allies scenario was a excellent way to take care of that horde of western tanks! Even the awesome IS-3's were starting to weaken by the end and I was running out of prestige!

[goose_2]

I just have to make a comment as I am just getting started on Summer Offensive in the game and I was part of the beta testing.

That balanced scenario was quite a fun little sandbox that created a lot of heart ache for me and the developer Uran21.

I have to say I am only on the first day but I love, love, love the final product they came up with.

So well done and tremendous set up.

Daddy very happy.

Thanks for creating such a fun sandbox for me to play in.

[Longasc]

Made it through "Smolensk" without major problems, also noticed KV-1B become available, and they are quite a handful for the German tanks.

Also noticed for the first time ever that KV-2 can switch to artillery mode.

The scenario is rather a prestige gainer, now let's see, judging from the campaign tree the choice is if I want to play Arctic/Silver Fox or go straight to Moscow.

EDIT: Just read goose, yeah, Uran is so heavy metal that he makes Lemmy look like a country singer. I appreciate his great scenario design!