My humble thoughts and suggestions for PC2

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wecker
Administrative Corporal - SdKfz 232 8Rad
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My humble thoughts and suggestions for PC2

Post by wecker »

Hello to all,
I rarely speak out in forums, but I feel obliged to do so now😉

I am a 53-year-old veteran who played Panzer General, Allied General and all other General series (except Star General – I quit it after some turns).
I also play Panzer Corps I with all DLCs and love the Grand Campaign.
So, it is no surprise that I also love Panzer Corps 2 and I am eager on all future DLCs – just take my money😉
I would like to share my impressions, thoughts and ideas after finishing the campaign starting from 39 unto the Pacific.
There will be also statements from other colleagues out of the forum or Discord I will support – I hope this will stress the argument. I never played Multiplayer games and never did my own scenarios, so I won’t mention these subjects at all. I understand there is a need for that, and it is good that you try to satisfy those needs.

Now to the real thing:

First let me say thank you – keep on working hard and communicating with your customers.

What is great?
The opportunity to choose scenarios between North and South is ok – but it gives you a rather short campaign. Only one scenario for Norway? Why not start in the North and then continue in the South and the other way round? For the Grand Campaign I would like to see this opportunity. I would also like to see more scenarios – there is no Balkan – no Greece – no Crete? Hope it comes…

The solution to invest prestige to influence High Command was good in PG also – I remember Sealion with the Italian Navy or investing prestige to skip Kiev and attack Moscow directly.

Slots and Overstrenght are really good ideas, but in the late war the newest equipment is too costly.

What is not so great:
I miss the major and minor victories. It was great to win France in PG and then to invade England! And I played France a second time with a minor just to continue in the Balkans and a next time to continue in Africa. This is real good campaign making!
Also loosing gave you in former times a chance – I remember I could go all the way back from Moscow to Italy, Normandy and the Ardennes to reach a truce with the western powers. This was GREAT. Please try this also to implement it in the future.

Immersion:
Speaking of scenarios and the introduction – great briefings, but: there are no videos. Even PG had videos. Is this a technical issue or a financial one with owning rights for videos?

I like it how you built in the point of atomic bombs in the US, but: you could add Oak Ridge in Tennessee and Los Alamos as victory points. If I conquer these spots in time, I get a pop up message: A bomb threat removed or something like that... I mean: you mention it, but you do not continue the story. Speaking of the US: they copied the V1 in 1944, so it is ok if they use them. But me as a german General dont have access to V1 and V2? Why?

And for the de-briefing: it would be nice to see what I had achieved. How many units did I kill/loose in this scenario – and then a sum of all this et the end of the campaign.
Also, what did I achieve strategically? How are other armies in distant war theatres faring? Pop ups like in Order of Battle are very nice.

The end is really sad. You conquer the US and no debriefing? No video with Panzers parading through Washington D.C.? No triumphant marching music? Really sad.
Speaking of further immersion – there are no landmarks besides Mount Elbrus – no Eiffel tower in Paris, no Westminster Palace, no Kremlin, no Pyramids at Kairo. Would it not be an idea to see these landmarks? And if you conquer them you get a slight bonus or a pop up with a photograph (soldiers sitting on the pyramids)?

Heroes:
Speaking of further immersion: heroes are a great feature, but: receiving them at the start of the scenario is – well…
You should get them after a good fight, in the middle or the end of the scenario with a pop up. Soldier X received a medal for bravery and good defence (leading to +3 close defence) or something like that. A short bio would also be great (age, place of birth, rank, etc)

Traits are awesome and sometimes OP. But I miss „all weather“ for aircraft and „plus 1 range“ for artillery. These were crack traits I longed for – and they were usable only by certain units. This I do miss.
I also miss a feature from PG II, a cross, a red star marking a hero in the unit icon on the screen. This helps a lot for identifying heroes in a unit – now I have to paint the unit in a special colour. Also hovering with the mouse over the unit would reveal his traits.

Sound:
The sound is also – hm. Did I miss the Jericho siren? I loved the sound for my 150 mm arties in PG II – when the empty cartridge fell down on the floor. I loved this sound.

Arty:
Speaking of arty – I didn’t get the idea of hard and soft targets. Can you not balance this with a formula? I read the account of Arras and Rommel ordered his troops: shoot with everything you have against the Mathilda’s. That’s natural. He didn’t say: 75mm stop defending your comrades – let them die. A lucky shot is always a possibility, damaging tracks, slowing the advance, that’s the point.
Gerät Karl and Gustav are great, but rather OP.

Supply:
Regarding supply – why do I need this feature? Airplanes get supplied every turn on their airfield which is ok. I only once ran out of ammunition with my Wurfrahmen (except encirclements). In former games you had to stop for one turn, take ammunition, make repairs and then continue with the advance. No it is a empty shell and lost opportunity.

Airplanes:
they seem rather ineffective – especially the Bf 109 – you need four of them to kill one enemy bomber. Hm. They also seem to support only once if the accompanied bombers get attacked.
A feature that I miss is the possibility to setup your airplanes at the airport. I could place a fighter besides a weak bomber to support him – now this is not possible. They return to base in random order. I remember I could bomb a ship at Los Angeles and the next round not – because the bomber was on the other side of the Airport and therefor the ship was suddenly out of range.

AA:
Very good that they all can switch between AA and AT. But without the killer trait almost useless against aircraft, they only suppress and kill only late in the campaign.

AT:
You got to love your 88 – but: why are they not supported by other AT and I am afraid they are not supported by arty? It makes no sense to me - see Rommel at Arras.

Sea Warfare:
U Boats seem a little bit weak – they make rare damage. But they receive damage after every attack and get destroyed pretty fast. No more „evade “?
Capital ships are totally OP. One point left and they are still killers. They burn, they are sinking, the turrets explode and still they do max damage. This seems not right.
Torpedo boats and destroyers of the enemy are also way better than their german counterparts. I dont know whether this was historically truth – I am no expert in marine warfare.
I remember the aircraft carriers of Pacific General. They hat a pop-up desk with separate hangar places for up to 5 aircraft – this was a nice solution. I also remember night and day warfare in the pacific and how I was shocked when I tried to land in the night on an aircraft carrier and loosing half of my aircraft in doing so. You could also attach a fighter permanent to the carrier to intercept enemy aircraft.

I have no comments on tanks, infantry and Recce - they are good as expected. I use only pioneers and nothing else - I don´t know whether this was intended.

Wow – that was a lot.

I hope you Devs are not offended too much, I only want the game to get even better as it is.

Dont forget the DLCs – I bought the Field Marshal edition 😉

Some Ideas:
- Spanish civil war (with option to import core units to the 39 campaign)
- Italian campaign – starting in Abyssinia and Spain, the Balkans, North Africa, defeat in Russia, defeat in Somalia, etc
- Russian campaign (starting in Mongolia and Finland with later possibility to divert to the balkans - Belgrade, Budapest, Vienna). They always said "Do Berlina", but they fought everywhere. Also an end in Manchuria against the Japanese would be nice.
- Japanese campaign (remember Pacific General where you end up uniting your forces with Germany in Persia or you choose the other side and could conquer Australia, Hawaii, California and further to the Mississippi)
- French Campaign starting with loss in France, evacuation from Dunkirk, Norway, Bir Hakheim, Syria, Madagascar, etc.)
- British Campaign - similar to French
- Polish Campaign (Defence against Germany and Soviet Union, way through Persia, to North Africa and Monte Cassino)

Thank you again for your work, your devotion to our common hobby and feel free to comment and share your thoughts.
Horseman
Colonel - Ju 88A
Colonel - Ju 88A
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Re: My humble thoughts and suggestions for PC2

Post by Horseman »

Really well thought out summary there - welcome to the forums.

I too tend to stay away from forums. The Slitherine ones as a whole are my one exception. Tends to be fairly sensible types here.
Retributarr
Lieutenant Colonel - Elite Panther D
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Re: My humble thoughts and suggestions for PC2

Post by Retributarr »

Horseman wrote: Wed May 20, 2020 11:36 am Really well thought out summary there - welcome to the forums.

I too tend to stay away from forums. The Slitherine ones as a whole are my one exception. Tends to be fairly sensible types here.
"Holy-Freaking-Lightening!!!"... {It actually "Struck-Twice!!!"} I am in complete 'Synchronization' and Agreement with both you "Horseman" and you as well as yourself... "wecker"... this is not too... a common occurrence... but a welcomed one!.
Horseman
Colonel - Ju 88A
Colonel - Ju 88A
Posts: 1542
Joined: Sun May 03, 2009 2:27 pm

Re: My humble thoughts and suggestions for PC2

Post by Horseman »

Retributarr wrote: Wed May 20, 2020 4:58 pm
Horseman wrote: Wed May 20, 2020 11:36 am Really well thought out summary there - welcome to the forums.

I too tend to stay away from forums. The Slitherine ones as a whole are my one exception. Tends to be fairly sensible types here.
"Holy-Freaking-Lightening!!!"... {It actually "Struck-Twice!!!"} I am in complete 'Synchronization' and Agreement with both you "Horseman" and you as well as yourself... "wecker"... this is not too... a common occurrence... but a welcomed one!.


It's actually one of the only forums I know of where the Devs actively post and engage with the player base. And they listen to feed back so long as it's constructive and not just "this game sucks hur dur"

I don't know if it's the genre they tend to cater to or what but they seem to draw the (imo) better crowd.
Kerensky
Content Designer
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Re: My humble thoughts and suggestions for PC2

Post by Kerensky »

I'm hoping when they finally reveal the Field Marshal DLC, we can put some of these concerns to rest. We'll see though...

I desperately hope we're not going to see some kind of mere cosmetic DLC in there. Lotta ppl really like Xcom2, but I still remember how poorly received their first run of DLC were... Need something with meat on the bones, it's been a good 2 months since launch!
Wushuki
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
Lance Corporal - Panzer IA
Posts: 14
Joined: Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:38 pm

Re: My humble thoughts and suggestions for PC2

Post by Wushuki »

wecker wrote: Wed May 20, 2020 10:58 am They return to base in random order. I remember I could bomb a ship at Los Angeles and the next round not – because the bomber was on the other side of the Airport and therefor the ship was suddenly out of range.
I think this is a good point. They should change the rules so that it counts the number of hexes from the airport to the target. For aircraft carriers it should use the starting position of the aircraft carrier. That would make a lot more sense to me.

Now you see situations where one fighter can attack an enemy aircraft, but another of the same type cannot due to range limitations despite that they both take off from the same airfield.
Horseman
Colonel - Ju 88A
Colonel - Ju 88A
Posts: 1542
Joined: Sun May 03, 2009 2:27 pm

Re: My humble thoughts and suggestions for PC2

Post by Horseman »

Wushuki wrote: Thu May 21, 2020 4:18 pm
wecker wrote: Wed May 20, 2020 10:58 am They return to base in random order. I remember I could bomb a ship at Los Angeles and the next round not – because the bomber was on the other side of the Airport and therefor the ship was suddenly out of range.
I think this is a good point. They should change the rules so that it counts the number of hexes from the airport to the target. For aircraft carriers it should use the starting position of the aircraft carrier. That would make a lot more sense to me.

Now you see situations where one fighter can attack an enemy aircraft, but another of the same type cannot due to range limitations despite that they both take off from the same airfield.
Yeah I'd much rather they counted the range from the airport itself so at least you could consistantly work out the range of your air support.
Mojko
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Re: My humble thoughts and suggestions for PC2

Post by Mojko »

I would like to add some suggestions:

Phased movement

- instead of an unlimited number of movement actions, limit this to 2 movement actions per turn
- add phased movement to recon planes

Inflexible command

- a new negative general trait
- cost -1
- limits the number of heroes that can be assigned to a unit to 1

Competing leaders

- a new positive trait
- cost 2
- each time you are awarded a random hero, pick one hero out of three random heroes instead
Author and maintainer of Unit Navigator Tool for Order Of Battle (http://mfendek.byethost16.com/)
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