How Disappointing

[Slaarth]

Your point is moot Slaarth as both Blood Bowl and Mordheim are no longer supported by GW. Last time i heard, 40k is...

yes 40k is but Epic 40k has run its course and this game is based on Epic (final liberation)

This is Warhammer 40k Armaggedon, Warhammer 40k isn't Epic, there 2 different games,

I'd agree with you if the game was called Epic : Armaggedon but it's not

[IainMcNeil]

I'm sorry you feel that was Slaarth but at no point did we ever claim this to use the rules from the tabletop game and when asked we have always said it does not. I dont understand why you feel you have been misled in some way. We do not use any stats from the tabletop game. It is a blend of ideas from the tabletop, boardgames and the lore, which often do not match at all! Do you know the difficulty we had to get the map of Armageddon done. We basically had to create it from multiple sources all of which contradicted each other and get the final version approved by the GW team. The level of research that has gone in to this is immense. The team are huge WH 40K fans. I think your criticism is very unfair and based on some assumptions you had going in to the game which we can't really do anything about as we did nothing to create them.

Units have the same roles as in the Tabletop game so strengths and weaknesses are the same but GW absolutely would not allow anyone to do a 1 for 1 copy of their tabletop games. By this I mean WH 40k and WH. Board games are completely different case and this is what you refer to you in your example.

The vast majority of WH40K fans are loving the game based on the hugely positive feedback we have so far. Please try and look at the game as it is designed not as you imagined it might be and you'll have a lot more fun, as the other fans of the setting are.

[Beetlelord]

Could you take your pedantic, whining troll-posts to another forum please?

The game has literally just released, if you were stupid enough to buy a game on release without proper investigation it is your own damn fault.

Are you honestly lambasting this because of the name? Did you not even look at a single screenshot prior to purchase? It has been abundantly clear throughout this has the scale of epic. So take your butthut whining someplace else.

I've also looked at your other posts, almost ALL of your issues are entirely down to personal preference. A game isn't bad just because you dislike the route they've taken. No, it just makes you an entitled brat. Waaah they didn't make the game exactly how I wanted, must forum-rage!

The fact your main point seems to be the most pedantic bitching I've ever seen is hilarious though. They're tricking us by saying this is 40k? If you're stupid enought to instantly buy something because it has 40k in the title, once again, you are an idiot.

And this IS 40k. It's set in the 40k universe. It's about a 40k war. Everything about this is 40k, you just have a really warped personal idea of what constitutes 40k.

The only thing I agree with is poor documentation of the game. That said, and the dev told you this, PzC was patched 20+, this has been out a day and you're whining like a schoolgirl. Get a grip.

Seriously get out or get some arguments that are actually fair and legitimate to level at Slitherine.

[Slaarth]

I'm sorry you feel that was Slaarth but at no point did we ever claim this to use the rules from the tabletop game and when asked we have always said it does not. I dont understand why you feel you have been misled in some way. We do not use any stats from the tabletop game. It is a blend of ideas from the tabletop, boardgames and the lore, which often do not match at all! Do you know the difficulty we had to get the map of Armageddon done. We basically had to create it from multiple sources all of which contradicted each other and get the final version approved by the GW team. The level of research that has gone in to this is immense. The team are huge WH 40K fans. I think your criticism is very unfair and based on some assumptions you had going in to the game which we can't really do anything about as we did nothing to create them.

Units have the same roles as in the Tabletop game so strengths and weaknesses are the same but GW absolutely would not allow anyone to do a 1 for 1 copy of their tabletop games. By this I mean WH 40k and WH. Board games are completely different case and this is what you refer to you in your example.

The vast majority of WH40K fans are loving the game based on the hugely positive feedback we have so far. Please try and look at the game as it is designed not as you imagined it might be and you'll have a lot more fun, as the other fans of the setting are.

Ok, as i've stated before the game as it stand alone could be fun. but using my loving 40k names and official warhammer 40k logo gives it some expectations.

I bought the product off steam, i learned about the game from a steam buddy, one of my blood bowl mates, so i've watched the steam videos i looked at the screen shots and thoughts ok this lots promising.

now when all my blood bowl mates have asked how how do i rate it, i have to tell them if your looking for a 40k game then this isn't for you, if you like tanky games and as some point out a panzer corp mod then sure it's fun.

Your steam info lures in 40k gamers and such with it's 40k tag and no where does it mention anything about this not ebing buy the 40k ruleset and i know EVERY single one of my blodo bowl mates are gonna be pissed if buy this to find out it's not 40k.

I understand all your claims and problems but thats not my problem, i bought a product via the marketing information provided to me via steam and that doesn't mention it's not the table tops rules

Now as for Gw never allowing anyone to do a 1-1 digital copy of there games, i would like to please refer you to Blood Bowl on pc, made by cyanide, you can easy see it on steam
thats is a 99.5% exact copy of the table top, the only reason it's not 100% is 1 rule they force you to use the skill regardless if you woulnd't need to on the 1st action that skill would qualify for, otherwise it's 99.5%

BB2 is coming out and it also follows what is called the living rulebook, if yur guys are such 40k fans as you say then surely one of them is also a blood bowl fan and they are even remotely up to date they can confirm all this.

So to sum up, i was given an idea by the marketing slitherine put on steam to get me to buy a game and now it's not what i expect, anything less than a refund will only tarnish my preception on slitherine considerig i had heard of its name from Deadliest Warrior show, now didn't they put out a game also, Medieval something, it's on steam and it's been on a couple of free weekend. Been meanign to try it out, but after this experience idk if i'd want to play a game with such a negative attitue to it 's paying customers being told sorry your misunderstopod thanks for your cash have a nice daty now the ceo of doing in his pms and posts to my comments.

[Beetlelord]

What the hell are you smoking, you absent-minded sloth?

You haven't been misled. At all. This is a 40k game. It's set in the 40k universe. It's set in a 40k War. It's got 40k races. It's got 40k units. It's got 40k characters.

The fact you bought this expecting TT rules really shows how much of a retard you are. This is not Slitherine's fault, it is your OWN fault for being such an entitled brat.

Go play TT if you want to play TT, don't go accusing developers of false advertising because it's not exactly what you wanted.

Also name me a 40k game that's been released that has TT specific rules. There are none, so tell me why you expected TT rules?

Idiot...

[Slaarth]

Could you take your pedantic, whining troll-posts to another forum please?

The game has literally just released, if you were stupid enough to buy a game on release without proper investigation it is your own damn fault.

Are you honestly lambasting this because of the name? Did you not even look at a single screenshot prior to purchase? It has been abundantly clear throughout this has the scale of epic. So take your butthut whining someplace else.

I've also looked at your other posts, almost ALL of your issues are entirely down to personal preference. A game isn't bad just because you dislike the route they've taken. No, it just makes you an entitled brat. Waaah they didn't make the game exactly how I wanted, must forum-rage!

The fact your main point seems to be the most pedantic bitching I've ever seen is hilarious though. They're tricking us by saying this is 40k? If you're stupid enought to instantly buy something because it has 40k in the title, once again, you are an idiot.

And this IS 40k. It's set in the 40k universe. It's about a 40k war. Everything about this is 40k, you just have a really warped personal idea of what constitutes 40k.

The only thing I agree with is poor documentation of the game. That said, and the dev told you this, PzC was patched 20+, this has been out a day and you're whining like a schoolgirl. Get a grip.

Seriously get out or get some arguments that are actually fair and legitimate to level at Slitherine.

I'm a fan of 40k, it's my only addiction is life. I did check out the screen shots and videos on steam, should i think how can they be screwing me rather of how good the game could be?

didn't realise i had to be a glass i half empty type of person and mis trust everyone till proves otherwise as this is wehat your surely suggesting.


Now as for name, well i'm pretty sure quite a few companies would tell you naming means everything, if you doubt that then obviously you have no marketing experience.

As for this being 40k, your got no idea, just cause it has the 40k names and place doesn';t make it 40k. do you even understand movement and distance in 40k? a guardman man can't move as far as he can fire, hell he can only move as far as he can fire if he's in a transport. so the whole movement and range thing is wrong, but i'm sorry i guess you never played 40k to understand what the game is about or been up to date with all of it's changes in the last 22 years, so i'm sorry buddy but i know what is and isn't 50k so wrong again.

As for being bad cause of the route i think i'm crying over, just how wrong a person can be, i think i wrote in pretty big bold text that as a game stand alone it's playable, could even be fun, But when you place the 40k tag on it, like the 20+ mates who'd asked me on steam today who i find it, as i tell them it's not 40k.

If they buy this thinking it's 40k there gonna be disappointed. So i guess i satify another of your moaning, when you think about it also is pretty stupid considering your whinging about me having a whinge when i've got valid points but cause i haven't pussy fotted around vocing my displeasure you dump me into the catergory of net whinges, when in fact i hardly ever take the time to comment or forum post.

mostly i just say fine, no more money for you, if i make a bad investment or poor choice, but in this case i didn't make a poor choice, i was shown 1 thing and it turned out to be something else, so yeah i thought thats not right, how many others are gonna buy this under marketing information from steam to then find out it's not as displayed?

Or are you one of these money grubbers who's all for ripping people off as long as you make money screw everyone else? Your type are what are destroying countries.

My point is, people need information to make informed decisions about how they spend there money and this isn't being expressed via steam and slitherine is marketing there game through steam thus they have a concern they need to address as it not only makes angry customers but they in turn express to there friends there frustration and that in turn give a company a bad name. Is that what you want for slitherine? I don't think they do.

I don't they want it to be either so sorry if my method of delivery isn't how'd you like, i haven't sworn, i haven't called people names, i haven't bad mouthed the firm or made threats, i've expressed my deep concern that many others like myself are going to buy a product due to label and it's not also hurting slitherine but also the GW name.

[generalgonzo]

What the hell are you smoking, you absent-minded sloth?

You haven't been misled. At all. This is a 40k game. It's set in the 40k universe. It's set in a 40k War. It's got 40k races. It's got 40k units. It's got 40k characters.

The fact you bought this expecting TT rules really shows how much of a retard you are. This is not Slitherine's fault, it is your OWN fault for being such an entitled brat.

Go play TT if you want to play TT, don't go accusing developers of false advertising because it's not exactly what you wanted.

Also name me a 40k game that's been released that has TT specific rules. There are none, so tell me why you expected TT rules?

Idiot...

cool down mate....

[IainMcNeil]

Slaarth this is a warning. If you continue to make unfounded accusations I'll have to take action. Also please no personal attacks on Slaarth, even if you disagree with him.

You have clearly made some incorrect assumptions.

I don't see anyone else saying the same as you here or on Steam. Thousands of people are already enjoying the game, the vast majority of which are huge WH 40k fans. Are they all wrong too?

[Slaarth]

What the hell are you smoking, you absent-minded sloth?

You haven't been misled. At all. This is a 40k game. It's set in the 40k universe. It's set in a 40k War. It's got 40k races. It's got 40k units. It's got 40k characters.

The fact you bought this expecting TT rules really shows how much of a retard you are. This is not Slitherine's fault, it is your OWN fault for being such an entitled brat.

Go play TT if you want to play TT, don't go accusing developers of false advertising because it's not exactly what you wanted.

Also name me a 40k game that's been released that has TT specific rules. There are none, so tell me why you expected TT rules?

Idiot...

Yet how low are people who need to resort to name calling?

Just cause it uses a 40k name or race doesn't mean it's 40K, if you have to have that explained to you then your not worth the effort.

Though to expect a game to use rules that is in it title is retard right, so if i play pool should i expect you to use snooker penalties?

So when they say warhammer 40k, i should just expect something made up that loosely looks kinda sorta maybe a bit like it. An what world do you live on and country as in my country that called false advertising.

Apart from unit and weapon names, this is nothing like 40k at all. the marketing on steam doesn't show anything to suggest it doesn't folow the TT so why should i expect otherwise, your opinion is obviously deluded.

As for TT game thats per the rules, hows that even revelant? Games express exactly what they are, i knew exactly what Dawn of War was when i bought it, same for blood bowl and for Space hulk, exactly as described.

This doesn't

end of discussion with you.

[zakblood]

cant we all just get along, as this is starting to sound like and look like steam forums tbh, and it is near Christmas

no singing mind you, unless your an Orc...

oh and please stay on topic, and no naughties

[Slaarth]

Slaarth this is a warning. If you continue to make unfounded accusations I'll have to take action. Also please no personal attacks on Slaarth, even if you disagree with him.

You have clearly made some incorrect assumptions.

I don't see anyone else saying the same as you here or on Steam. Thousands of people are already enjoying the game, the vast majority of which are huge WH 40k fans. Are they all wrong too?

well all negative reviews on steam atm all point to the same thing, bought the game thinking it was gonna be 40k and it isn't such.

All positive reviews on steam say, how it's rather like panzer corps, an if you like panzer corps then you'd like this. So in essence it's not really it's own game since slitherine also makes that.

As i'm trying to point out, it doesn't matter if people enjoy the game or not, it's marketing. a certain % of consumers bought these game via the steam interface and that doesn't express your not using TT rules and made up your own. Or should people being told 1 thing and getting another should just be happy there's a new game out lossing, roughly based on 40k?

I know personaly, had i know the game was not using the TT rules and still turn based, i'd have waited for reviews and a friends reference.

A roughly kinda like 40k translation isn't what would interest me, so i'm real gripe is how it's being marketed on steam.

As a stand alone game just on game mechanics and game play it's ok game 6.5 maybe 7 out of 10, but as a 40k based game it's rather poor at 3/10 at best.

[Beetlelord]

So you're saying a game that is set in the 40k universe, with 40k races, units & characters is NOT a 40k game unless it follows TT rules?

Yeah. That's what you're saying. That's a stupid statement.

By your own logic here, but W40k: Tabletop is different to W40K: Dawn of War as it is to Blood Bowl.

Just because something has 40k does not meant it HAS to be a specified type of game. At all. It's set in the 40k universe. It's not called Tabletop specifically for no reason, if something doesn't mention tabletop don't expect tabletop.

40k is an Intellectual Property that can be used creatively and artistically, as Slitherine has done.

So deal with your own misguied ideas of what 40k actuallymeans and stop posting.

Also what the hell do you mean by 'standalone game' ? Are you literally saying if they removed 40k from the game title you'd score the game far higher? Because that arbitrary and stupid.

TLDR your issue is that you think 40k means tabletop. It does not. It never has. Stop trying to pretend it has, you made a mistake. Deal with it.

[Slaarth]

So you're saying a game that is set in the 40k universe, with 40k races, units & characters is NOT a 40k game unless it follows TT rules?

Yeah. That's what you're saying. That's a stupid statement.

By your own logic here, but W40k: Tabletop is different to W40K: Dawn of War as it is to Blood Bowl.

Just because something has 40k does not meant it HAS to be a specified type of game. At all. It's set in the 40k universe. It's not called Tabletop specifically for no reason, if something doesn't mention tabletop don't expect tabletop.

40k is an Intellectual Property that can be used creatively and artistically, as Slitherine has done.

So deal with your own misguied ideas of what 40k actuallymeans and stop posting.

Also what the hell do you mean by 'standalone game' ? Are you literally saying if they removed 40k from the game title you'd score the game far higher? Because that arbitrary and stupid.

err perhaps you don't understand 40k is a set of rules for table top, races and such are accesories to the game 40k, So yes even if it uses the race names and charcters and units names and weapon names, if there not remotely like those in TT then it's not 40k, i think of this was WWII hex based tank games with a 40k skins.

does that clear it up for you?

When people say 40k there are expectations, no where are these expectations made clear on steam, from what my group of people can gather it's more a WWII style of turn based game with 40k skins.

If you think otherwise i can't help you but surely someone can who's had medical training might.

[Brachiaraidos]

err perhaps you don't understand 40k is a set of rules for table top, races and such are accesories to the game 40k, So yes even if it uses the race names and charcters and units names and weapon names, if there not remotely like those in TT then it's not 40k, i think of this was WWII hex based tank games with a 40k skins.

does that clear it up for you?

Sorry, but no.

Not even a little. This entire statement is completely wrong and is the basis on why you're mysteriously baffled by the supposed 'misleading' sales that literally nobody else on earth agrees on you about.

Warhammer 40k is an entire line of products, and that includes everything 40k branded. Everything from the books to the models to the old board games is simply a part of the WH40k range.

The tabletop wargame is one part of the 40k Franchise. There are rules for playing games with Citadel Miniatures on the most common scale just as there are rules for playing 40K games on the Epic scale and there are rules for playing with their miniatures in Space Hulk.

Rules for Tabletop are also the least canonical parts of 40k there are. They're a rough representation of how the units would work from a perspective of a tabletop game. The fluff is always more 'accurate' than the codex rules and the two often directly contradict each other anyway.

40k is not implicitly the Heroic Scale Tabletop game. Stop pretending that it is, that's an assumption you made and you have to take full responsibility for.

I've been sold plenty of books with the 40k branding. Should I get a refund because I can't use them like I can use an army in Heroic Scale Tabletop?

[Beetlelord]

You're operating under a false impression.

40k is NOT a set of rules. Tabletop is a set of rules, for a game set in the 40k universe.

Again, 40k is an Intellectual Property from which Games Workshop derive their products.

Considering your expectations were never promised or advertised they are patently absurd and unfair to complain about post-release.

Also I'm struggling to get my head around your basic comprehension of game design. Just because somebody made a WW2 game with this game engine does not mean this type of game engine is ONLY for WW2 games. What made PzC a WW2 game is that it had WW2 units and events in it.

Much the same way as this is a 40k game, despite using the same engine, because it is set in the 40k universe.

Did you experience such crushing false advertising with Dawn of War and Space Marine?

Hell you must have been apoplectic with rage at Space Marine. That was a 3rd person shooter, but it had 40k in the name! Tabletop is not a third person shooter at all, what hideous marketing lies!

[IainMcNeil]

I am locking this because it is getting out of control. Slaarth we welcome feedback but unless your attitude changes to one that is constructive rather than telling everyone else they are wrong you'll have to be banned as its so disruptive to everyone else's enjoyment.